Holland’s Got Talent Racist Judge Gordon, Chinese Reactions

Judge Gordon Heuckeroth made racist comments and stereotypes when Chinese contestant Xiao Wang appeared on Holland's Got Talent.

The following video on popular Chinese video sharing website Youku was viewed around 200k times within half a day of being uploaded…

From Youku:

WTF! Holland’s Got Talent Judge Openly Mocks Chinese Contestant, Sparks Public Indignation

On last week’s Holland’s Got Talent, a contestant from China named Xiao Wang [Young Wang] was mocked by the judges! He said he would be singing the Duke’s aria “La donna è mobile” from Italian opera composer Giuseppe Verdi‘s Rigoletto, never expecting that judge Gordon would immediately quip: “Which number are you singing? Number 39 with rice?” What more, after Xiao Wang’s stunning performance, Gordon said: “This is the best Chinese I’ve had in weeks, and it’s not takeaway” [Note: The original Chinese text and subtitles on the Youku copy of the video translates this incorrectly as “This is the best Chinese person I’ve ever seen, and it isn’t even a delivery boy”]. At the end, he even says: “He looks like a waiter from a Chinese restaurant.” Upon broadcast, this attracted public media attention, with many people even demanding that the judge be fired. The handsome SYTYCD judge from American Dan Karaty next to him seemed a bit upset, quietly saying: “You’re really not supposed to say things like that to people” [Note: Original Chinese text is more like: “How can you openly say that kind of stuff?”] which was rebuffed by the judge who made fun of Xiao Wang with a smile!

Comments on Youku:

文不了杰Dno:

Can’t be helped, the Chinese people [there probably] don’t interact with mainstream society, and must have left this kind of impression [on the judge].

Mishelin:

Just look at it as entertainment. Foreigners’ humor all has a bit of ridicule/mockery in it. Don’t be oversensitive.

发光的阿屎儿:

Sometimes it is just for entertainment effect, no need to be so serious and make everything into public indignation. What about the nicknames we give Euro-American celebrities? What if they came and protested it saying they are insults? Talking as if Chinese people don’t make jokes about other people’s countries on TV…

大头的毛虫CM:

Does this judge have a vicious tongue with everyone or did he only ridicule the Chinese contestant? These two things are very different, and the media has responsibility for making it clear.

妖桑呆布一生推:

Is there going to be a boycott again? Say, overseas Chinese people sure are busy. Sometimes people are just joking, and it is because of your own internal insecurity that you’re so sensitive. Personally I think using ridiculing and mocking them back is the right way to respond, whereas protesting and verbal condemnation ultimately gets you an insincere apology in the end and is without any meaning at all.

放几个: (responding to above)

First read carefully, is it ethnic Chinese people who want to do this [boycott, protest]? It’s foreign media who are criticizing. If you don’t know how to go onto foreign websites, don’t make ignorant comments. What an inferiority complex you have. Others are being racist and you even tacitly approve/agree. They’re insulting us all, not a specific person, or do you happen to be a fast food waiter?

埃克斯小姐go_up_high:

What he said was: This is the best Chinese food I’ve had this week, and it wasn’t takeout… I think he is using the best Chinese food to describe his voice.

苏Spam:

Protest and boycott the program, boycott the television channel, boycott the shareholders.

萌主来了你们快躲开:

I’m indifferent. If someone calls you a pig, does that make you a pig?

茶水铺头:

I happen to think the more grassroots one is, the better~ Every occupation has people working in it, are there no Americans or Dutch who are service staff? So he thinks the guy is a waiter, it doesn’t matter. It’s just like how Filipinos are always associated with Filipino maids. That’s just conventional thinking, without any good or bad meaning. However, killing all Chinese people, that’s real racism and not a joke.

假面人_b:

This kind of speech is too common these days~~ It’s definitely time to curb it~~

风在微笑2:

It’s not as if discrimination against colored people in Western countries is new.

claire幸运星:

You guys need to be understanding of Holland, it’s a country where prostitution is legal, so their mothers are all prostitutes!

顾水清NINO:

Don’t be too sensitive, foreigners usually wear colored-glasses when looking at Asians, Africans, and Latin Americans. Hehe.

风在微笑2:

China can only get stronger day by day in order to satisfyingly slap these kinds of people in the face.

很暴力的石头:

Now this is what I call discrimination… I felt that thing with Jimmy was completely making a fuss about nothing…

努力学淡定的代代:

I’m floored by people in the comments saying things like he was just joking and to not take it seriously. You guys make a joke about white people and on this kind of platform [popular TV show] and see what happens. And saying things like only insecure people would be angry. Well you sure aren’t insecure, kneeling and licking laowai‘s asses thinking you are so internally secure/self-confident, right? Even that American judge thought it was going too far. Why is there a bunch of retards in this country who shamelessly say don’t be narrow-minded/petty? There must be something wrong with their brains.

遇见sunny:

I also heard the other judge say at the end, “you’re really not suppose to say things like that to people, it’s just awful.” Shows there are differences between how individuals are raised.

Kaman陈:

If it comes to arguments Chinese people would not necessarily lose to them. It’s just that Xiao Wang felt this kind of behavior was very childish and wasn’t necessary.

李佛米:

It was a little going too far… I’d flip out if I were on that stage.

可嘉不藏书:

Just because we don’t let others look down on us doesn’t mean others will look highly upon us. Xiao Wang’s politeness is a kind of self-possession. We just need to mind ourselves and work hard [and we’ll get respect].

-CO酱-:

Can race/ethnicity be used so casually for jokes? Hehe – – Some people shouldn’t think this is integrating with foreign humor culture. They may be joking but the racial prejudice that is revealed is still enough to annoy people. Xiao Wang said he was studying for his PhD and that judge even says he thinks he’s a waiter, do you think this is just making a joke – – ? Nowadays, very few people dare to say discriminatory things towards black people, but to overseas Chinese who have also suffered similar difficulties, a blind eye is turned towards this kind of suffering, nor is there a large movement to oppose such deep-rooted discrimination. Acknowledging the existence of discrimination doesn’t mean it is reasonable/acceptable, and one can openly do so on stage.

TABITOPP:

The racism of white people has always been strong…

00000000竹:

The other two judges both looked awkward/embarrassed. If a show uses homosexuals for a joke, the entire world would criticize them to death. When people use Chinese people for a joke, you instead get people saying not to be petty.

00000000竹:

You don’t see them daring to make fun of black people, because black people aren’t easy to provoke [are more likely to fight back].

punk蜜公主:

I’m reminded of a trip once where I met a person. While chatting with him, I felt he was very gentlemanly and self-possessed. He said he’s Polish, and I thought in my heart, wow, Poland has such nice/good people like this. My impression of Polish people were they were all mafia. So it’s the same. Perhaps he [judge Gordon] is just biased in his understanding of a country he’s unfamiliar with, or maybe he really had some other [mean-spirited] thinking, who knows? Our countrymen should be mindful of their behavior when abroad, to give other people a good impression, and perhaps this kind of thing will slowly decrease, right?

则归墨:

This “joke” is much more serious than what the little child said on Jimmy Kimmel last time. Children’s words carry no harm, while this bastard is directly mocking. If you’re protecting this kind of person, do you still have any dignity left? Laughable.

陈晓请问我是陈晓吗:

I truly think it is racism… Our countrymen really need to take this seriously, and not dismiss it as just joking or whatever! Respect begins with oneself. If you don’t respect yourself, others will increasingly disrespect you! To say this kind of speech openly and especially in front of the media is completely without any character to speak of!

大抒研二_義忠仁:

Discrimination. Saying these kind of things in private conversation I can understand, but to say these kind of things on a public TV program or situation is really inappropriate.

Emmahey:

It’s not that bad. Aren’t we a bit discriminatory against Japan and bang zi? Overall I feel that the more [Chinese people] are like this, the more everyone feels Chinese people are nitpicky and can’t take a joke.

丨Handsome丶: (responding to above)

+! One’s own country can only be criticized by oneself! This is very normal.

放几个: (responding to above)

Those more one looks down upon oneself, the more they think this is humor. That incident with the child last time was indeed a small matter, but the television channel apologizing for airing it was necessary, even if the overseas Chinese went a bit too far. However, this is pure racism, and you people unbelievable think it is humor?

Mavis0512:

To be honest, I think it isn’t that bad. This video isn’t that exaggerated and I think it was more teasing and not malicious insults.

Liam灵岩-我为自

Can only say that judge is a bit stupid and mentally deficient. I bet his daughter and his mom are both blonde :D

放几个:

Essentially all the comments who think these are just jokes are made by women. Talk about long hair and short [little] knowledge/intelligence, all day chasing after Korean celebrities until they’re mentally retarded, not even knowing [the difference between] joking and racism. What more, this isn’t just us who think it is wrong, even foreign media are saying it is wrong, and still you [girls] are here thinking it is just humor.

崛梦:

What are your Chinese people getting worked up about? Foreigners always looked down upon you, especially those of you whose characters are so low they’re up their assholes! What use is it that you have a lot of people? Getting angry just because others look down on you, can’t even take this kind of joke. In that case, you don’t quality to go abroad!

河豚果果

Wouldn’t it have been better if he [Xiao Wang] had replied: “Because you’ve seen too little of the world” or something like that?

UIIIIO:

Foreigners are so high and mighty… There will come a day when Chinese wipe you all out…

貌岸然比不要脸强: (responding to above)

Your speech is much more serious [wrong] than that judge’s. Respect should be mutual.

Judge Gordon Heuckeroth made racist comments and stereotypes when Chinese contestant Xiao Wang appeared on Holland's Got Talent.

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  • lonetrey / Dan

    Racist jokes made in bad taste :/

    • mr.wiener

      ….by a f*cking moron.

  • David S.

    Stereotypes aren’t quite racism. These are just really bad jokes.

    • mwanafa

      Sure, you experience this type of racism/(bad jokes) everywhere every minute in China if you are a foreigner. And when foreigners address this as a problem, someone will come up with a very long fucking speech (coloring it with words such as culture, friendly, US this, UK that etc etc )convincing you to just tolerate it. It’s like what Chinese do to others is justified, but not the other way round. These fuckers will make a big fussy out of the words coming from a 4 yrs old foreign kid ffs.

      • Kai

        Two wrongs don’t make a right.

        I don’t think anyone should be telling you to “just tolerate” racism in China, but you shouldn’t feign too much surprise by it. You should already know you’re coming to a developing and largely homogenous society that hasn’t gone through the same civil rights or political correctness movements as the country you likely may have come from, and for which your appearance is a novelty. The norms are different and people in general are reliably hypocritical (meaning people often have double standards for how they treat others versus how they want to be treated). You should not tolerate it, but you should be prepared for it, and if you are prepared for it, then you have a better chance of actually fighting it, because you’ll know what to fight.

        An inherent component of racism is the generalization of entire groups of people instead of seeing them as individuals. As such, I think generalizing Chinese people as “these fuckers” as a hypocritical juxtaposition to the racism you’ve experienced at the hands of some Chinese people might be going a bit overboard. You do understand that a lot of the people who were upset with the Jimmy Kimmel incident would likewise decry the racism you’ve experienced, right? That you shouldn’t assume they’re all hypocrites just because they share the same nationality or ethnicity?

    • Kai

      Yes, stereotypes are not necessarily racist, but there can be racist stereotypes. I think these bad jokes arguably qualify as the latter.

  • Germandude

    http://www.joop.nl/leven/detail/artikel/24036_weer_racisme_rel_bij_rtl/

    http://www.hpdetijd.nl/2013-11-20/rtl-voor-uw-dagelijkse-portie-racisme/

    http://www.powned.tv/nieuws/media/2013/11/amerika_gordon_is_een_racist_p.html

    Use google translate to get an idea. The more interesting part of this topic are the comments below the articles.

    There is indeed a big discussion on how this moderator has gone too far. Also keep in mind that the Netherlands has one of the highest rates of foreigners and people with foreign roots (especially Maroccons and Indonesians). Also, it should be mentioned that the Dutch have a huge discussion going on as the feeling of how they have handled immigration has led to problems that went out of control.
    Most known incident was the murder of Theo Van Gogh, a Dutch filmmaker that was murdered because he made a movie, criticizing Islam. This has shaken the society because the Dutch were always proud of their tolerance towards multiculturalism.

    Anybody who is visiting Europe, I would highly recommend going to the Netherlands. Beautiful country, super open and tolerant people and a positively weird attitude towards anything new/bizarre. If you think you’ve seen it all, the Netherlands will show you that you haven’t!

    One thing though: If you cannot handle people talking what’s in their mind in that exact moment, you’ll run into problems. Dutch often first talk, then think. Which is funny, but sometimes hurting.

    • Guest

      lol i have that “talk first think later” problem.

      as a dutch person i’m ashamed at what the judge said and i feel so sorry for the contestant. i hope chinese people don’t get a bad impression of the dutch and the netherlands because of that asshole.

    • There is no such think as “multiculturalism”. Going to eat at a Chinese restaurant one day and Japanese the next is not multi culture. Places have “a single’ culture. That may have inspirations from others – but it is still just the one culture.

      • ElectricTurtle

        In a sense you’re right, but there is such a thing as pluralism, and that’s what we’re really talking about here. The intersection of cultures in respectful ways… but you have to give respect to get respect.

        • Correct. Where society fails is with this rose coloured hippy view on the topic that suggests that MC does exist, can exist and as such there aren’t and can’t be problems. The reason why there are problems is because people don’t stop to think that maybe MC doesn’t exist and therefore the rules are different and the analysis flawed.

          There are some good vids on You tube about the problem that is created by people that push the MC agenda. Much the same people usually that push this man made global warming nonsense.

          It is a divorcing from reality and facts that cause the problems.

          I love living in a society with so much going on – but I don’t kid myself that Australia is not a mono theistic, English speaking, British cultured place. And because of that certain constructs around morals and how life is carried are premeate into everything in society.

          And opening a Malaysian restaurant or going to China Town for dumplings doesn’t change that.

          Like the global warming mob. It is just intellectual laziness.

    • Malcom X

      It always has to be whites who are the first to bring in racism. Always…

    • Guest23

      Good points, one question you should ask them is, what constitutes racism for them? the answers are a bit…lazy and self-centered towards making them look like victims in a good light.

    • linette lee

      “the murder of Theo Van Gogh, a Dutch filmmake”

      Dutch needs to deport those Islam criminals and the their organizations who murder Dutch people back to Islam countries. If you don’t like the country please leave and go back to your own country with your families. No need to kill and commit racial hate crime. I am sure China will deport people who kill Chinese and commit racial hate crime against their people. It’s great to be multicultural country but must maintain order.

      • wongasu

        the dutch should do it, like china did against ugyur rebels

  • Guang Xiang

    Surprised by the relatively level-headed discussion between Chinese netizens

  • Dannisi

    Can people please stop taking Gordon seriously. Nobody in Holland does. Just let him ramble on.

  • KamikaziPilot

    I wonder if this took place in Japan and it was a Japanese judge that said something similar to this, would the Chinese reactions be the same? That’s a rhetorical question.

    • linette lee

      Why are you so butt hurt, most Chinese don’t even know where’s Netherland. They thought Netherland = neverland where peter pan lives.
      If the chinese talk so much shxt about japan, that means they find you very important. IF one Japanese in Bermuda triangle talk shxt about Chinese, the Chinese will find him.

      • KamikaziPilot

        Are you on any medication by chance? Where did you get the idea that I was butthurt? I just wanted to show the blatant double standard that many Chinese practice. I know Chinese are obsessed about Japan, they’re obsessed with everyone who they have an inferiority complex towards. If Chinese try to find me they’ll probably crash their car trying to find me, I’m not worried at all.

    • m0l0k0

      who give a shit you are a retard

  • Dannisi
  • Washington Bullets

    Meh. Let’s just leave the racist jokes to wash-outs like Carlos Mencia.

    • Mateusz82

      Wash out implies he had a worthy career to begin with. Less a has been than a never-was.

  • 5000 years of history

    Let freedom ring

    • linette lee

      The Dutch don’t want their ass free.

      • mr.wiener

        I’m not paying for free ass.

        • Again with the donkeys….

          • mr.wiener

            He-aw, he-aw, he-always says that.

        • David

          I know it is legal there but pretty sure it is not free.

      • My donkey is not free.

  • Here’s a man who just doesn’t give a fuck!

    • A Gawd Dang Mongolian

      Or possibly doesn’t even think. To be a judge you have to analyze what’s presented to give a fair score, unless you’re dumb.

      I’m gonna go with the theory that the engine’s running but no one is behind the wheel.

      • mr.wiener

        I’m going with the theory that he sniffed a little too much coke before settling into his judges chair. What a jackass. The smiles on the people in the audience were starting to look very strained.

  • ESL Ninja

    When the cameras stopped rolling, Gordon took him to one side and told him that he has a small penis and eats dogs before scrawling ‘Free Tibet’ on his forehead with a permanent marker.

    /true story

    • Germandude

      Source or it didn’t happen.

    • Germandude

      Well as expected, you pulled that story out of your ass (=not providing a source). I am pretty sure that if what you said had happened, small penis/eating dog remark and shouting “free Tibet”, we would actually be discussing sth very different.

      Next time, try harder to mislead others…

      • ESL Ninja

        Undecided as to whether you are joking or if the famous German lack of sense of humour stereotype really is true…

        • Germandude

          Well then I hae to admit that it’s the later. Sorry, didn’t recognize it as a joke.

  • Cameron

    Another reason for this problem is Due to their own communist system, most Chinese people seem to automatically assume that anything that “comes out” of Western media must be representative of the general “official” view, or even state endorsed. They don’t quite get that western nations allow a variety of very different opinions and personalities to express their views, some of whom may even express opinions which infuriate 99% of the population. To people in China, that is kind of wacky, so in a sense this kind of thing really is a culture clash. We defend people’s rights to be idiotic and, within reason, offensive. They don’t.

    As an aside, I watched an episode of that very popular “Morning Call” series on Youku by that dude with a beard (Teacher Gao?), and the episode the episode in which he ranted for half an our about the stupidity of Japanese people and rubbish news of their culture was possibly the most racist thing I’ve ever listened to. Imagine the Chinese netizens response if Japan promoted such a rant on its number One video website!! You have to laugh.

    • Paulos

      Gao Xiaosong (高晓松) if I’m not mistaken, aka the living embodiment of everything I aspire not to be: fat, spoiled, unkempt, priggish, and rude.

  • Nilerafter24

    As you can see, communities that are less vocal are always easy targets. The judge would never have made such a blatantly offensive comment about black people, Jews or the LGBT community because the ensuing outrage would be merciless.
    People can whine as much as they want about minorities being overly sensitive but sometimes you have to be really aggressive and vocal if you want things to change. Asian communities are generally loved because they’re peaceful and timid. But this is also easily considered a weakness. As such, the community becomes an easy target of insensitive jokes and remarks borne of a deeper, darker insecurity in some individuals.
    But it says a lot about the general European mindset that a lot of its citizens can spot such situations as wrong or insensitive and are willing to show their outrage in defense of minorities.
    What I take away from this story is that some people will always be assholes while others will be kind and empathetic. General human behavior. Generalizing whole groups of people as one or the other shows a deep lack of knowledge of the human being.

    • Dannisi

      Agree with most of it, but he can joke about LGBT, cause he’s gay himself. For some reason that means you are excused.

      • ElectricTurtle

        It is more or less universally accepted that people can joke about groups of which they are themselves members, since it’s then a form of self-deprecation.

    • whuddyasack

      I agree with many of your points and sometimes I wonder if Asians really have been too soft, meek and tolerant all this time. As another American kindly put, “Asians are the most bullied publicly.” I think being hard is even tougher for Asian girls than Asian guys. We have all the smarts and abilities to propel us for much success, academically, technologically, creatively, economically, artistically, musically. I could even say that Asians as a whole are extremely intelligent but unfortunately lack several things that put us in a disadvantage. One of them is ruthlessness and the other is competitiveness. We also have trouble with communication and “street smarts”.

      I would however state that Asian non-aggression is as much a blessing as it is a curse. It shows that while many of us can make easy pickings for the opportunists and hateful, we can also live in any environment and as a community, Asians really can thrive, cooperate and make good contributions.

      Looking back, while it is true that aggression and a more assertive stance would win us more respect, or even fear, it isn’t something I would want. To be honest being too aggressive and violent can be detrimental at times; I’m referring to Islam fanaticism here. Not all Muslims, just the fanatics.

      I would really hate to see Asians blowing things up and threatening to commit terrorism over something as trivial as stepping on a Koran. Recently, a Muslim extremist immigrating from Syria to Myanmar made this suggestion to the Muslim community there. “Kill the nearest Buddhist you can find”.

      This is overall a good story and it turned out much better than I expected. From both the Chinese and Dutch sides.

      • linette lee

        Buddhism is very different than other religion. It preaches inner peace and peace around the world and how to achieve balance. It talks about karma. So that’s opposite to aggression. To me buddhism is more like a philosophy than religion. And most Chinese are Buddhist. Maybe that’s why they are so docile.

        http://online.sfsu.edu/rone/Buddhism/BUDDHIST%20IDEAS%20FOR%20ATTAINING%20WORLD%20PEACE.htm

        “Buddhism teaches that whether we have global peace or global war is up to us at every moment. The situation is not hopeless and out of our hands. If we don’t do anything, who will? Peace or war is our decision. The fundamental goal of Buddhism is peace, not only peace in this world but peace in all worlds. The Buddha taught that the first step on the path to peace is understanding the causality of peace.”

        • whuddyasack

          That’s true Linette, and it is very interesting. Buddhist philosophy emphasizes on peace and it is said that Buddhists are the ones that are supposed to let an ant go first. It could explain the Chinese docility but it could also be a genetic or cultural factor. Something along the lines of respect for elders, or a more Confucian philosophy. But then again, other East Asian types, specifically Japanese and the arctic type Mongoloids tend to share the shy, docile characteristics with the Chinese. I’m not sure about any others hahaha.

          Either way, Chinese beliefs tend to be intertwined according to Daoism, Confucianism and Buddhism. However, I’d say that most modern-day Chinese are atheist these days.

          As peaceful as Buddhists are, even they can be pushed to their limit. There is much violence in Myanmar lately between the Buddhists and the Muslims. Both are committing quite horrible acts against each other, but I don’t think the Buddhists can match the depravities of the Muslim fanatic. Anyways, I think I shouldn’t talk too much about that. It is actually quite depressing news and one which I feel doesn’t really have much of a solution.

          • David

            However, you are presuming that the majority of Chinese people follow Buddhist precepts. It has been my experience in China that very few mainland Chinese people even know any Buddhists doctrines let alone follow them. They certainly do not act in other ways which follow Buddhist philosophy. Also, I have not found any lack of aggression or assertiveness when they deal with each other, much more so when they deal with foreigners (and of course it does not stop them from cheating foreigners on a daily basis in matters of business).

          • whuddyasack

            You are correct that the majority of Chinese don’t follow Buddhist precepts and doctrines these days. In fact, some are even disgusted by Buddhism, mainly due to the Falungong. I remember an article about a Muay Thai fighter competing against a Shaolin monk and the majority of Chinese netizens wanted to Muay Thai fighter to win because they said that the “Buddhist monk” was getting too arrogant even though he was from China. Something of that sort.

            But I guess I mentioned Buddhist philosophy as a means of trying to explain why Chinese particularly those overseas tended to be so docile and hesitant to lash back. Of course, Buddhism is practiced more widely in HK, Taiwan, Southeast Asia and the diaspora Chinese populations than in the mainland these days as most mainlanders have become sort of atheists, or secular in the very least. So I tried to explain what Chinese values were based on while ignoring the ridiculous stereotypes common in the internet. I finally came up with what seemed like a combination of Confucianism, Daoism and Buddhism. So while Chinese in China don’t practice any of these religions these days, they still keep the values culturally in much the same way as Europeans who aren’t particularly religious can be culturally Christian in values.

            Communism is very much dead in China methinks except in name and symbolism.

            “Also, I have not found any lack of aggression or assertiveness when they deal with each other, much more so when they deal with foreigners ”

            David, I’m very interested in this statement. I can agree and am aware of Chinese conning, cheating and charging foreigners “special prices” as they can be very opportunistic and take advantage of a expats lack of bargaining skills and familiarity with normal prices there. However aggression is something that I’ve personally found it hard to believe. In all my experiences living in Western countries for instance, I’ve feared Black, Arab and White gangs than I’ve ever feared Chinese. Most Asian/Chinese foreign students I know are extremely shy, soft spoken and not the type that would pick a fight. They also tend to be far more polite than the locals which is why most lecturers and teachers love them.

            My experiences in China have been the same, I’ve never been assaulted and most people who’ve visited or lived there told me similar things. That it was safer than their home countries/ cities. As most foreigners are much bigger than the Chinese, it’s hard to imagine that even the aggressive ones would dare to engage an expat in combat. But I’ve heard a lot about assaults amongst the expat community. Normally, I’d dismiss this but when you mention this, I actually believe you and am sorry to hear that you’ve been the target of violence there.

            I’m quite interested to know how the situation came about, and who and how these thugs had the gall to attack you. (I bet you kicked their asses though, sorry for being blunt) ;-)

          • David

            “David, I’m very interested in this statement. I can agree and am aware
            of Chinese conning, cheating and charging foreigners “special prices” as
            they can be very opportunistic and take advantage of a expats lack of
            bargaining skills and familiarity with normal prices there. However
            aggression is something that I’ve personally found it hard to believe.” I can understand your confusion. What I meant to type was that they are aggressive with each other but NOT generally with foreigners unless it is in the practice of cheating them at prices (which is much more of a sneaky thing and does not require open aggression). Amazing what a simple negative word missing does lol

            Some see this double standard of behavior (being overly polite to foreigners and being normal to other Chinese) as being servile to foreigners, others think it is simply politeness taken to an extreme level, and then there are those who see it as being two faced (acting nice to our face and then talking shit about us behind our back). As I have only been here 8 months I am not in a position to give a completly informed oinion but I will say it is similar to what I have seen living in Japan and Korea, although I do not know if the roots of the behavior are the same.

            In Japan they say each person has three faces; one they show to the world at large, one they only show to close friends/relatives and one that is only known to themselves. Generally in western countries, people meet all kinds of others and we have developed a way of interacting with them. China today reminds me more of Korea 30 years ago when the number of foreigners was limited to U.S. military and a few in Seoul. The reality of large numbers of people who did not know the accepted way of acting and did not understand non-verbal cues was miniscule, so there were constantly misunderstandings going on (on both sides).

            I am not making excuses for all bad western behavior because some are just assholes, the same with Chinese assholes, but the government does not foster a welcoming atmosphere to foreigners (I mean on the individual level obviously, obviously they want corporations to be here) who are not important. Therefore, even local government bureaucracies can be quite daunting and frustrating for those of us who are used to government trying to make things easier (even if they are bad at it). If I were to describe what getting a work visa for China was like, after I had been hired, most westerners would probably shake their heads understandingly with the shared horrible experience. I imagine most native Chinese would just be confused and think “yea, so what? That is how it is.”

            OK, I have drifted a bit off topic now.

        • linette lee

          hahah.. I just find out something on hk yahoo while reading the hk news. Our famous lions name. I never knew their names. They are pair of lions that’s very famous in HK right outside HSBC bank. I love them when I was a kid. Touch their paws for good wealth.

          This is Stephen.
          http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/90/Leftlion.jpg

          This is Stitt.
          http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3c/HK_HSBC_Lion_1.jpg

          • David

            Very cool. We have a pair of lions in front of the Art museum in Chicago too. They are bronze and pretty big. They have been there over 100 years.

        • My_honourable_lord

          Been to Burma recently?

    • Fremdenschade

      While I think that Gordon definitely went further than he normally does, he does insult anyone who stands before him, be they black, Jew, LGBT or what he considers “normal”. The problem is that he usually makes a comment about their outfit,their pronuncation or what have you, instead of making a comment which he could say ro any Chinese who dares to cross his path.
      This is what makes it racist, as he dors not offend just one person per usual, he offendsany Chinese

  • YourSupremeCommander

    Sum Ting Wong

    • chandlerpatrick

      Even though it was connected to a devestating tragedy, Sum Ting Wong, Wi To Lo, Ho Lee Fuk, Bang Ding Ow, had me laughing my ass off.

      • Stop with the donkeys! Seriously. Enough already. Where did this crap come from. Chinese whispers?

      • YourSupremeCommander

        And don’t forget about Mr. Shet Mye Pang

  • TheSOP

    Guy is a douche plain and simple. But relative to what Luo Jing endured this is relatively minor… I wonder how the Dutch commenters were reacting. Chinese netizens where very vicious toward Luo Jing from my recollection which I think speaks just as loudly to a societies racism as a ignorant douche like this Dutch DJ.

    • whuddyasack

      I wonder if ignorantly stirring up trouble from your trailer is your full-time job? You’re conveniently ignoring the fact that while there were racist, nationalistic comments thrown at BOTH Lou Jing and her mother, there was actually a lot of sympathy and support for her as well, not unlike the Dutch community in this article.

      In the Telegraph’s Shanghai correspondent’s own words:

      “It struck me, as we spoke, that her story proves that Shanghai at least,
      if not China as a whole, is a tolerant and non-racist place.”

      http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/malcolmmoore/100015804/chinas-black-pop-idol-does-not-expose-her-nations-racism/

      Lou Jing herself said that she was not subjected to any racial abuse. I mean, she was among the Top 5 contestants in ‘Oriental Angel’ thanks to Chinese votes.

      Meanwhile, in America, wasn’t there an uncivilized Trayvon Martin scandal going on?

      • TheSOP

        You speak Dutch? Please inform us how the majority of the Dutch commenters are supporting this racism. Oh wait, you can’t can you? Not only because you cant speak Dutch but also for the fact the he is being widely condemned. Fail #1 racist.

        As for Luo Jing; actually she received heaps of racial abuse on the Chinese internet, much of which was documented here on cS. But you are obviously not interested in realities which challenge your narrow minded and bigoted racist worldview. Sure she had support but the abusers were prevalent. A multi-cultural and racial nation like the US would never have an issue simply with the ethnicity of a contestant. Statistical noise and abuse? Sure, but abusers being so prevalent as to dominate the story? Not likely. Fail #2 racist.

        Finally a well documented racist like yourself is hardly qualified to pass judgement, even on a douche like this Dutch guy since he looks like a choir boy next to the racist bigotry that you openly embody which includes writing 26 pages of 10p font hate comments within 24 hours which referenced “Whites” 42 times all in deragatory and racist hate language. Fail #3 racist

        Your bigoted and hateful inferiority complex driven existence. Fail #4

        Your similarly hateful and bigotted racist friends from the Sanlu Times (seriously does that 12 year old wolf kid think calling people “dumbo” or “hammerhead” is hardcore? what a mega douche, and the sexual and cultural cross dressing “Michiko” or whatever that obese chainsmoking PRC wumao calls himself is equally trashy). Fail #5

        Your existence seems to be just a sequence of failures.

        • whuddyasack

          Wow, you really are unbelievable. Can’t you read? Is bigot and racist the only thing on your mind, you SWAM-hole?

          FYI, I never said the Dutch were racist. I actually applauded them big time. Their readiness to defend minorities is nothing short of admirable and there have been many Dutch commentators on Chinasmack right now who have actively supported, apologized and shown sympathy towards the Chinese. Now THAT is noble. Personally, I didn’t feel that Gordon’s comments were that offensive and it’s amazing it was the Dutch community, the audience, judges and public that labelled Gordon’s comments inappropriate. That’s like 100% different to how the “Americans” reacted in Kimmel’s case. You were one of them.

          Statistical noise, blah, blah, blah. You might want to ask Miss America how she felt at the racist bile fellow “White” Americans threw at her.

          Regarding Loujing, did you read the link I gave you? “Wacism” directed at her is only according to your perspective. Far more authoritative figures like Malcolm Moore have confirmed that China is “a tolerant and non-racist place”.

          As for Loujing herself, this is what she said:

          “I have never felt different because of my skin…” she said.

          So she’s well-adjusted, has plenty of friends and extremely good education and talent in China. Heaps of people stood behind her.

          BTW, that crude insult aimed at Michiko was pathetic. She has obviously proved who she is, she boldly placed a photo of herself, used her real name, wrote a blog completely in Japanese and even uploaded photographs of documentation proving that she is in fact Japanese. This is far more than you have ever done, all your empty boasts just hot air.To be honest, you’re even worse than some of the trolls at GT and Bloomberg, and that’s saying something.

          • TheSOP

            Lou Jing can say she is my fairy godmother, we all know the fact of the matter. You are completely dishonest uttering blatant lies like China isn’t racist at all… you really are the most shameless racist on this site by far.

            Lou Jing endured tons of racial abuse documented on this site and others. You are so willing to lie, and tell lies that are so easily shown to be false, it is amazing. Really, you should become a wumao, you have no face to lose as is.
            http://www.chinasmack.com/2009/stories/shanghai-black-girl-lou-jing-racist-chinese-netizens.html

          • whuddyasack

            SOP, that’s all you’ve ever brought to the table, you SWAM. Wild wacist accusations. The fact that you misquoted me about my feelings of Dutch attitudes is rather telling.

            So you bring out top comments from a couple of sites like Tianya and pointed out by “Chinasmack” as proof of racism against Lou Jing. Laugh Out Loud.

            So does that mean I can bring up Kimmel and how you participated in that nonsense as evidence of your own “wacism”?

            The fact is Lou Jing HERSELF said she was never discriminated and never felt different because of her skin color, she is well-adjusted in Shanghai, has lots of friends, a good education, and support. If Chinese were so racist, there is no way she would have made it that far in the competition. Common sense, POS, use it.

            Now let’s look at Nina Davuluri. Bear in mind that Indians and Europeans are of the same race, making it all the more disgusting. Malcolm Moore wields far more credibility than you can ever dream of.

            http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/malcolmmoore/100015804/chinas-black-pop-idol-does-not-expose-her-nations-racism/

          • TheSOP

            I linked to direct evidence of Chinese netizens saying extremely racist thing, directly refuting the lies posted by yourself that there was no racism directed at her. But you, as a bigoted racist and Asian racial-chauvanist, are not affected by logic, fact or reason, and I’m not surpised. You are racist scum, and even presented with facts that completly destroy your blatant lies you remain in full racist apologist mode. You are a hypocrite, its rather funny that you fancy your self some kind of great debator when nothing could be further from the truth. You are the kind of bigotted idiot who could slam his head against a wall and then tell stories about how he showed that walls whos boss. Nobody except your fellow racist ilk can take you seriously.

            According to you none of these document comments by chinese netizens are racists, I think we can all judge for ourselves how deluded you are.

            Jesse_Q:

            Her mother’s skin is pretty thick.
            At the time finding foreigners was indeed a fad, but you still can’t pick blacks!

            滢滢:

            Kao.

            Fucked by a black.

            How come a zebra wasn’t born…?

            黑丫子:

            Ugh. Yellow people and black people mixed together is very gross…only black skin, not yellow skin, chocolate skin…

            Not even knowing this common knowledge, ruining a child’s life.

            Lyna:

            There are still a lot of this kind of women that would get involved with blacks~
            Her old mother at the time had courage, probably also did not know what color would she would give birth to, white, yellow, all possible, right…?

          • whuddyasack

            There goes the misquotes. I said Lou Jing HERSELF admitted that “she was never discriminated and never felt different because of her skin color”. After all, she made it that far in Oriental Angel, was accepted into one of the top schools in China, is well-adjusted and had lots of friends. Lou Jing and Moore’s words carry far more weight than your pathetic cherry picking ever would, you disgusting hairy woooogaaaa boooggaaa.

            I also said that those comments from Tianya and KDS did not prove that Chinese or China was wacist. Since when did you become so concerned about “wacism” and the rights of minorities, especially Blacks, you SWAM. Did you know that the word “racist” is anti-White and you’re doing yourself no service by repeating that even while spitting your vitriol.

            You get so overworked up over internet comments, jokes, and what not thrown against you. Yet cry and whine like pathetic babies when others do the same. I could easily link blogs, comments and articles 1000 times more vitriolic and sickening than the stuff you listed above.

            So what about Nina Davuluri? What about Tiffany Hwang? What about all the different POCs who are heaped and thrown insults, bashed, murdered, robbed by a horde of backward primitives of chiefly Black and White color?

            If you can find Chinese examples of the following, then perhaps you would have a bit more credibility. Until then, just GTFO and STFU hahaha. Of course if any Chinese would put up a video like that or write a blog dedicated to bashing “White” people as you put it, you’d be having more assploding overreactions than you already have.

            http://impulsechris.blogspot.com.au/2007/01/i-hate-chinese-people-from-china.html

            As racist as you claim I am, I’d never go to those extremes. I think that’s just so disgustingly neckbeard material.

    • Kai

      You do understand how similar your comment here is to whuddyasack’s commment here, right?

      Your “But relative to…” is analogous to his “back home”. He deflected to the West in defense of Asia. You deflected to China in defense of the Dutch.

      …which puts this comment of yours in a different light.

      • TheSOP

        It is important to remember that the dominate narrative coming from Western media on these kinds of incidents is one a of a White victimizer and a “person of color” victim (POC being nothing more than constructionist nonsense). So why bring up Luo Jing? Because it counters the dominant narrative in Western media. Do you think Western media does full page lead stories on foreigners beat up simply because of their skin color or nationality in China? Rarely if ever, yet I among many others here have their own stories (multiple in most cases) of how they were targeted simply for not being Chinese. I believe one poster already mentioned it on this thread. If this were the opposite case in the US or EU you would have the Angry Asian Guy and all kinds of other racial sensationalists making noises about it, and in this case there would be/was righteous indignation. Yet who is our advocate? Who is our voice for the foreigners who live in China and encounter these kind of incidents which would easily be labeled a hate crime in the US? Will the Chinese media stand up for us like the Western media stands up for non-majority victims of racial abuse in the West? Pfffffftttt, yea I can see Yang Rui and Hu Xijin really looking out for us and exposing the bigotry in Chinese society, well if it weren’t for the fact that they actively provoke it. At best we might get a mention on Shanghaist with an accompanying Youtube video of the assault like the French guy a few months back… CNN? Yea right.

        Look at the narrative Kai, I’m not saying this doesn’t need exposure but the narrow lens of exposure is itself a major problem as is the false dichotomy of racial oppressor and oppressee that this narrative engenders. You can see how it enables and sustains bigots like Whatasack to construct a false victim narrative and rationalize their own racist line of thought.

        If you can understand that then you can understand why it is important to remember the Lou Jing incident. You benefit from the popular narrative and the advocates that accompany it Kai (so much so that it may be difficult for you to understand what it is like to not have such advocates), we non-Asian foreigners living in Asia enjoy no such privilege, we have to be our own advocates.

        • Kai

          I don’t think the dominant narrative in Western media is that “POCs aren’t racist”. Therefore, Lou Jing doesn’t “counter” it.

          That Western media doesn’t do full-page lead stories on foreigners who were beat up in China because of their skin color or nationality doesn’t change the fact that your comment there was similar to whuddyasack’s comment. Both of you employed the same rhetorical tactic to deflect and shift attention onto your preferred target.

          That a larger cross-section of society makes noise about these sort of incidents in Western countries is something for Western countries to be proud of and for Chinese society to be ashamed of.

          Yet you can’t claim ignorance for the reasons why foreigners in China have less advocates in such situations, can you? You know foreigners are a smaller minority, that China is a society that is developing and hasn’t gone through the same historical movements of multiculturalism and political correctness as many Western countries, that foreigners are also often fawned upon and afforded certain advantages that POCs don’t enjoy in the West, that the society is much more homogenous and with much more unevent amounts of education (especially of the racial/cultural sensitivity sort), etc.

          None of this changes how hurtful it is to be discriminated against in China, but they are relevant context to the differences in reaction in the West vs. China. You should fight for equal public indignation over such discrimination in China, but you shouldn’t unfairly complain about why it ISN’T equal at this point in time. You KNOW why. Complaining with the expectation that it should be the same is therefore dishonest.

          I agree that whuddyasack has a racist line of thought, but I don’t think your representation of the “narrative” is completely objective. I don’t think whuddyasack’s victim narrative is necessarily “false” either. The complaints you guys both have are legitimate for many situations, but unhelpfully exaggerated. You guys exaggerate them in order to dishonestly dismiss something. For him, he exaggerates China bashing by whites in order to dismiss China bashing. For you, you exaggerate the reporting and attention on racism as some sort of conspiratorial “narrative” in order to dismiss attention to racism.

          I think what Chinese netizens said about Lou Jing online is extremely important in highlighting how pervasive racism is in China. Bringing it up in this context is still a deflection though.

          When you say about me benefiting from the popular “narrative” and the advocates that accompany “it” is the same as people saying white people benefit from their historical dominance and the advantages that accompany it. How do these two things coexist? Because they in fact do coexist. POCs are demonstratably disadvantaged in white dominant societies but they also benefit from advocates against that disadvantage in those societies. It isn’t mutually exclusive. Both should be recognized, instead of dishonestly used to dimiss each other.

          Non-Asian foreigners in Asia are experiencing what many non-White foreigners in the West have experienced throughout history. Unfortunately, non-Asian foreigners in Asia will have to find a way to build advocacy for their interests just as non-White foreigners in the West had to.

          Relevant: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane_Elliott

      • TheSOP

        BTW I think it is an illustrative comparative case study over two similar kind of reality TV type backdrops where contestants of non-majority backgrounds came under attack for their perceived “differentness”. The Dutch case seems to have resulted with massive support for the victim and a thorough lashing of the bigoted judge where as Luo Jing received lots of unprofessional attention from the judges about her father’s origin which instead of being refuted in the general media and social media instead led to an ugly exposure of the racist underbelly of Chinese society similar to what we’ve seen the Philippine disaster. That my friend is what comparative case studies are all about and the conclusions that you can glean from them, well those speak for themselves.

        • Kai

          The bigotry on the Chinese internet in response to Lou Jing and the defense of Gordon’s behavior both reflect something about the people behind them. China is demonstratably less politically correct or more racist than Holland. Yet this still doesn’t change the conclusions we can glean from Gordon’s behavior and the defense of his behavior. Both are to be reflected upon, not dismissed.

          • TheSOP

            I don’t recollect dismissing the issue nor was it dismissed in the popular media.

          • Kai

            “Dismissed” in the context of deflection. When someone deflects, they are more or less dismissing one thing in order to shift attention to another. Both you and whuddyasack acknowledged the original issue (which is to be given credit for) but in both situations, it was glaring to me that you guys were deflecting. My comment was never about the popular media and what the popular media does is irrelevant to this observation about your guys’ actions.

          • TheSOP

            I simply referenced the scale and nature of the vitriol and outcomes of two similar incidents that took place on different national/cultural backdrops, by comparison I think we can both agree Luo Jing received far more sustained and widespread abuse, much of which was documented here on cS at the time. This in comparison to the support received by the Chinese national in this incident. Perhaps it is irrelevant to you but I think it is illustrative. Comparing can be seen as deflecting but it can also be seen as enlightening.

          • Kai

            I agree that comparing CAN be seen as “enlightening” but I think you’re euphemizing your own deflection here. Moreover, you’re going to be hella annoyed when people like whuddyasack claim their deflections are “enlightening”…which I think he’s more or less done as well, albeit in slightly different language.

            I’m of the opinion that it is best to avoid deflecting entirely rather than make excuses for it. A response of comparison or juxtaposition usually only escapes the accusation of deflection if it is made in direct response to someone making demonstratably unfair criticisms of a target. Motive is also important. Are you trying to moderate that person’s criticisms or are you actually trying to argue that something else is “worse” in order to shift attention?

            For example, there’s a difference between:

            “Hey come on now, it’s not like there isn’t racism in China… *points to Lou Jing*” (in direct response to someone who is making comments that suggest racism isn’t found in China or racism only happens in the West)

            vs.

            “But relative to what Luo Jing endured this is relatively minor…” (in response to an incident of racism on Dutch TV)

            Anyway, I hope you understand what I’m saying and how it can help you take more defensible positions and better navigate debates.

  • nqk123

    totally agree. you can tell what kind of relationship China have with a particular nation based on news and responds like above

  • nqk123

    saw the video, this is much more of stereotyping than racism. but neither are ok to says

  • linette lee

    http://a.disquscdn.com/uploads/mediaembed/images/667/8410/original.jpg

    You Chinese don’t understand Dutch culture!!

    • Germandude

      Again you are using my copyrighted picture without permission. You will hear from my lawyer!

      • linette lee

        Kopywight?
        kopywight 是什麼?
        me no speak English.

  • Willem2

    im from holland and just to be clear the guy was already a total asshole before this comment. he just likes to seek attention by saying controversial and hurtful things. I think its very inappropriate and ignorant but i do believe it is being blown out of proportion. you have these kinds of people in every country

  • Stefan Xu

    I’m Chinese and I find this offensive! I heard this kind of jokes and even worse everyday during my whole childhood. Not fun at all. I really hate racism and this guy should be fired in my opinion.

    It seems that Asians are the ones that it is “ok” to be racist against. But not to other races.

    • moop

      why should someone be fired for a tasteless joke? for every single thing in this world you can find someone who is offended by it. i really dont want to live in that kind of world where merely saying a tasteless joke ruins one’s life. everyone is a little racist, but apparently he wasnt racist enough to not let the guy pass through to the other round. what he said pales in comparison to the real hate that has been excused. Like MSNBC’s recent problems, or our dear YangRui.

    • Germandude

      Stefan Xu in the last couple of days:

      “I have nothing against white people. Me myself is part white.”
      http://www.chinasmack.com/2013/stories/less-english-more-chinese-for-gaokao-college-entrance-exams.html#comment-1129405203

      “I’m no troll, everyone has the right to have their own opinion”
      http://www.chinasmack.com/2013/stories/less-english-more-chinese-for-gaokao-college-entrance-exams.html#comment-1129391951

      “No, because English is the first language I learnt with Chinese being the third language I learnt.”
      http://www.chinasmack.com/2013/stories/less-english-more-chinese-for-gaokao-college-entrance-exams.html#comment-1129357920

      “I am no troll, everyone has their right to have an opinion of themselves. Isn’t the west a democratic society?”
      http://www.chinasmack.com/2013/stories/less-english-more-chinese-for-gaokao-college-entrance-exams.html#comment-1129354235

      Your above statement and the ones that I quoted in this post is why I, and I must assume many others here on cS, have a problem with you.

      On the one hand, you claim you are “part(ly) white”, raised in Sweden and what was it? UK? You also say that Chinese is the third (!) language you learned, which leaves me thinking that you are more Swedish/Brit than Chinese, but whatever, it doesn’t matter. Then, you claim the right (and rightfully so) to express your opinion, thanks to the western democratic system (society) that you’ve grown up within.

      But when some freaking idiot on the Dutch TV is talking shit, you happily fall into the victim role…
      I, like you, hate racism and agree that this moderator is totally misplaced. However, I believe that in a democratic system with freedom of speech, everybody should be allowed to express his/her opinion. Be that sth I agree with or disagree with. Everybody should have the right to show in front of everybody else that he is a retard. Mr. moderator with a mouth faster than his brain has done so and he gets a lot of criticism.

      • Guang Xiang

        My problem with Stefan:

        “The Philippines – a disgusting shit-hole of a country.” http://www.chinasmack.com/2013/pictures/super-typhoon-haiyan-hits-the-philippines-chinese-reactions.html#comment-1118510890

        “I really hate racism” – Just now

        • Stefan Xu

          I didn’t meant it, I just wanted to see the reactions. I’m sorry for my comment.

          • Germandude

            “I didn’t meant it, I just wanted to see the reactions.”

            Maybe the Dutch moderator did the same? Maybe we will hear a “I’m sorry for my comment.”?

            Either way is stupid…

          • mr.wiener

            …..Stefan…..That is just weak mate.

          • ESL Ninja

            Fucking pathetic.

      • Stefan Xu

        My father is born in Sweden from Finnish and German parents and my mother is an ethnic Chinese from Malaysia. I was born in Saudi Arabia but grew up mostly in Sweden and some years in the UK.

        However I look Chinese and I’m always seen a “Chinese” by whites. I feel more accepted in China and Asia in general. Since I got very interested in China and moved there when I was 19 I started to identify more with the Chinese.

        All ethnic Chinese are Chinese nevertheless if they are from mainland, HK, TW, or overseas.
        When I’m in the west I see myself as a Chinese with white blood.

        That’s why I don’t like how westerners have a bad impression of mainlanders as it tarnish the image of ethnic Chinese in general.

        • Chris

          I think it’s wonderful you identify so strongly with your heritage, and that you’ve found the place you feel “accepted”. I guess it all comes down to personal experience and opinions. I have several friends of mixed Chinese and European heritage, and every single one of them has told me the same story. They feel looked down on in China, never feel truly accepted by the Chinese side of their family, and have encountered pretty nasty racism from strangers. One friend of mine was told her (Chinese) mother was a whore, and a traitor. But like I said, I guess it all comes down to personal experience.

        • markus peg

          Most people in the UK see Chinese people and think/assume they were born in the UK or from HK. Only recently have more mainlanders started to come.
          I know people from China who feel accepted as British because their English level is so good people just assume they were born and raised here. It’s a shame you didn’t feel accepted in the UK, i guess everyone is different and some experiences that are not created by the mass can affect peopel’s views, every country has a % of racist dicks that ruin things for others.

        • moop

          i get that, but you being an ethnic Chinese born outside of the mainland, you know that being a mainlander doesnt make you Chinese, so why do you lump you all together?

          • Stefan Xu

            “you know that being a mainlander doesnt make you Chinese”

            What? What do you mean? I didn’t understand that.

        • Germandude

          Hey man, look. Thanks for precisely telling me your whereabouts. First, I actually don’t need to know your details. Second, as a friendly suggestion, let me say that you shouldn’t post so many private info online, especially since not many people will have your background. You should keep most private details to yourself.
          It certainly doesn’t make you an easier target if others don’t know everything about you.

          Having said that, I feel sorry for the bad impressions that you had. I must say though that, without exception, all the Chinese friends that I have in Europe (and the ones that are back in China), including my wife, would not confirm being looked down upon or being confronted with racism.

          I simply cannot get rid of the feeling that you push yourself into the role that you see yourself in. Now if you were a Morrocan in the Netherlands, or a Turkish in Germany, I could easily understand your points.

          One additional thing just because I noticed it while typing this. I didn’t downvote your above comments and feel it’s rather misplaced.

      • Kai

        I’m not following the logic here. Being part-white, believing one has the right to express an opinion, and being raised in a western democracy doesn’t preclude someone from feeling victimized or having a history of being victimized. There are tons of Western mixed-blood individuals who were bullied and made fun of for being Asian or Black or Arab or whatever. Maybe their part-whiteness wasn’t apparent, or maybe it didn’t even matter in the eyes of those who victimized them.

        Furthermore, I didn’t get the impression from Stefan’s comment that he wished this guy wasn’t allowed to express his opinion and show himself to be a retard in front of others. All he said is that he thinks this guy should be fired. That just means he believes certain things should have certain consquences, which is not at odds with a democratic society with freedom of speech.

        Am I missing something or…?

        • Germandude

          I don’t know how to further put it. I am pretty sure that I clearly pointed out why I think that Stefan Xu is

          1. trolling (occasionally)
          2. falling into a victim role when he thinks it suits him
          3. using double-standards

          You know, intelligent people, given Stefan’s multicultural background and education, I specifically put him into this group, could simply ignore an idiot like Gordon and move on to sth more important (like racism that he meets in his worklife). You know? Sth that matters. Paying attention to some idiot like him is not worth it.
          If I was to argue or cry everytime some Chinese makes a bad remark about me or my wife when walking down the road, I’d need a day that lasts 40 hours.

          “Why should the oak care if a pig rubs her?”

          • Kai

            1. I haven’t been closely following many of his conversations so it’s hard for me to judge this. I know he has said some objectionable things but I haven’t gotten the impression that he is trolling except for that one incident about the Phiippines where he admitted it, apologized for it, and I warned him not to say things “just to see the reactions”.

            2. Likewise, I don’t have an impression of him dishonestly falling into a victim role. To me, he’s complained about things he’s experienced, just like so many non-Chinese people regularly fall into a victim role about their experiences in China on cS. I don’t see much of a difference. People have grievances and express them. That they do so isn’t strange to me; I care more about how they express their grievances.

            3. Double standards would be an example of what would irk me about how some people express their grievances. I don’t know if Stefan is particularly guilty of it though because, like I said, I haven’t been following his discussions with others closely. Maybe you have and this is why you feel antagonistic towards him. I’m willing to review examples of him exhibiting double standards and that might help me better understand your reaction to him.

            That said, the logic of your initial comment didn’t make sense to me. None of the things you cited there have any bearing on victimization.

            I don’t think intelligent people with multicultural backgrounds and educations should simply ignore an idiot like Gordon. Dismissal is a valid reaction but it isn’t the only valid reaction. Gordon’s idiocy has influence and reach. He isn’t someone scrawling racist jokes in the corner of some abandoned shack. He’s on national TV and while we’d LIKE to think people are smart enough to not be influenced by him, we’d be STUPID to think he doesn’t have influence on society. Allowing free speech doesn’t mean speech shouldn’t be censured.

            There are so many things in this world that “matters” so arguments that there must be something “more important” than Gordon and everything his behavior may reflect is a bit dishonest. Isn’t there something in this world that “matters” more than Stefan’s indignation on cS? See how that works? This is a bad argument. It’s basically telling people “you shouldn’t care about this because I don’t.”

            Oaks don’t feel articularly threatened by pigs using them to scratch themselves, but I can empathize with why ethnic Chinese people do feel threatened by being publicly ridiculed and denigrated on national TV.

    • Chris

      In which case, can we fire the Chinese lady who told me I wasn’t allowed in to her shop because she didn’t trust foreigners not to steal things? Can we fire the security guard who laughed when an old man started berating me as a 洋鬼子 who was probably carrying various venereal diseases simply because of my skin colour? While this joke is surely offensive, and in bad taste, I’ve heard MUCH worse. He should’ve known better, but he’s not the first (nor the worst by a long shot) to make an inappropriate ‘joke’.

      • grand

        i think you are just making up stories.

        • Chris

          Think what you like, I’m not in the habit of getting into trolling wars online. It doesn’t change the fact that these things, and many more (including being physically attacked for being a foreigner) happened. If you read my earlier posts, you would know I’d actually said the following:

          “Racism exists in every society… I’ve personally been called all the unpleasant names you can imagine in Chinese… But do I think all Chinese are racist bigots? No. Because these idiots exist in every society and do not represent their country as a whole – and I’m glad to see many netizens in China also see things the same way…”

          I majored in Chinese as my undergraduate, and am currently working towards a PhD in historical attitudes to ethnicity in China. I love China and its people, and it feels like my second home. I think I made a fairly objective point about how racism is ubiquitous, and it’s unfair to accuse a particular nation or group of being more racist than any other. I’m not going to feed trolls though, so downvote me all you like.

          • grand

            why was you attacked? it just sounded very strange. but i find your claim that china es the most racist country very unreasonable.

            you never hear stories like this in china:
            http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/2013/02/04/09/44/man-bashed-helping-drunk-friend
            http://www.smh.com.au/national/chinese-students-at-risk-in-australia-20120426-1xn5v.html
            http://m.theage.com.au/victoria/its-my-fing-country-racist-rant-caught-on-camera-20130412-2hp76.html
            http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/they-are-capable-of-everything-says-woman-attacked-by-teen-girls-on-bus-20130416-2hxjn.html#ixzz2QcpHoe8H
            http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/yonhap-news-agency/130321/korean-man-australia-assault

            that’s australia, a country of 23 million people you get constant reports of racist attacks in that country. now china, a country of 1 billion, you rarely hear foreigners are attacked because of their race. i think it’s pretty self-evident that china is a much safer country for foreigners.

          • Chris

            No idea whatsoever. It was a seemingly random incident. I was minding my own business, walking near Sanlitun bar street in Beijing (note – I was not drinking, or going to a bar that evening. I had actually just finished dinner and was heading home). A very drunk Chinese guy leapt out of his seat and punched me in the face, and continued trying to hit me, while shouting slurred nonsense about how much he hated foreigners. His friends soon intervened, dragged him away, and were really apologetic.

            My point being – I didn’t come away from that shouting that all Chinese were violent racists. It only reaffirmed my view, that douchebags are douchebags in any language or culture – whether they be Dutch, Chinese or whatever. The vast majority of people around the world are pretty decent, and won’t tolerate idiots.

          • grand

            sorry to hear that. but i do think it’s a random incident and the guy was a drunk idiot. you are a level headed person that would not generalizing.

            but i think you would agree that you will rarely see, if ever, organized hate crimes targeting foreigners in china, unlike in countries such as australia, russia, Uk etc where they would hunt and bash, even kill foreigners on purpose.

          • whuddyasack

            “australia, russia, Uk”

            I would agree with you that violence against foreigners happens much less in countries like China than these 3 countries. Much, much less. However, out of the three, Australia and UK have a rather strong civil rights movement, so while violence does occur, there will be people supporting and rooting for the victim.

            In Russia, this isn’t the case at all. Only in Russia, can you find “neo-nazis” stabbing and killing 9 year old Armenian, Altaic, Black or Chechen little girls. Of course, I’m afraid there are some crazies in the US, Canada, Australia or the UK who actually think this is totally justifiable.

            I liked Chris’ overall message and despite my own doubts about all the racist encounters he had while in China, I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt.

          • Cameron

            There are less physical crimes in china full stop. Lets also remember that foreigners make up a tiny proportion of the population compared to the countries mentioned above. Eg iIf 1000 foreigners are victims of violent crime in Britain per year, it would only need for ONE foreigner in China to be a victim of violent crime to match it statistically.

          • whuddyasack

            Fair enough, but somehow, I never thought Russia had that many foreigners in the first place. I think you mixed up foreigners in Britain and China but I understand.

          • Kai

            Wait, where did he claim China is the most racist country? Can you link me to the comment where he said that?

      • Kai

        I would, if I were their employer. Whether or not Gordon will be fired really depends on the policies of his employer. It’s not as if we don’t know that people have been fired or NOT fired for similar offenses before.

    • mr.wiener

      Oh cry me a bloody river…..
      ….hey, you aren’t Tobias Hubinette by any chance are you?

    • Guest23

      Some advice, be careful what you write and how you write it, we can view your entire comment history, and this constant back-and-forth of your opinions and beliefs is kinda destroying your credibility.

  • Chris

    Disheartened by comments stating racism is a basically a foreign/Western invention (the irony in those statements is delicious though – accusing “the others” of inventing racism…) though I’m actually encouraged by the sensible rational discussion netizens seem to be having. In particular:

    “It’s not that bad. Aren’t we a bit discriminatory against Japan and bang zi?”

    Racism exists in every society, and there will always be idiots making tasteless ‘jokes’ at the expense of a minority group. In my experience, casual racism is far more prominent in China than many other countries. I’ve personally been called all the unpleasant names you can imagine in Chinese, I’ve been physically attacked for being a white guy, been asked to leave establishments because of the colour of my skin. But do I think all Chinese are racist bigots? No. Because these idiots exist in every society and do not represent their country as a whole – and I’m glad to see many netizens in China also see things the same way. It’s possibly just that China has such a huge population, so by default, there will be a larger number of idiots.

    • Malcom X

      Nope. Racism is pretty much
      inherent to whites. Others behave like that towards whites to give them a
      taste of their own medicine.

      Racism is pretty much a white thing. Others just try to badly copy it.

    • mwanafa

      I agree with many of your points, but the Chinese are taught to discriminate others since birth, so most do end up being racist.

  • gnikep

    Gay Gordon
    is a low level simple minded fool, who likes to be witty on the account of
    others, but cannot take any criticism himself

  • markus peg

    The first comment “xiao wang” is not appropriate but liveable ok moving on
    then again another hit with “38 with rice” WTF! what a DICK! what the hell was he thinking..

  • Mateusz82

    Maybe that judge is racist… but nothing was said about any race. China is a country. It’s a country with 56 recognized ethnicities (and plenty of unrecognized ethnicities) living in it.

  • Mateusz82

    It’s a country, one where many races live, but only the Han-race actually matters, so therefore, anything directed at China must only concern the Han Chinese.

    It makes as much sense as Canadians claiming racism against the Canadian race (or the North American race) if someone makes fun of Justin Beiber.

  • Mateusz82

    It’s racist because victim-mongers say so.

    • mr.wiener

      To be fair, most of the Chinese comments were very reasonable, only a few victim-mongers amongst them.

      • Mateusz82

        That is true, actually. I definitely respect the Chinese comments calling to not blow it out of proportion, and to actually think about what really happened (tasteless jokes about national stereotypes, yes, but not necessarily racist jokes) before jumping the gun. The accusations of racism tend to be more from non-Chinese.

  • Sean

    Is it possible the judge is too stupid to know he is being racist?

    • mr.wiener

      Racism is ignorance.

      • ThomasER916

        Racism is realism.

        It’s the Useful Idiot who never lived among Amerindians of Mexico or Brazil that ironically blathers about “ignorance.” Those people who have had extensive contact with the Negroes of Haiti are the exact opposite of “ignorant.” People like you who posture enlightenment while living away from low-IQ races are not simply “ignorant”, you’re indoctrinated beyond stupid.

        Why don’t you move to Haiti?

        Why don’t you move to Zimbabwe?

        Zimbabwe used to be Rhodesia. What happened? Did magical “racism” occur?

        Detroit used to be the “Motor City”. What happened? Did magical “racism” occur?

        Los Angeles was a paradise until it became a “sanctuary city” for Mexican Amerindians. What happened? Did magical “racism” occur?

        The Koreans were able to thrive along with Whites in Los Angeles. Both were targeted by blacks and Mexican Amerindians. What happened? Did magical “racism” occur?

        • mr.wiener

          “low-IQ races” ….oh dear.
          I’ll be over here where the crazy ain’t.

          • ThomasER916

            Yeah, it’s just “crazy” to think you inherited your organs from your parents. Just “insane” to believe you weren’t delivered by a stork. Just “nuts” to know the DNA of your parents and their ancestors created you.

            That’s just “lunacy.” Everyone who’s “sane” understands that we have a magical brain that came from the Spaghetti Monsters and all evolution stops at the neck.

          • mr.wiener

            Back to Chimpout with you mate.
            Go troll elsewhere.

  • chandlerpatrick

    Wow… That’s so… soft… Seriously people. Everyone is getting to politically correct these days… I love me some racial humor. I enjoy the stereotypes. I don’t care if people of other races make fun of me (for being white Irish). In fact I get it all the time “Hide the booze, the Irishman just walked in…” funny stuff.
    I was watching south park the other day, and they were ripping on Japanese.
    “Sony has just offered a new PS4 Black Friday Bundle, called the Brack Friday Bunduru”
    I’m sure that the Chinese would find that funny – making fun of Japanese?
    Seriously, Chinese people are some of the most racist people in the entire world, and that comes from them growing up in such a homogenous society.
    Chinese people need to stop feeling so fucking butt-hurt everytime someone pokes fun at them. So insecure. It’s not like they don’t make racist comments and jokes about other’s themselves….

  • grand
    • Ummm except here in Aus with the Indians….it was another Indian doing it all! Most others were crimes of opportunity. It could have been anyone. Don’t do a today tonight and go all gossip style. I know the facts can ruin a good story though.

      • grand

        that doesn’t change the fact that there are many many racist attacks in australia. there is a long history of racism in australia. how about the “white australia” policy?

        http://www.smh.com.au/national/australias-safety-questioned-after-three-attacks-on-south-koreans-20121127-2a5b0.html

        • Fact? Where are these facts? A few samples of idiots like in the Dutch show? My wife is Chinese – she has never had a problem. Unlike in China when fat old men with their Hong Ta Shan’s yelled out traitor to her.

          Your agenda is very clear. I’m happy to have a debate – just quit it with the intellectually lazy polemics.

          There are only a couple of countries in the world that have never:

          – Had a civil war
          – Been fascists
          – Been communists
          – Got invaded
          – Did some invading
          – Suffered famine or disease

          You name it. You had better try harder if you want to try and embarrass or denigrate Australia.

          • grand

            i’m not saying you, and all australians are racist. but there are many racist attacks and hate crimes in australia so i guess there are quite a few bad apples in australia.

            i have a few friends who studied in australia . they told me australians in general are very friendly and generous people who would help out strangers in need.but they also told me they were verbally abused quite frequently. however, they were never physically attacked.

            if you search the internet you would find a lot of racist attacks in australia by gangs, mostly by young people. that’s quite disturbing as australia is a country with a very small population. there are very few, if any at all, racially based organized attacks on foreigners in china. i’d say china is safer for foreigners in this regard.

          • I agree China is safer. I lived there for a decade and never felt threatened at any time. I am not disputing that bad stuff doesn’t happen here or anywhere else. What I am saying is that negative news tends to travel and get spread more than positive news.

            I hear as much mandarin on a daily basis here as I hear in Beijing. It is insane how many Chinese there are. Is this a bad thing? No – but we wouldn’t be able to sustain such numbers if there was a deep structural racist problem.

            We like any other country – especially the west that through social welfare makes people lazy, weak, stupid and non self reliant – fucking arse holes that are just devolving sequences of DNA with legs. I get that. However they do not represent a statistically significant or even every day significant slice of the cultural pie.

          • grand

            yes. . my friends told me that Australians in general are very nice, mild tempered, and kind-hearted. more kind-hearted and better mannered than chinese.

          • ESL Ninja

            You can’t really compare. When was the last time you heard of a laowai criminal gang in China? There are fucking loads of Chinese criminal gangs in the UK/US/AUS trafficking sex workers, importing drugs and weapons etc.

          • ElectricTurtle

            Australia? Pfff… the main reason they’ve escaped being guilty of some such villainy as on your arbitrary list is a) they’re too young a country, one of the youngest on Earth, even more so than the Americas b) low population density c) everything around them is a shitty backwater… you don’t see a lot of contention for Papua New Guinea do you?

            Furthermore, you’ve conveniently ignored Australians’ past crimes toward the aborigines including kidnapping their children. You’re not nearly the stainless moral paragons you’re disingenuously pretending to be.

          • Who is?

            Just sayin. We all learn from history. The fact is the top 4 countries in the world across many score cards is a clean sweep for the Anglosphere.

            Easy to make excuses why something has never happened. Like why Qantas is the only airline in the world to never have crashed. There are a millions reasons why.

            I too can play that game. “If I had a vagina – I’d be a woman”.

            It is hardly an argument. I am stating facts. You are stating theories. Big difference.

            PS the list isn’t arbitrary. All those topics are ones that led to global problems for all and for generations to come within the country in question. Yeah maybe our recycling rate sucks – but whatever – that doesn’t show up on the “Time line of the century” charts.

          • mr.wiener

            Your moral outrage on behalf of the Koori and Murri peoples is heartwarming. I’m sure if I pass along the fact that you are scoring points in online debates using their plight as ammunition it will steel their spines, lift their spirits and inspire them to continue their struggles.

    • Cameron

      Well firstly it’s hardly a fair comparison seeing that foreigners as a group are virtually non- existent outside of first tier and a handful of second tier cities. Let alone actual sub groups of foreigners.

      Second, not heard of riots at Nanjing Uni over a local dating a BLACK GUY? What about police beating the shit out of Africans in Guangzhou? There’s already fuss by some over a few hundred thousand laowai, ie about 0.005% of China’s population daring to say marry a local. Times that number of foreigners by a THOUSAND and then we’ll see which country is more tolerant.

      • grand

        there are a lot of foreigners in china. go look up the stats. it’s on the internet. and you rarely hear foreigners attacked due to their race.

        and they are not all racially based as police brutality are common in china. i though you knew that since you claim you live in china for a long time.

        and since we are on the topic of police brutality on foreigners, by comparison:

        the guy killed was handcuffed. he was tazered up to 14 times while he was already on the ground.

        http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2012/11/tase-n20.html

        here is another one

        http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/death-of-vietnamese-student-turns-spotlight-on-police-and-stun-guns-20120409-1wl49.html

      • Back when the Chinese embassy in Yugoslavia was bombed – mobs of students patrolled around BLCU shouting out at every white person “NI Shi Mei Guo Ren”. To which a mate politely responded… “No we are fucking English and Australian – fuck off”.

    • My_honourable_lord

      Wait until you have seen the level of immigration that these countries have experienced.

      Boxer riots?

  • TheSOP

    USA really tickles to old inferiority complex bone.

  • mwanafa

    Chinese tend to think that their racism is simply just a way to differentiate and (interact with) people. But this is just a way to justify their racism, they just think it’s ok to discriminate against a foreigner, but not ok for a foreigner discriminate against them.

  • whuddyasack

    This is actually a very good story and I think we can actually learn a lot from this. It’s good that many Chinese have become much more open-minded, and many have raised good arguments and gave good advice to fellow citizens. It’s also nice to see them have sensible discourse amongst themselves without resorting to swearing or flaming. I hope to see even better discussions in future.

    One thing I must say, I’m very impressed with Dutch society. To be honest, many might disagree with me, but I don’t find Gordon’s comments that offensive, but I do understand that it is tasteless and insensitive.

    I’m surprised how readily the Dutch (including fellow judges, audiences and the public) showed their distaste of Gordon’s jokes. It was very nice of them to defend the rights of minorities no matter how small and this openness and friendliness, especially of people of a different color is something I’ve always secretly envied. Of course, there are jerks in every country and not everyone can be generalized as good or bad. But I think if Chinese made it a priority to be nice to everyone around, starting with our own people, it would work wonders in the future. They stood up for the Chinese even before the Chinese themselves. Wow. Perhaps I should thank the next Dutch I meet (wink).

    We really could learn a thing or two from them, and I hope that Chinese would become more open-minded and understanding in the future. The flare-ups and horrible commentary against Japanese and Filipinos a good place to start.

    As for what we can do about jokes such as these, I think we as a people just need to grow thicker hides, learn to laugh along and hit back with jokes of our own. I think people like the Dutch can take it and teach us a thing or two about humor. ;-)

    • TheSOP

      As a documented racist yourself you are hardly qualified to comment or pass judgement on this story, in fact the only comment your should be writing is a self-criticism and apology to the racist abuse you have directed towards non-Asian posters on this site. Anyone taking a cursory look at your comment history can see you are little more than a bigoted racist. In fact within one 24 hour time period you posted 26 pages of hate speech (in 10p font mind you) referencing “Whites” 42 times all in racist and derogatory ways. I recommend you take this opportunity to reflect and write an apology for your blatant racism and hate speech, typified by the comment below which was made by you just this week:

      Whattasack’s own words:

      “But what can we do about their tribalism, Kai? I’ve learned from other Asians that Caucasians have so much more negroid blood in them that we “must understand their seemingly strange and savage and confrontational” ways. The problem is “civilized” people don’t want to have to deal with violent, aggressive dudes with inferiority complexes. I’m telling you, you can be the nicest person in the world and these people will still come charging at you and picking a fight.”

      • David

        Wait a second, does that mean I DO have rhythm and I can jump?

        • TheSOP

          Yes but is probably still too early to run around saying “Whats up my negroid”!

          • David

            “Cough spit cough” yea, I guess I will skip that part. lol

        • mr.wiener

          Cool! I have soul! David has soul! SOP, you are soul!

          • TheSOP

            This guy didnt take it so well:

          • whuddyasack

            You and David have soul as you’re much more civilized. SOP however behaves like a complete n-word.

          • TheSOP

            Whattasack: “But but I’m not racist :( !”

            Keep digging your hole racist Asian-supremacist.

        • whuddyasack

          Maybe. But that might have more to do with practice and innate abilities than being part-black. As for SOP aka POS, he has no soul, no rhythm, no athletic abilities. He’s only got the worse of the whining, forever-victimized Black American as well as the savagery of the jungle and ghettos.

          Sadly, as I’m typing this, my bonehead neighbors are having a drunken brawl downstairs. My room is shaking. Again… :-(

          • David

            So I have to ask, do you think people (black people specifically) have racial memories? How else could they have the savagery of both the ghettos and the jungle? BTW I was also wondering how all the white people got black blood in them and the Asians managed to avoid it? Did the Latinos also avoid it? Sorry, you brought it up so I have to ask.

          • whuddyasack

            Not a problem and no need to apologize. I’m more than delighted to respond and enjoy talking about these sorts of things. Most of this is more or less teasing POS and certain WN types here since they’re the only ones whining and bringing up this “racism” card thing. I’m only doing it so that they can understand what hypocrisy means. They are the type that hate on Blacks yet don’t realize they are acting exactly like what they feel their “mortal enemy” represents.

            The thing about SOP is he’s an insistent troll in many topics, but it’s good that you don’t pay much attention to him. You have some good troll-proof glasses, might I add.

            SOP baits fights in every topic and has a bad habit of harassing posters on Chinasmack. Before his bizarre obsession with me, Kamikazepilot took the brunt of his “virtual assaults”, so I hope you don’t take him or myself too seriously. More so SOP, since that person is a fake expat and is only doing this to bash on the Chinese.

            To be honest, POS (that was his original account) and I were probably trash talking at each other for a while now; it’s just that we both got banned and are now posting under different names. But overall, SOP’s been here much longer than me. Much longer. There’s another old timer “troll” here, who accused me of being someone here and unintentionally revealed how long he’s been into Chinese-bashing in the process. He’s basically the same person that’s ragging on about tribalism, immigration, nationalism and fascism here BTW.

            This is actually a very interesting discussion, so I’ll discuss it with you.

            For the record, I don’t really think Black people have racial memories but I actually do know Asians who do. While I don’t believe in all this, and think it’s quite silly, sadly I know and was previously in contact with Asians who do and they have tried “converting” me to join their cause. I refused of course.

            While it’s not my personal opinion or belief (I think nationality makes more sense than “race”), I can’t deny that what they brought was fascinating in a perverse way. The sad thing was that many were just so young. Such intelligent and articulate minds ruined by an ugly disease. But that’s the world we live in, we live in a race-focused society, and complaining and playing victim does no good.

            They basically believed in the existence of a Mongoloid race, among 4 different races, which is the pinnacle of human evolution. They quoted “standard” human biodiversity stuff like Rushton and Lynn. You know, all that jazz about IQ and low propensity for violence. However, it got more interesting once they brought in the charts, data, skull and cranial measurements, genetic mappings and testing, even references from all sorts of researchers from different countries, paleontologists, anthropologists, psychologists. You name it, they got it.

            Most interesting of all was their data/research on the “supernatural powers” of Asians. Basically, they referenced to the various psychic abilities amongst Asians, things such as telepathy, clairvoyance, setting things on fire with a single thought, chi, telekinesis, flowers blooming with a single hand motion. They linked some clips of Asian children mind bending spoons, floating, and monks performing the unbelievable. Unfortunately, these videos have been removed, I’ve noticed that some of them have been banned from sites like youtube, lol. Good for them.

            Anyways, how it ties down to genetics is this. They stated that this Mongoloid race was an ice-age race that evolved “exclusively” from the others, they were a result of the treacherous cold while negroids and caucasoids shared a common origin in North Africa/Middle East and were a result of much intermingling. From what I gather from their “data”, they seemed to indicate that negroids and caucasoids were more closely related to each other than to mongoloids because of the harsh cold, the Arctic, Altai mountains and Himalayas being some sort of isolating barrier to the world beyond Asiatics. I remember seeing so much “genetic” and “racial” research being shown that I wondered and still do how there are so many “weird scientists” out there and what made them such crazies.

            Sadly, according to them, Latinos did not avoid negroid influence, most of them being of mulatto stock. A combination of negroid and caucasoid influence. However, Native Americans, Siberians and Inuit type peoples were part of their FAMILY (Go figure /sarcasm).

            Oh, and they were always, always pushing for segregation between the Asian diaspora and other races, using violent crimes of other races as an excuse. That was when I saw them for what they were. I might be accused of racism by some here, but I honestly can tell right from wrong and am certainly NOT one. I can sympathize when an Asian is raped and murdered or assaulted and nobody seems to care, or when Okinawans are raped and killed but I think “racism” is never a solution.

            Of course, I admit to shamelessly parroting them without their overt and “scientific racism” because I saw how effective they were at peeving off and outclassing their non-Asian opponents.

            But long story short, I don’t believe in any of this but have known and met people who do. Sorry for a long and possibly boring screed, but I’ve always valued and admired your wisdom. And this has been something that’s bothered me for a while, though I can’t figure out why.

          • David

            Well, I appreciate you explaining this to me. I have been here on CS for less then a year (and have been posting for less than two months) and it is nice to get view points from others on how things got to be how they are.

            By nature and training I am a skeptical person, so when somebody tells me something I look for the proof before I simply take their word for it.

            I have come across the type of “pseudo-science” that your acquaintances presented to you, before. It is neither new or convincing. It is normally used to justify treating others as less important (or less than human, when it was applied to African slaves by whites 180 years ago).

            Basically I am hear to read what others have to say. Some of it will be true in an objective sense, some in a subjective sense (true for them), and other things will be simple baiting. It is all good for me as I am interested in how they act on-line not in reaching any ultimate truth by these discussions. In other words, While I prefer that everybody speak honestly and fairly to each other in respectful tones, even when they are mean and ignorant and obnoxious (or simply disingenuous in their arguments) I still learn about them. In addition, I do get insights into behavior in China. Looking at charts, and numbers works when you want to study somethings (and is really necessary when looking at the large picture) coming to China for two years has given me a chance to look at things on a grassroots level (such as how much does the average Chinese citizen interact with even low level government officials, what is required of a small business owner in terms of following regulations, how connected to outside sources of information is the average college student, farmer, politician, or business person). These are things that are difficult to study when looking at tables showing the number of Chinese students who come to the U.S. to study but do not go back, or the the number of Chinese/foreigners being married each year. Statistics are good for some things but not everything.

          • whuddyasack

            Hi David, I’m sorry for my late reply. I was caught up in exams and wasn’t able to write up to speed. You’re welcome and I wouldn’t mind explaining things to you since I feel you are a good listener.

            It’s good to have you on board since I feel you bring some very interesting things into any discussion. Yes, when reading statistics, it is important to realize that we are not statistics.

            Belated, but welcome aboard the crazy house known as Chinasmack BTW. Actually I realize we’ve been on and posting on this joint around the same time, although I was here slightly longer than you. ;P

          • David

            Well, I hope you did well on your exams. It has been a few years but I do remember the pressure of doing well on finals.

          • whuddyasack

            Thank you. Really appreciate it. I’m waiting on the results but I think I did reasonably well.

            I’m glad I’m not alone in feeling that exams are truly stressful. It must’ve been tough on you as well to remember the pressure of excelling in finals after all these years. :-)

          • TheSOP

            And if you didn’t think he was a bat-shit crazy racist before, here is another self-indictment. No wait I see clairvoyant floating Asians aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaalllllllllllllllllll the time out here :P Is this the Asian equivalent of racist emo/goths? Parroting is accurate, your disavowals of believing this non-sense, questionable.

            Some people I think you would get on well with: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation_of_Islam#Teachings_on_race

          • whuddyasack

            Yawn… I’ve clearly stated that I don’t agree with them in the more racial aspects. There are things that I definitely cannot deny since I’m not one to snub facts right under my nose, such as higher IQs, artistic and musical talent and lower crime rates, but that’s it. I just found these superhuman abilities supposedly found amongst Asians interesting.

            Funny with the getting along bit. Culturally, genetically and politically you have far more in common with Muslims than I do. For one, I don’t spout militant nonsense, call out for blood, cry wacist or have any desire to put whole nations in “their place” militarily because I disagree with them. I’ve never liked Islam fundamentalism and never will. So much for getting along lol.

          • connie

            Interesting.

      • whuddyasack

        So it’s wrong for me to complement how proactive the Dutch were to combat racism? So it’s wrong of me to admire their civility and express my surprise? What the Dutch did and stood for was “noble”, and I wouldn’t mind that China and the Chinese take note and learn from it. As a people, we need to have thicker hides and not let “hurt feelings” affect our actions. It’s unfortunate that such advise seems more suitable for you than for the Chinese.

        Is it wrong of me to admire the Chinese for allowing logic to take charge when the past week has been a particularly trying one where harsh words were spilled all over the place?

        I have a right to comment, you have a right to troll. Deal with it.

        As for my comment, I can’t believe you’re taking all this so seriously. Just chill out and not let that angry Caucasian tug at your nuts. Understand that I was offering Kai some “stress relief” since he was being ATTACKED by you and “PROBOPASS” lol.

        Oh one more thing regarding Chinese “superiority”, you insecure baboon. Xiao Wang showed far more dignity and manliness in the face of ‘real’ discrimination than you and the so called sissy “White Nationalists” coming here crying. His good nature put all of you to shame. You’ve yet to experience 1/1000th of what he felt yet feel justified to moan and scream “tribalism”. You bitch, bellow and foam at the mouth decrying your abuse in “Chinasmack” while making ridiculous names like Asian Male Insecurity, Gook Filth, Stop Korean Racism and POS (Lol, as if you didn’t sound like a troll already).

        Gosh, you sure are a disgusting bunch of knuckle walkers, it’s almost funny if I wasn’t gagging.

        • Kai

          Sigh. No one has the right to troll.

        • TheSOP

          Nothing I wrote is untrue, you did post 26 pages of 10p font comments within one 24 hour period referencing “Whites” 42 times. Fact.

          The nonsense about negroids was posted by you not me, own up to your words or at least have the courage to disavow and apologize for posting racist nonsense.

          As an unapologetic racist you are in no position to judge, criticize, or even applaud the Dutch until you carry out a serious introspection of your own racism and hate speech which has been posted here among other forums.

          If you consider facts trolling then you just got trolled by reality pal. Hear what I’m saying guy? Apologize buddy.
          http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/155469/go-ahead-apologize

          • whuddyasack

            “As an unapologetic racist you are in no position to applaud the Dutch”

            Thanks for the chuckle. And who are you to decide? Let’s put it this way, Xiao Wang showed far more dignity and class than a victim-card playing, wacist crying loser like you.

  • nqk123

    racism is everywhere. that a fact

  • Paulos

    Minimum percentage of paranoid/enraged comments based on scandal’s country of origin*:

    Allied nation with strong-handed regime: 10%
    Relatively neutral/continental EU nation: 20%
    Third-world/impoverished resource trap: 30%
    UK: 40%
    Korea: 50%
    Taiwan: 60%
    USA: 70%
    India: 80%
    ASEAN: 90%
    Japan: 100%

    Hmm, I’m still not sure about the order, some close calls… any suggestions out there?

    *I’m sure this happens all over, it’s just exacerbated here to an unbecoming degree.

    • My_honourable_lord

      Stick HK in there too. Not sure about percentages on that one though.

  • Freddi BuBu

    Dude looks like a caricature of the stereotypical Chinese male in the very worse way……

    • YourSupremeCommander

      I know, him and a lot of people look like you.

  • Freddi BuBu

    Guy might as well wear a sign that says “kick me, I’m a goofy looking Chinaman”…….

    • ptptp

      No sign is needed to show that you’re goofy looking.

  • Nilerafter24

    I am too.. And I know how you feel, believe me. But it’s much better not to let BCDs (bad china days) get the better of you.
    For every hateful Chinese person here there are like 50 better ones. This I know from experience.
    Don’t let ignorant people drag you down to their level.

  • videmus

    I think anyone who experiences racial bigotry, in China or anywhere else, would feel the GREATEST empathy towards Xiao Wang’s experience on that stage, and actually feel bad for him and support him.

    Oh the other hand, your argument is merely that because some Chinese have directed racist remarks at you, therefore Chinese who were not involved in or supportive of racial bigotry, up to and including Xiao Wang, do not deserve empathy. You’ve cast your personal grievances with certain Chinese individuals upon Chinese people at large.

  • Free Man

    Especially after your experience you should understand him. If not you just became an asshole, maybe for a reason, but still an asshole. Actually you are quite the same as the chinese people you complain about. If you point out something bad about chinese people towards them, they will always point back for whatever reason they can think instead of reflecting on it.

    I am a white, but I experienced exactly the same, from chinese (yeah, that can happen, too) and other nationalities. Still, or rather because of this, I understand others having the same issues. Yeah, some idiots are screwed up and look down on others, Thing is, that is not reserved for black people in China. It happens to everyone who goes abroad. But thats no reason to become the same.

  • Kai

    They’re not necessarily the same Chinese people. Don’t expect Chinese people to all act or react in the same way.

  • Kai

    Ask this guy.

  • Kai

    To nitpick your example in #2, I would say talk of that nature between close friends is understood VERY differently than comments between strangers where there isn’t an entire context of mutual understanding borne out of an established friendship between the speaker and listener. I think a lot of people might be racist with their friends but know they shouldn’t with people who don’t know them well enough to discount that racism.

    A better example is simply pointing at those Chinese netizens who publicly post comments on the internet calling for the wiping out of Japanese people or whatever. I think a number of Chinese netizens rightfully pointed that out, which was reassuring.

  • Kai

    I don’t think your hypothetical is analogous. Try white guy in front of a Chinese judge who repeatedly jokes about the guy being a English teacher who was a loser back home and then mocks his accent when speaking Chinese, turns around to the Chinese audience and says perhaps something like “he looks like a hairy ape” (that’s perhaps worse than “chinese restaurant waiter” but you get the point, I hope).

    I’m confident a lot of white people would be pretty indignant and resentful about it, and rightfully so. This guy was mocked on public television. How many times have we had foreigners complain about being called a “laowai” in casual encounters?

  • Chris Granzow XI

    “Just look at it as entertainment. Foreigners’ humor all has a bit of ridicule/mockery in it. Don’t be oversensitive.”

    Exactly, but what bothers me more is the asian-americans who were born and raised here and still don’t understand that, like with the jimmy kimmel thing. This globalized world is becoming strange. People are protesting tv shows that are half-way around the globe and aren’t even aimed at them.

    • TheSOP

      Some revel in state sanction victim complexes, some find political expediency in contrived controversies.

  • don mario

    the video doesn’t work so i cant actually check it but if this guy actually said that…. that is fucking disgusting. this guy needs to be taken down a few pegs. fined, fired, made to publicly appologise.. i don’t know. but this is straight up unacceptable.

  • mr.wiener

    Aboriginals mate, Or Kooris, Murris and other regional groups.They were there for 40,000 years [one of the first groups out of Africa] before we came and f*cked them up.
    We are NOT proud of this fact.

  • mwanafa

    If you are a foreigner, you must have encountered a situation where a parent/nanny/grandpa/grandma in a street with their kids, right after they see you they will start telling their kids things like “Look, you see that guy, you see his skin is different from us, he can’t even speak our Chinese, he is a foreigner …. etc etc”, not to mention what their teachers, media teaches them about foreigners.
    Need I say more?

  • Cauffiel

    This guy probably was not trying to be racist or embarrass the guy, just get a few laughs at a silly joke. But I bet its super shitty to have someone say that shit to you when you’re in such a vulnerable spot (on a globally broadcasted stage). This is a rare time I consider an apology to be in order.

    • Francis Dashwood

      I would agree it is not like he made comments about slitty eyes or something. People need to lighten up. If it had been an indian or even an english man up there, this guy would have had some wise ass comments to make I bet.

  • TheSOP

    Whattasack’s cousin showed up

  • Peter Breedveld
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