Rural College Student’s Household Registration Dilemma

China household registration booklet/certificate.

From Tianya:

Never thought that going to college for a few years would result in me becoming a [person without a household registration]

[I] don’t know if there are other people like me, from a rural family background, a college graduate, who has lost a part-time job, can’t cut it in the city anymore, returning home [birthplace], hoping to transfer one’s household registration back to the previous agricultural registration, so that this way, even if [I’m] unemployed, there’s still land and a residence that can be relied upon for survival [rural Chinese are given land, unlike city residents]. Who knows, maybe someday [it] will be demolished and one can get some compensation. The result? Household registration cannot be transferred, registration has become non-agricultural!!!

What is non-agricultural? Unable to enjoy the benefits of city registration and not even the basic “rural benefits”.

No land, no residence, no insurance, no welfare, no job. I’m very bewildered, convicts released from labor camps can change their registration back to their birthplace, can even be admitted into village cadres, have land, have money (welfare), have family, have right to vote, have insurance, etc., all sorts of benefits. Yet once we graduate, us rural college students have nothing.

Why are rural kids who have gone to college are stripped of their voting rights and candidacy rights (In 26 years I have not yet seen what a ballot looks like), residence rights (no land for living, uncertain residence), insurance, and a variety of benefits?

If the result of us going to college is no job and no land, then why did we go to college? Could it be to waste the blood and sweat money that [our] parents’ saved up? After going to college, what more did we get compared to migrant workers?

Got a degree? Migrant workers who no longer work anymore still have land when [they] go back, when we go back can we depend on a degree for food? [If we] don’t work, other than going back to face the mockery of the villagers, the sighs and furious scolding for being a disappointment from [our] parents, where is our way out? Wait for old age? Leech off of [our] parents’ two plots of land? Where did our land go?

I don’t know what’s going on with the current policies for residence registration, and I won’t be able to understand, I’m very perplexed: Why can city kids still transfer their registration back to their parents’ side after graduation, why can’t college kids raised in the countryside shift their registration back to the village? Why is there no change to the registration for city kids after graduation, yet the registration for rural kids changes completely upon graduation?

In the past, rural college kids transferred their registration after graduation in order to get assigned a job. According to cadre benefits, shift into grain production, ought to have received land. But now, college is widespread and no one cares if us graduating college students, and specifically those that become unemployed, can’t find a job. We don’t have money to start a business, we are not like the city kids who have connections, have parents, have relatives who can help find a job. Even if we did find a job, the benefits can’t even compare to migrant workers, why must our right to plant crops be revoked?

Are rural college students not supposed to have land rights?

Comments from Tianya:

晓枫残月YJ:

This matter really is a problem, fortunately, my registration was not switched. Right now, my boyfriend’s registration has become a problem, not because of the inability to find a job in the city, but high home prices determined that we cannot live in that big city. Actually, it’s a problem with [my] child’s school enrollment and supporting [our] parents which decided that we could not leave our hometown. We cannot irresponsibly let [our] parents get old, cannot let them get lonely in their later years, so we must return to [our] hometown. Also, China was all along was based on the rule of man and not the law, so being in our hometown feels a little more secure. But when he switched back his registration, [he] could only be designated something called “city resident joint household”, don’t know what it is. Now we have a situation similar to louzhu’s, [we] have nothing, completely marginalized. Painful, now we really regret him having gone out to seek an education!

skydotcn:

Give some money, someone will immediately settle this for you

jenny080886:

Lou zhu, I’m more miserable than you are
I am a woman, my registration has never left, has always been at my old hometown
Then, I got a marriage certificate with someone, and my group (i.e. probably village cadre) reclaimed my fields. Reclaimed in 2001, in 2006 I definitively separated from my husband and took my son back [home], and proceeded to ask the group to give back my fields, but [I] could never get them back.
In 2009, I got the divorce certificate, son’s registration was transferred to my side, but my group to this day is still not willing to allot me my fields and land. This is the reason why I’m left without a household registration, just because I once got a marriage certificate.
Filed a complaint to a government bureau, they said, this type of situation is too common, they can’t deal with it! So-called woman and child don’t even have the most basic rights and have been stripped
Faint, exactly because it’s common, can’t this situation be considered an incident and resolved?
This government, it’s just how it is, the weak are prey to the strong is an unchanging rule

zhengaiwomen:

Highly sympathize with brother, this is where I think the policy sucks, many areas are unreasonable. Would be great if China actually didn’t have the residence register

har19:

Graduated and want to go back to plow fields, really ambitious

蓝灵刺猬:

Sigh, many of my classmates are like this. Fortunately, I was wise back then, didn’t transfer [my] registration. If you’re going to school, just go to school, why transfer registration? Got blindsided, right?

andysue110:

Fucking household registration!
Registration is just forcing you to buy a house, otherwise, it’ll always remain as joint household, which in the end means nothing at all.
Transferred my registration from the village when I started school, back then the school said [I] cannot start if I did not transfer, just like this, I became a person who has half of a registration.
Started working and registration was transferred to a company in Shandong as a joint household. I have resigned for two years now, and it’s still there. Now [I’m] in Shanghai, can’t even begin to think about this.
For the purpose of transferring the registration back to the village, they won’t agree to anything. Even transferring back to the village as a non-agricultural registration is also fucking troublesome. [My] village’s local police station said I have to get back my registration at Shandong before approving the resettlement permit, but in Shandong [they] tell me to get the resettlement permit before giving me the registration. Motherfucker, if it’s like this, where can I go to resolve it? One side wants the registration before processing the resettlement permit, other side wants to see the resettlement permit before [giving back] the registration, this is making me go steal it.
After a while, I will soon be a person without registration. With no clear reason whatsoever, [I] don’t have land anymore, with no clear reason whatsoever, [I] will be a person no one cares about.

海底气泡:

Our batch that transferred our registrations for school have been cheated, cheated in a wretched way
Now there is nothing
In the village, no land. Now, can’t even afford a house in the city
Utterly nothing, so afraid

RAGE登山:

After I die, written in large words on my tombstone will be, I love you China

金华老农:

There was a person above who asked why transfer it out? Because before 2003, it had to transferred to the school, only in 2004 was there a [new] policy allowing oneself to choose whether to transfer or not. There was another person who said transferring it back to the village was for getting land and money. Actually, there aren’t that many places that will give a hand out, other than the villages on the outskirts of a city that have money. Villages that are a little far away from cities and towns basically have nothing to give, the fields were handed out a few decades ago, unchangeable for 30 years. The biggest problem now is that since the child’s registration was transferred to the school, the family is unable to build a new house, [they] can only live in the old mud and wood house. If the child comes back and doesn’t have a fitting place to live and those people who didn’t attend college can build a new house in the village, then the kids who worked hard and got into college are worse off than those who did not attend college.

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43 Comments

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  1. Many are now calling for abolishment of hukou system. Too many issues…I think it will not survive as it is now for longer than 5 years.

  2. Looks like the OP is a whiny little idiot. First he transfered the Hukou to the City to enjoy cheaper school fees and now that he can’t find a job he wants to transfer it back to get free land. You can’t have both of it. City residents without a job don’t get free land either. He should stop whining and trying to find a job. Or jump of a factory building to get some compensation for his farmer parents.

    • Oh, you mean that when he transferred his hukou to the college area, the rural local authorities fully compensated him for the land rights he was thereby foregoing? Sorry, I must have missed that part. Seems that if he never sold his land rights, he’s entitled to something for them now, even if the hukou cannot be re-assigned, or re-purchased.

      I suppose you also would deem jenny080886 a “whiny little idiot” for daring to marry a city resident, whereupon the village cadre apparently absorbed her land too?

      As I understand it (and that’s plenty limited, I admit), it’s always been fairly easy for a city resident to get a rural hukou by giving up their city one. I suppose the louzhu could also do that, the question is the (effectively) stolen land.

      • The Land doesn’t belong to the Villagers in the first place. It belongs to the Government and the Villagers have the right to lease it free of charge for 70 years. If they are giving up their Rural Hukou they are giving up that right. It’s similar with nationalities, if you give up your nationality in favor of an other one, you won’t easily get back the original one.

        • Even if the rural land is leased, as urban land is, there is still a saleable asset, generally passing from rural generation to generation (unless, of course, the local CP cadres want it, to sell it to developers).

          What was annoying about your original post was the gibe at the louzhu. If you gave up your US nationality (to use your fascinating analogy), how would you like to return home, after losing your foreign spouse or job prospect, only to find that the city had also taken your land and your house from you? Proper whiny idiot you’d be then, eh?

          This is pure speculation on my part, but I imagine that if people like jenny080886 and the louzhu want to move to a city, which involves that city in a costly obligation, then the city CP cadres involved contact the rural CP cadres involved and get a compensation payment under the table. The rural boys are gobbling up the land specifically allocated to the person leaving anyway, it would appear, so they could afford it out of that.

          • Pretty funny, B-real, that you’re talking about how the system is flawed, that farmers are essentially powerless to afford themselves any upward mobility, that the supposed upward mobility they do have via scoring well on the gaokao and going to a good college is all a scam, all the while saying that the louzhu is a whiny idiot. At the same time, you’re still able to describe a system where people own the land they live on while the government still collects its revenue, all without an awful system like the hukou which indirectly discriminates who can go to what college based entirely on what region of China they come from.

          • Maybe the US will grant you citizenship again, after you gave it up, but most countries in the EU dont do that. After you switched your citizenship you cant just switch back.

            Back to the land issue. The point is not that the government STOLE the land of the louzhu, with transfering his Hukou from Rural to City, he just lost benefits the City Hukous don’t have in the first place. If you are born with a City Hukou the Government doesn’t grant you free land lease. Are you now saying that the Government STOLE all the land from the City people as well?

            Nobody forced the Louzhu to change his Hukou to a City Hukou, I know quite a few people who still have their Rural Hukous and didn’t see a reason to change them. You can have more than one child with a Rural Hukou as well under certain circumstances.

          • Actually my country gives a shit where you are born. The only things that matters is the blood line. If you are born on the territory or not doesn’t matter at all. So proof of birthplace doesn’t matter at all!

    • I am with you Paul. He is a moron.

      Wonders why he has ended up back in his hometown? Because he is a moron with a moron education, moron “meibanfa” work ethics and wonders why he is stuck in a situation similar to that of the village moron (who happens to have a hukou).

      oooh, I am a whiny little limp wrist moron. Ooooh why can’t I tie my laces by myself?

      …. fail.

  3. Another bureaucratic nightmare from China – why am I not the slightest bit surprised? Do you guys see this kind of thing in your home countries? We do have some awful situations in the US, but nothing quite this irrational, as far as I have heard.

  4. “skydotcn:

    Give some money, someone will immediately settle this for you”

    Exactly.

    The trouble with the hukou system is that it exists at all. It’s an archaic method of controlling the mobility of the population. I wonder why it is that they “need” it in China but we don’t need it in the US?

    • the miracle of communism

    • Because as terrible as the US government has been lately (on BOTH POLITICAL SIDES), the CCP is so incompetent when it comes to properly running things that it makes the US government look fantastic. The hukou is one of their MANY handicaps to allow them to somewhat run the country. Without these handicaps they’d probably collapse in a few years.

    • “The trouble with the hukou system is that it exists at all. It’s an archaic method of controlling the mobility of the population. I wonder why it is that they “need” it in China but we don’t need it in the US?”

      According to Jackie Chan chinese need to be “controlled”, so I guess it is because they are not capable of doing anything on their own?

    • Oh – you got this system in the usa. It is not called hukou, but greencard. It is pretty much the same system like in China. Cheap workers from rural areas are coming to the developed regions for work. The only difference is, that in China they are coming from the western part of the country, and in the USA they are coming from Mexico. So if you call it an archaic method of controlling the mobility of the population, you should change the system in the USA first and give any migrant worker an US citizenship or at least a greencard. Same should apply to the EU – we got or own migrant workers from poor countries like Romania, which usually have no rights at all and are capitalized the whole time.

      • @Beowulf – your analogy between hukou and greencard completely misses the point being made about the situations of the louzhu, and others. No one is saying all the entry permits in the world are wrongful. (Or, at least, that is a very different debate: “How dare you exclude non-residents from picnicking in your gated complex, or beggars from sleeping on your living-room floor, just because you have some legal title to the property in question, blah-blah.”)

        Mexican immigrants to USA, etc., are in general allowed to resume their erstwhile situation, should they so choose. My wife and I are both immigrants to USA, and from different countries at that, but we can both return to our separate countries should we wish to do so, and pick up where we left off.

        The posters here cannot resume their erstwhile statuses, because the props have been removed. And this within their own country too. Perhaps, that is what seems so interesting, and so frightening, to them and to outsiders alike.

        • “My wife and I are both immigrants to USA, and from different countries at that, but we can both return to our separate countries should we wish to do so, and pick up where we left off.”

          The chinese poster above changed his country hukou to a city hukou. Now he wants to change it back and faces problems. It is pretty much the same situation. I am not saying, that the hukou system has no problems – there are a lot of problems, and many things have to change. But the system itself is pretty much the same system, with the difference that it is inside one country. But this country is the size of a whole continent and the size of population is enough for two continents. However, this is not even the most important factor. The most important factor is, that the various regions in the country are in different stages of development. It is like Europe and Northern Africa together or US and middle America together…

          You can curse the hukou system with his many faults – I sometimes do it too, but it is one of the major reasons for the success of Chinas development.

          • beowulf:

            The population of China and the geographical mass of China aren’t factors at all. Likewise, the green card analogy doesn’t apply simply because you’re talking about non-nationals coming to the USA. My original point was that the hukou system is meant strictly to control the mobility of the citizens of the PRC. The US has no comparable system and has never had one.

            During the industrial revolution, there was nothing stopping US citizens from traveling freely without any sort of restrictions to any region in the US. There was no system that afforded local cadres the opportunity to consume a citizen’s land, nor was there a government system of discrimination (besides slavery and Jim Crow, of course) that allowed people from more populous regions of the country to be indirectly prevented from going to better colleges. These have all existed in the PRC since its inception.

            Exactly how has the hukou system aided in the development of China? During the 80′s, those with non-agricultural hukous were able to procure much better employment than those with agricultural hukous. This doesn’t like something that lends itself to sound and expedient development. Even today, anyone will tell you that there are innumerable benefits to having a Shanghai or Beijing hukou and that people pay large sums of money in order to obtain them. It is essentially a form of neo-classism.

          • @Josh – I can not directly reply to your post so I do it this way. I am also already tired, so sorry for any mistakes I make.

            1. The situation between the US during its industralisation and China now is very different. When I remember correctly the US where during that time still a country which welcomed immigrants. China has a lack of many things but not people.

            2. The big difference is, that the hukou is an in country system and passports a system between countries. That is true, but China is not just a country, but a one continent for itself. Maybe the comparison to the EU is better – there you have a similiar system considering that romania is part of the EU and romanians are not allowed to settle down in e.g. Germany freely. The made some rules for the poorer countries to stabilize the employment market and to avoid mass migration to the rich countries in the EU. And this is pretty much the same thing.

            3. the pro´s of the hukou – because we never ever talk about them (the china discussion is general a blame and hate discussion without any depth)

            I. the hukou system controlls mass migration and therefore is helping to avoid the development of slums and its connected evils (crime rate, poverty etc.) in the big cities.

            II. the hukou system forces the families of the worker to stay at their homeplace. This has two benefits:
            Number one – migrant worker will return to their hometown and develop the rural are. Money, knowledge and experience which was earned at the east or south coast is coming this way to central China.

            Number two – the rural country is also a insurance. The people with a country hukou have the right for farmland (the chinese blogger we are talking about, wants to have the user right for farmland so that he can sell it later to a company for a high price). During world economic crisis, many migrant workers returned to their fields and could use them to get over this hard time. This is one of the reason, why the crisis did not have that desasterous effect on China, which many so called “experts” in the west predicted.

            There are a lot of pros and cons with the hukou system. And in many parts it is already outdated. But it is not just an evil instrument to annoy or control chinese people, like it is usually presented in western media.

  5. 我爱中国共产党!

  6. Hukou: F*cking over any Chinese with a salary under 6 figures since 1958.

  7. Ya it is realy a dilemma

  8. “can even be admitted into village cadres” should be “can even receive (warm) reception from village cadres”

  9. The western press always makes it seem like rural residents are basically discriminated against in that they move to the cities but do not enjoy the benefits of residency there. But in one article I read, the migrant workers said they wouldn’t take an urban hukou if it was offered to them–they liked the security of the village and the land. And many migrant workers plan to return to their hometowns in middle age after saving up money in the cities.

    Although it’s not perfect and often not fair, I think the hukou system is still useful as China has mostly avoided the problem of slums that have affected so many other developing countries.

  10. the hukou system is still there, but it really only impacts those who have specialized skill sets like a college grad. If you want to work in a factory or construction, nobody cares, but if you want a decent job and to rent an apartment, then its a big deal. Nobody is going to stop that kid from moving home and working on the family farm. But changing your hukou is difficult and it makes no sense to switch it to agriculture, and to a rural area. I had a friend who graduated last year with an international trade degree. the school messed up on her hukou paperwork, and she was forced to either move back and practice international trade in her home village (impossible) or go to grad school and get a better hukou.

  11. damn I hate the hukou system.

    and I still can not think of the song for the article…..

  12. The bureaucracy must grow to keep up with the growing bureaucracy.

  13. Fortunately class struggle doesn’t exist with PCC.

  14. In my experience, hiring rural college grads always ends up in them having LOTS of crops – especially on the fucking farm games they sit and grind away on during working hours until they get busted.

    Good luck finding a job kids. The bottom line is most of you will be unsuccessful and bitter in life, but don’t fret, someone has to cook my nuggets and park my car!

  15. The Hukou system has advantages and disadvantages. Unfortunately for the LZ and others, like many government systems worldwide there are major problems, and he is stuck in limbo for social services. There was talk about reforming the Hukou system about a year ago. I wonder what happened, or was the reform only applicable to migrant workers?

    Beowulf has some interesting advantages of the Hukou, but I would not want to live it as my relatives do. The disadvantages are significant and life altering.

  16. yes,we are sharing the same feeling!

  17. I am just finishing reading a book that was banned in China
    ” The Life of Chinese Peasants ” by Chen Guidi & Wu Chuntao
    written in 2006. What an eye opener on how they are ripped off by the cadres and ignored by Beijing.
    The authors state that ” the population of China is 1.3 BILLION , of whom are 900 million rural , 500 million of these are working age , but Agriculture only needs 100 million….local townships and rural enterprises can only provide jobs for ….
    So, where is the rest of the 300 million to 400 million to go? ” So,
    My question to you is – where on earth do you think you could get a job in the country? READ THE BOOK. You’ll be horrified at the injustice the ‘ peasants’ endure in order to feed the pampered, thankless, City folks and with ” residence registration” they can not work legally in the city .
    Such a lack of empathy from the city people for the country people is astonishing to me. perhaps the 1966 -1976 Cultural Revolution has something to do with it.

  18. You ain’t the only one. As the markets throw up unanticipated situations, it sounds as if the various levels of government are making up the rules as they go along, and selling to the highest bidder.

  19. I know what the real China is like. The reason you think that China is one big slum is because you have clearly never travelled to any countries with real slums, like Brazil, India or Kenya. Instead of telling others about stepping about of their bubble, how about you step out of yours? Even the poorest urban nieghbourhoods in china enjoy conditions which are too good for them to be called slums.

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