Child Slapped For Pressing Button for Every Floor in Elevator

A hand/finger pressing an elevator button.

From NetEase:

17-Year-Old Boy Slapped For Pressing The Elevator Buttons For All the Floors From 3 to 27

China Business News report — “Even if the child is wrong, you still shouldn’t hit a child, because children have their dignity.” On the evening of October 31st, while riding an elevator home, after Ms. He’s son Young Du got out of the elevator on the second floor, he pressed all the buttons for floors 3 to 27, resulting in being slapped in the neighborhood community’s security surveillance room.

The boy involved

I pressed the buttons before exiting the elevator out of curiosity

The Xi’an city North Changle East Park community residential buildings all have 27 floors with two elevators for six units per floor. Ms. He and her son Young Du’s home is located on the second floor of one of the buildings.

At 9:50pm on October 31st, 17-year-old Young Du and his mother Ms. He were returning home together and rode the elevator to the second floor. “I was just curious at the time, and pressed to light up the buttons for floors 3 to 27 before exiting the elevator,” said Young Du yesterday.

At the time, it was just Young Du and his mother in the elevator at the time. After seeing her son’s “mischief”, Ms. He criticized him after getting home: “You need to consider how long people in the floors above have to wait before they can take the elevator because of this. You are already 17 years old and cannot continue doing things that damage other people’s interests [do things that hurt/inconvenience others].”

Child’s mother

Child was called to the residential community security surveillance room, where a man smacked him

“Around 10:20pm in the evening, someone suddenly knocked on the door,” Ms. He said, “It was a residential community security guard, and they said they were looking for my child, but they didn’t say what for.”

Ms. He accompanied Young Du and followed the security guard to the residential community’s security surveillance room. She described what happened as such: “In front of the security monitors sat a middle-aged man in a leather jacket who pointed at the video monitor and asked my son if this person [in the video] was him. Just as my son said it was him, this man immediately smacked my child across the left side of his face. Multiple security guards in uniform present began criticizing the two of us.”

Yesterday, the left side of Young Du’s face was still a bit swollen.


Reporter’s investigation

It took over 7 minutes before the elevator reached the top floor after the boy pushed the buttons

This China Business News journalist examined the recording of when Young Du rode the elevator:

That night at 9:50:27pm, Young Du and his mother entered the elevator, and he pressed the 2nd floor. At 9:50:54, the elevator reached the 2nd floor, and as he was exiting the elevator, Young Du pressed and lit up the buttons for floors 3 to 27. The elevator went upward, without anyone in it, stopping on every floor. At 9:53:00, the elevator reached the 10th floor, still without anyone in it. At 9:55:09, the elevator reached the 18th floor, and still without no one in it. At 9:58:03, the elevator reached the 27th floor, and after the doors closed, the empty elevator proceeded downward.

“The elevator is basically 3 seconds a floor, and under normal circumstances, it requires a little over a minute to travel from the 1st floor to the 27th floor. However, because the elevator had to stop on every floor, it took the elevator seven to eight minutes to travel from the first floor to the 27th floor,” said a member of the residential community property management, “If this had happened during the morning or evening rush hour, with over a hundred households and residents all waiting for the elevator, what a problem it would have been.”

Incident progresses

Boy’s mother wants an apology, property management refuses to provide information about the assault

“My child was wrong, but he already admitted his mistake, so he shouldn’t have been slapped,” Ms. He said, “As a 17-year-old child, he has his dignity. To be slapped in front of that many people, especially in front of his own mother, this will have a [negative] effect on him emotionally/psychologically.” She wants an apology, but was refused.

Yesterday, a representative for the residential community’s security team said the man who slapped Young Du wasn’t a member of property management, “He’s a resident in the same building. This resident had waited for the elevator for a long time only to discover that it was stopping on every floor. Afterward, he came to the security surveillance room to examine the surveillance footage and discovered that a resident on the 2nd floor had mischievously pressed all the floors. Then, with a security guard bringing the child to the surveillance room, the original idea was to just chastise the child face-to-face, but who knew the resident would immediately smack him.”

This China Business News reporter was unable to find this “resident” mentioned by this representative of the security team, and property management also refused to provide this person’s information.

At present, Ms. He has already asked the police for help, wants the person who hit her son to come out and give her son an apology. She also once again apologized for her son mischief in pressing all the buttons in the elevator, as well as promised that her son will never do it again.

Comments from NetEase:


Taking the elevator even for the 2nd floor, and then pressing all the other floors after taking the elevator, this resident very nicely taught this son who hasn’t been weaned a lesson for the mother. Well-slapped.

网易北京市网友 ip:58.135.*.* (responding to above)

And she has the gall to call the police. Now her son’s face is lost [embarrassed] throughout the entire residential community.

刺刀34 [网易江西省网友]:

Already a high school student, and he says it was for fun? And the mother who raises but doesn’t educate him even tries to find excuses? This too is too ridiculous.

脑残片专卖 [网易辽宁省沈阳市网友]:

Deserved it. Does he still think he’s 7 years old?

一曲蛋炒饭的赞歌 [网易江西省南昌市网友]:

A slap of justice. Well-slapped.

网易山西省朔州市网友 ip:124.167.*.*

So simply apologizing when you were wrong is enough? Then those who commit crimes don’t need to go to jail? 17 years old and still not knowing better. Sigh, what can spoiled unruly children do [to productively contribute to society] when they grow up?

网易北京市手机网友 ip:106.39.*.*

When you don’t properly teach your child at home, then someone is going to teach them for you. Deserved it and was hit/slapped too few times.

网易山东省网友 ip:140.246.*.*

When he was pressing the buttons, did his mother not see? It’s not like he just pressed one and she didn’t see.

网易北京市手机网友 ip:114.242.*.*

17 years old already so “child” my ass. If you were two or three years old and didn’t know any better, I could still put up with it and forgive it. But 17 years old and still doing such an inconsiderate thing? Deserved it. And dignity? He doesn’t even have any self-respect, so giving you any dignity would be pointless.

无人相伴 [榜上有名]:

Curiosity killed the cat.
A slap to the face.

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  • Zappa Frank

    The only interesting thing is the title “child slapped…” 17 years old is not a ‘child’ by any meaning…

    • Rick in China

      I was going to post the exact same thing.

      • Jannick Slavik

        well, you are both wrong.

        Legally, a “Child” is defined as a person under the age of majority.

        But since when do things like facts matter when opinions are free

        • Zappa Frank

          that is a “minor” not a child… but even if was true I don’t think news use lawyer’s terms for articles.

          • Jannick Slavik

            In case law, at least in Canada, a child is anyone under the age of majority (by default, a minor)

          • Zappa Frank

            as said, there is a difference between what is the use of some words for laws and what is the normal use. In daily life no one would ever call a 17 years old a child.

          • Jannick Slavik

            right, why appeal to the specific meanings of words when you can project your own experiences and prejudices to them???

            Sorry, but the “real world” doesn’t work that way. Get into business, law, or politics, and you’ll find that out real fast.

          • Zappa Frank

            I don’t think you have a clear idea of what you are talking about. Find me a dictionary that says “child” is everyone under 18 years old please…. I can wait

          • Jannick Slavik

            go read case law.

            or better yet, do you know of a website called “google”?

            even better, hire an attorney to do it for you. I can do it. $400 please… I’ll wait.

          • Zappa Frank

            since you are the one who believe “child” means anyone under 18 you should prove it..

          • Jannick Slavik

            wow, thanks. you make it sound like I invented the common law definition of “child”

            I’m honored

          • Zappa Frank

            again, if in a context “child” means anyone under 18 years old it doesn’t mean that the same definition is correct in any context.. Since we are not in a Canada’s tribunal I don’t think 17 years old can be called “child”. No need to be so polemic anyway, we are not talking about your mother

          • Jannick Slavik

            no worries!

            I just find it strange when people attempt to rationalize a grown man assaulting a 17 year old.


          • Probotector

            No one agrees with you, just shut up.

          • Teacher in China

            I agree with him.

          • Context mate. You’re removing all context.

            “I can’t believe people are attempting to rationaliSe (see the S there) dropping a nuclear bomb on a city”

          • Honoured.

          • Jannick Slavik

            hehe, just messing with you before.

            what is the LEGAL definition of “child pornography”?

            what is the LEGAL definition of “child labour”?

            what is the LEGAL defintiion of child abuse”

            and so on and so on and so on.

            either way, when the times comes, get a lawyer – DO NOT REPRESENT YOURSELF

          • Rick in China

            You’re just being an idiot. Biologically a child is between the ages of birth and puberty — in legal terms they would refer to this 17 year old person as a minor, or *her* child, and while if the term child was used in a legal sense, that would not alter the biological definition of child whatsoever. Legal terminology aside, your entire argument is nonsense and missing the point.

          • Jannick Slavik

            actually, the laymen term for “child” is the converse to “parent”

            The legal definition of child is synonymous with that of “minor” which is anyone under the age of majority (in China, this is 18).

          • Rick in China

            “Actually”? That’s another way the word can be used, it doesn’t change the *fact* that “child”, biologically speaking, is the term used to describe a human being between the ages of birth and puberty – just like “puppy” can describe a little dog.

          • Jannick Slavik

            yes, and my free advise is if you attack someone under the age of 18, expect them to be treated as a minor – i..e you just struck a child. When you lawyer up, that’s what they’ll tell you anyways.

            we are just going in circles here

          • Advice even.

          • Kai

            Did you just quote Wikipedia verbatim and pass it off as your own words?


            It’s hard to miss that Jannick’s point is couched in a legal sense. He did so right from his very first comment:

            Legally, a “Child” is defined as a person under the age of majority.

            Emphasis mine.

            It isn’t fair to attack him for a clear, factual point.

            And if we want to nitpick this, let’s look at:


            On average, girls begin puberty at ages 10–11; boys at ages 11–12.[1][2] Girls usually complete puberty by ages 15–17,[2][3][4] while boys usually complete puberty by ages 16–17.[2][3][5]

            Emphasis mine.

            So according to your source, Wikipedia, Jannick is still correct in saying a 17 year old boy can be called a “child”.

            His entire argument isn’t nonsense but you can say he’s missing your point while he can say the same about you.

          • Rick in China

            “Did you just quote Wikipedia verbatim and pass it off as your own words?”

            So, wikipedia uses the terms “between birth and puberty” – and if I use the terms, I’m copying verbatim? Interesting logic. I didn’t realize the definition of of the word “child” was so elusive that it must have been copied.

            “It isn’t fair to attack him for a clear, factual point.”

            No, Kai, the reason why his ‘clear, factual point’ is wrong, is because it was prefixed with “You are both wrong.” – whether it was straight up trolling or seriously thinks we’re wrong in our classification of this person not being a child — which in the biological sense, he is not…just by giving another definition doesn’t make the original one incorrect. “In this sense..technically…” doesn’t need to be prefixed with “you are wrong” – because we weren’t, here is why:

            “And if we want to nitpick this, let’s look at:

            That’s not how logic works. Because the biological definition of a child is between birth and puberty, and puberty can end for boys between 16-17, does not mean that a 17 year old boy is biologically defined as a child. In fact, once the onset of puberty starts, the ‘child’ is no longer biologically a child, but something else: an adolescent. Since you seem to think I am “passing off” wikipedia phrases as my own, I’ll let you look it up yourself, and wait for the apology for trying to correct me with incorrect conclusions.

          • Kai

            I’ll concede that “verbatim” is inaccurate. Everyone else can compare what I consider obvious similarities in structure and content.

            You’re just being an idiot. Biologically a child is between the ages of birth and puberty — in legal terms they would refer to this 17 year old person as a minor, or *her* child, and while if the term child was used in a legal sense, that would not alter the biological definition of child whatsoever. Legal terminology aside, your entire argument is nonsense and missing the point.

            Biologically, a child (plural: children) is generally a human between the stages of birth and puberty.[1][2] The legal definition of child generally refers to a minor, otherwise known as a person younger than the age of majority.[1]

            Child may also describe a relationship with a parent (such as sons and daughters of any age)[3]

            No, he’s not wrong for saying “you are both wrong” because Zappa said “17 years old is not a ‘child’ by any meaning…” and you said you would post the same thing. There IS a meaning where “17 years old” IS a “child”.

            Your comment above, which I believe was influenced by Wikipedia, confirms this.

            He very clearly said that “legally”, this kid can be considered a “child”. It doesn’t matter that you want to ex post facto limit it to “biologically” (which is still up for debate). Zappa said “any” and Jannick provided just one meaning where a 17 year old is indeed a “child”. Again, you yourself provided ANOTHER meaning, when “child” is being used to describe a relationship, as was the case here.

            He wasn’t trolling. He read a very specific statement by Zappa, your agreement, and immediately presented a clear, factual statement proving his belief that both of you are wrong.

            If Zappa said “biologically”, you might have an argument. But he didn’t. Neither did you. Instead, he said “any”.

            This is how logic works, when you honestly represent what was exactly said AND how a conversation unfolded.

          • Attorney? Isn’t that over kill? Surely a solicitor could do it? Or maybe a barrister. Oh shit hang on – we’re about to have a cross border definition debate over nothing!

          • Kai

            Come on, this is ridiculous.


            5. A person who is below the age of adulthood; a minor (person who is below the legal age of responsibility or accountability).


            Article 2 Minors as used in this Law refer to citizens under the age of eighteen.

            Jannick has a valid point. You do too. Your points aren’t mutually exclusive. Under Chinese law (and many other countries), “child” does indeed by definition include a 17 year old. Many people also indeed do not typically think of a 17-year-old teenager being a “child” in many contexts.

            The real underlying issue here is what I just posted in another comment, an issue of contextual dissonance. People think the “child” is being used to describe the teen’s age. No, it’s meant to communicate the teen’s relationship to another person in the story, the mother.

          • The real world also ain’t Canada. Let it go dude. Why do you care? Find a real issue to debate. 17 years old in most common law countries will get you an adult sentence and criminal record and go to an adult jail if you commit a crime. It is not considered a child at all. Nor should it be. You can even join the army at that age with parental consent!

          • Rick in China

            That’s exactly what I was thinking to post about – minors getting sentenced as adults, should work both ways – this kid was sentenced with a slap, as an adult, because he’s 17 years old.

          • Kai

            I think we’re getting hung up on contextual dissonance. People say “child” all the time even in reference to grown children, in China or outside of it.

            We’re thinking of “child” in terms of age. We’re thinking of children being young or small. It is however being used to establish “relationship”. The boy is the mother’s “child” and she’s a major part of the story.

            The usage here isn’t wrong, and arguably isn’t even sensationalistic. It’s just that readers are approaching it with a different context.

          • Zappa Frank

            in the title of article it doesn’t say ” a mother’s child” that would be already strange to describe a 17 years old, but ” child slapped”… Now, English may not be my language, but apparently many other native speakers found it strange as well.
            At 17 I think would be better “son” than “child”

          • Kai

            Because of contextual dissonance. It isn’t necessary to write “a mother’s child” because “child” itself communicates a relationship.


            Again, people think it is weird because they are judging the word in the context of the kid’s age and what they subjectively think is an age where someone is no longer referred to as a “child”.

            However, it was used here beause his mother is also part of the story. His identity is that of a “child” to a parent who is seeking an apology.

            If “child” was used to describe his age, I’d agree with everyone that it might be technically acceptable but highly counterintuitive. However, it isn’t counterintuitive if we recognize that it is meant to describe the parties involved in the story. Well, I still think it is counterintuitive BECAUSE the a lot of people will default to the first interpretation, but I will disagree with anyone who thinks “child” was used to describe the age. It wasn’t and it isn’t hard, especially for people fluent in English, to read the story and understand “child” describes an identity based on a relationship to another person in the news story.

            I’m hope you understand what I’m saying.

          • Zappa Frank

            don’t you think “son” would be better? why use the word “child”?

          • Kai

            Yes, I think son would be better and result in less misunderstanding based on so many people defaulting to an age context. Again, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with the use of the word child because it isn’t being misused. I’m not arguing that “child” SHOULD be used, I’m just defending against the accusation that it is a misuse. It isn’t a misuse. It’s use is legitimate in the context of the word’s defiintion AND in the context of reflecting the parent-child relationship that is a central narrative in this story.

          • Zappa Frank

            by the way, I see the very same objection also in Chinese comments..

          • Kai

            Right, and that’s in reference to the Chinese text also using “child” (孩子). Like I said, I understand why people react to it in the context of the child’s age. I just know that it was used to describe an identity in relation to another person central to the news story.

            I don’t think there’s anything wrong with people thinking “child” is weird to describe a 17-year-old boy. I just don’t think there’s anything wrong with describing the 17-year-old by as the mother’s “child”. Do you understand? The word isn’t being misused. It’s being used correctly. It’s just that many people are judging the word in the “age” context” instead of the “relationship” context.

          • Zappa Frank

            sorry I’ve repleyed to your other post instead of this one. Son wouldn’t be better? I mean, it ‘s easy confuse me, but apparently confused many other native speakers

          • Kai

            I think the native speakers are just stuck in the age context and not pausing to consider how it was used to reflect the relationship context. There’s nothing wrong with being confused by it, but I don’t think it’s fair to say the term was misused.

          • Zappa Frank

            yes, I’ve read this one, but again I ask you.. than the word “son” wouldn’t be better?

          • Kai

            Replied here.

          • David

            Well, if this happened in Canada or we were talking about it happening in Canada you might have some area to argue but it did not. People under the majority can certainly be tried as adults, that does not make a 12 year old an adult. Only a person trying to hold up a crumbling point would consider a 17 year old a child (child is a subjective not objective term). A minor yes, maybe even a youngster or lad but certainly not a child. You want to keep using the term child because in your mind you think it will make your point about not slapping him more viable. It does not.

    • RegisterToPost

      It’s a sensationalist headline, much like “Zimmerman brutally executes child in unprovoked assault”.

  • PeterScriabin

    What a cluster! Everyone in this entire jewel of a story comes out looking rather bad: the mother; the son; the property management; the violent revenger; the police! Microcosm of many of China’s current social problems in one lovely little narrative.

    • Teacher in China

      Agreed. Hard for me to support any side of this shitshow.

  • Raymond

    I’ve done this before, anyone else?

    • mr.wiener

      Yes , when I was 7 , and got an immediare smack on the back of the head from my mother.

      • donscarletti

        She did as any good mother would do, which is why the time you hit 17 you weren’t doing stuff like that.

        The woman however is like so many co-workers I’ve had in China and a few abroad. She had 17 years to do her job, she didn’t do it, she gets pissed off that someone’s stepping in on her turf and making her look bad.

        • Kai

          That’s unfair. There’s too much projection of people’s subjective stereotypes of “coddling Chinese moms” onto this woman. A woman who repeatedly makes it clear that she recognizes her child’s misbehavior is not someone who only cares about being made to look bad. She’s voluntarily and pro-actively owning up to what they are guilty of and deserve censure for. This is not Li Tianyi’s mom. You guys really need to reign in the eagerness to malign people.

          • donscarletti

            I didn’t project any stereotypes onto anyone and I don’t have any belief that Chinese mothers are less strict and more protective than others.
            I’m just making an observation about this particular woman, as I have made observations about people of all genders, colours, races, creeds, ages and sexual orientations at varying times.

            Also, the difference between this kid and Li Tianyi is that this kid deserves a slap on the face, whereas Li Tianyi deserves to be stuck in a maximum security prison full of other violent criminals. If young Mr Pushbutton was for example, was punched in the throat or raped by Li Tianyi, then his mother should certainly ask the police for assistance, however, he had that slap in the face coming, so his mother should just accept this.

          • Kai

            I just don’t think we can conclude that she “didn’t do her job” simply because her son played an elevator prank. Or that she’s “pissed off that someone’s stepping in on her turf and making her look bad.”

            I think that is projecting stereotypes onto her. First, it isn’t based on any information we have available. Second, it is however based on presumptions about her background and character that is ALSO likened to so many in China (but also “a few abroad”).

            Do you really think there is enough information here to malign her like this?

            I’m of the camp that believes the kid should’ve been chastised, but I don’t think he should’ve been smacked across the face by some grown stranger unless he puffed up his chest, got in the face of the other resident and said “yeah, and what are you gonna do about it?”

            Note I wasn’t asking for differences between this kid and Li Tianyi. I was remarking about the differences between this kid’s mother and Li Tianyi’s mother to illustrate my disagreement with the conclusions you projected onto her.

    • arterius2

      Ok, true story, about a week ago, there was this kid obviously dosed high on caffeine in the elevator with me, he kept pressing on the open-door button when I’m trying to close it, after about 4-5 attempts, I gave him 3 warnings, and he didn’t heed warning, while still laughing like a lunatic, so I gave him a solid bitch slap on the back skull, his head bounced about on the elevator door and that shut his fucker up nicely. What did we both get out of this? I got my fix and he got the best lesson he will ever receive in his life – for free, he will surely never attempt this stupid stunt again and sure as hell would thank the shit out of me later for who knows what might happen – like end up in a body bag when he’s met the wrong person at the wrong time, in the wrong place.

      Hell, I just saved this kid’s life.

      • I was riding my bike home the other week and this little smart arse 14 year old at the bus stop I was passing tried to show off in front of his friends by sticking is thumbs up at me in a fashion I could see was meant to be derogatory for me and expecting me to be gullible enough to think it real.

        I stopped pulled out my ear phones and asked him “hows that working out for you?” to which he replies, “hey I was just saying nice bike (there is nothing but ordinary about my bike”.

        I ask him again “So hows that working out for you?” to which he looked more bewildered and defensive and looked about at his mates that just smirked quietly at him. He again proclaimed (not very convincingly) “I just wanted to say nice bike”.

        I replied “no you didn’t, here’s a lesson mate. One day the person you do this too is not going to give you a second chance and you will get a smack around the chops”.

        He went all quiet, bowed his head in agreement while his mates then laughed at him.

        This is why as painful as it was at times I think my all boys christian brothers schooling with heavy doses of equal parts rugby and equal parts random beatings both given and received is a good start for boys. Boys need these tough and strict environments to build their character as they are too at risk otherwise of turning out into little dick heads like this kid – or weirdo’s that advertise their address online trying to pick a fight.

        Girls just really have to learn that guys only want sex – that’ll see them through their puberty. Boys need so much more.

        • Ken Morgan

          It reminds me of two things actually. Back in the 90s Harry Enfield was quite popular. He had a character who said that bloke’s a nutter, oi nutter! One day on a very long bus journey (UK buses take a very long time to go a short distance). A grown man at the back of the bus kept repeating this slogan over and over. He was told numerous times to shut up. He kept on shouting it at the top of his lungs. A few minutes later a couple of guys lost patience and went back and beat him to a pulp.

          Similarly on a flight from Hong Kong to the UK (Via Shanghai and Paris) a nasty kid decided to kick seats on the adjacent row on the 747 all the way to Paris. He was asked to stop multiple times. It stopped now and again but the kicking of the 4 seats resumed. He thought it funny as nobody could stop him. Upon landing in Paris he was followed into the toilets and beaten to a pulp and left unconscious in the toilets.

          I have a feeling both of these people never did those annoying things again.

          • Rick in China

            Exactly. It’s not nice to think that sometimes people need a little ‘whuppin’, but you can bet this kid – even from just a smack..wont be pressing all the elevator buttons potentially fucking up other people’s day.

          • Ken Morgan

            I really don’t know any more. In Notlob a few months ago when the bike fuel pump ate itself. I had to take the bus school children were taunting an old man. He turned round and slapped the kid after about 20 minutes. They immediately stated they would sue him for everything he had.

            Judging by all the no win no fee lawyers everywhere I reckon the kid and family probably did sue him.

          • Paul Schoe

            I am not sure of that. He might even do it more often because he now knows that it upsets people. So when he is in a bad mood . . .

    • were you also a 17 year-old boy curious about the mysteries of the world?

      speaking of which, this is what happens when your country is completely bereft of playboys

      • Xio Gen

        A 17 year old who should know better than to press all the buttons on an elevator. No excuse. If he was 7 it would be understandable. At 17 he’s just a spoiled brat.

        • Kai

          The amount of people here rushing to think this kid is a spoiled brat or little emperor is disappointing. I can’t help but feel people are too eager to make a popular stereotype fit.

          17-year-old teens pull pranks and do shit that’s inconsiderate of others all the time around the world. People are too eager to use this to justify a “little Chinese emperor” “spoiling Chinese parents” stereotype.

          • Xio Gen

            There’s pranks and then there’s childish shit like this. He deserved to get a smack.

  • loopyduck

    ““I was just curious at the time…”

    What the hell did the THINK would happen?

    • His daddy might appear and show an interest in his life and upbringing?

  • Jannick Slavik

    What an embarrassment.

    Obviously, the adult who assaulted the child should be arrested. Pushing buttons isn’t a crime, though assault certainly is.

    Since it’s China, and the legal system is a joke, that won’t happen of course.

    • donscarletti

      What child?

      All I heard about a 17 year old getting hit.

      This 17 year old douchebag deserves two slaps, first for pressing all the buttons, second for getting his mother involved when he stirred up shit.

      • Jannick Slavik

        Actually ,the 17 year old deserves a strata bylaw fine.

        If this was the West, the adult who assaulted the minor would likely be looking at jail time.

        methinks you have been in China too long.

        • donscarletti

          What country are you from?

          In Australia at least you don’t get jail time for a little bit of one on one “physical disagreement” unless you use a weapon. A bare handed slap would be considered a “simple assault” (i.e. without battery, bodily harm or aggravating circumstances) and probably wouldn’t even be prosecuted, assault and battery (e.g. punching someone in the face) wouldn’t get you prison on a first offence either, unless it was completely unprovoked. Most common law jurisdictions (English speaking countries) are similar.

          Taking a wild guess based on your name, I would suspect you spent your childhood chased about by some Warsaw pact secret police force and your adulthood believing that obeying Brussels instead of Moscow makes you “western”, but in actual western countries the government acknowledges that people do have personal disputes on occasion and it’s only their job to step in when someone’s long term health and livelihood is in danger.

          • Rick in China

            HAHAHAHAHA! That was good stuff.. and in agreement completely. Tired of reading “would be put in jail!” type nonsense because he slapped a 17 year old kid. I don’t see any modern western country putting this person in prison, let alone a night stay in most perhaps a warning.

          • Jannick Slavik

            Look, all the the dodgy expats have gathered together and are condoning the assaulting of a minor.

            Bunch of toughies you folks are.


          • arterius2

            Don’t LOL when you are actually crying on the inside.

          • Jannick Slavik

            actually, i cry for the kids you are teaching in China….How many did you say you attacked?

            Myself? I’m doing great.

          • Probotector

            It’s not “gathering together”, it’s just those with common sense overcoming a dumbass.

          • Jannick Slavik

            Yes, assaulting a stranger who happens to be a minor for “pushing elevator buttons” is so sensible.


          • Foreigners does not equal expats. Since you are all about definitions – go and look up the real meaning of “Expatriate” and see just how few foreigners it actually applies too.

          • Kai

            As I’m reading this conversation unfold, you’re starting to go down to that level. Please don’t.

          • arterius2

            He comes from Troll Country in Lala Land.

          • Jannick Slavik

            “but in actual western countries the government acknowledges that people do have personal disputes on occasion and it’s only their job to step in when someone’s long term health and livelihood is in danger.”

            Yes, and when it involves an adult attacking a minor, it is substantially more serious.

          • Rick in China

            Show me a news article or anything of the sort that has a man having smacked a 17 year old being put in jail. Your whole premise is based on some nonsensical black and white definition of the law. “ASSAULT” -> “ILLEGAL” -> “JAIL”, but you’re paying no attention to any of the nuance in that ridiculous jump to conclusions. Not all assault/battery is equal, and not all circumstance are equal – not to mention that “minors” are not always treated equally in given circumstance under the law – for example, under your definition, if you kick the shit out of a baby, or smack a 17 year old, they both equate to assault & battery and deserve jail-time: I can tell you that one leads to jail-time (hopefully lots), and one doesn’t..ever…anywhere.

        • I don’t think you have been in China long enough. Come back when you hit a decade. You may just lose the whole “Should Fetish” then that every naive foreigner that is not long for the place seems to get infected with.

          • Teacher in China

            I really don’t think that has anything to do with it, to be honest. If this incident had happened in Canada (where I’m from), I would have the exact same reaction: yes, the kid acted like a tool, but the man who hunted him down and smacked him just because he pressed some fucking buttons on an elevator and made him wait for 7 minutes (as if that’s the end of the fucking world or something) is borderline psychotic and should be sued.

      • Kai

        Nah, I don’t think he can be accused of “getting his mother involved”. They knocked on their door, didn’t say what for, and she merely went along with them to the security office. He didn’t know what it was about and he couldn’t have predicted he’d be bitchslapped. It also doesn’t sound like he’s demanding that his mom seek justice for him. She’s reacting pretty normally as a parent, I think.

    • David

      So now your condescending attitude descends to cover the entire Chinese legal system (which I have see not the slightest bit of evidence you have any familiarity with) being a joke. There are plenty who would say the Canadian legal system is a joke (in fact several Canadian friends of mine think that). If you think not arresting a man for slapping an obnoxious 17 year old is the reason China’s legal system is a joke, I think you need to consider a new line of work. Your argument seems to cross back and forth between reality (what actually happened and the results), what you think should have happened (according to your idea of what the law SHOULD cover) and the legal definitions of childhood that you keep insisting on.

      • Jannick Slavik

        “So now your condescending attitude descends to cover the entire Chinese legal system (which I have see not the slightest bit of evidence you have any familiarity with) being a joke. There are plenty who would say the Canadian legal system is a joke (in fact several Canadian friends of mine think that).”

        Actually, I’m using an institutional analysis as pretext to those comments, derived largely by the Nobel Prize winning work of Amartya Sen. I would stand by the comments that the Institutions in China are lacking, particularly in regards to laws, bylaws, restitution/remedies/recourse. I’m not alone in thinking that either. It’s actually how I make my living in China, BTW.

  • icup ✔️

    i’m sure we’ve all done mischievous things when we were younger, most likely 10yrs old… but 17 he should’ve known better.

    • Jannick Slavik

      and the adult? He’s even older. Shouldn’t he have known better than to assault a minor?

      In the West, that would be a pretty nice civil law suit and/or criminal charges

      • icup ✔️

        it’s considered discipline. now the kid should know better.

        • Jannick Slavik

          no…it’s considered assault.

          a decent attorney would make most of the $$$ from non pecuniary damages related to the mental scarring of a minor being assaulted by an adult.

          Also, if the area exhibited more evolved institutions, the building would have had a strata bylaw that would permit a fine being placed on the child for his actions.

          that’s how normal folks deal with things. they leverage existing institutions

          • icup ✔️

            yeah… the west is all about lawsuit. some people make it a job to sue others.

          • Jannick Slavik

            yes. it can be referred to as “institutional development.” The building would elect a management to develop “bylaws” that codify the rules in the building. Fines could be levied for bad behavior.

            That is preferable to having adults assault minors over what otherwise would be mitigated via existing bylaws.

          • David

            LMAO obviously you have never lived in China. Sorry, you sound ridiculous.

      • I hate reading the word “Should” in the same sentence of China.

  • Rick in China

    “At present, Ms. He has already asked the police for help, wants the person who hit her son to come out and give her son an apology.”

    Fuck you Ms. He. Your son doesn’t deserve an apology, and you deserve another smack for being a coddling whining bitch. I hope the police invite you two into a room – and smack the both of you for wasting their time.

    “and property management also refused to provide this person’s information.”

    Good for them. They should keep his identity secret, that bitch and her son do NOT have dignity, and should not be apologised to. Fuck them both. I hope the security team have remote control of the elevator and fuck with it repeatedly whenever her/her son enter it until they learn to take the fucking stairs up to the 2nd floor. THE SECOND FLOOR. Are these two super, super fat? Seems like it may be the case.

    • Jannick Slavik

      do you have kids Rick?

      • Rick in China


        • Jannick Slavik

          oh good. so i’m sure you wouldn’t mind them being assaulted by a stranger when they misbehave (they do – you are lying to yourself if you think they don’t) and then have little to no remedies at disposal to seek recourse.

          methinks you have been living in China too long.

          • Rick in China

            There is a big difference between a 17 year old and an actual “child”. There’s also a big difference between getting a little smack when you’re being a complete asshole, and being what I’d consider “assaulted by a stranger”. If you’re so overprotective that you let your nearly fully grown teenage son act like a dick and expect a little chiding from mommy to suffice, then I feel bad for the world in which you live.

          • Jannick Slavik

            “There is a big difference between a 17 year old and an actual “child”. ”

            Well, obviously there is to you, but not to the law. A child is anyone under the age of majority.

            “There’s also a big difference between getting a little smack when you’re being a complete asshole, and being what I’d consider “assaulted by a stranger”.”

            Actually, laying hands on someone generally falls within the definition of assault. A “spitting assault” is noted similarly.

            “. If you’re so overprotective that you let your nearly fully grown teenage son act like a dick and expect a little chiding from mommy to suffice, then I feel bad for the world in which you live.”

            See, that’s why we have laws Rick. Who’s to stop another person to make the same argument about your child using their own prejudice about what age a “child” should know better.

            And obviously you don’t want your child being assaulted by a stranger, as you obviously shouldn’t. That doesn’t make you a “coddling whining bitch.” It just makes you a parent.

          • Rick in China

            *sigh* obviously you can make up some other scenarios, and you can be specific about definitions of words, and that is why my words are specific as well.. “what I’d consider”, for example, I do see a big difference between getting smacked for being a jerk, and being punched in the face. If you don’t, and say “well it’s all assault!” then I have nothing further to discuss with you on that subject.

            Of course we have laws. We also have the ability to make judgements. In my judgement, read: In my opinion, this 17 year old deserved the smack. You can provide your opinion also, and that’s wonderful – we’re obviously not going to agree on this, but none of your points have any influence whatsoever on my opinion in this matter. The mother is, in my opinion, a coddling whining bitch.

          • Jannick Slavik

            ” I do see a big difference between getting smacked for being a jerk, and being punched in the face. If you don’t, and say “well it’s all assault!” then I have nothing further to discuss with you on that subject.”

            Actually, both are assault. And assaulting a minor, within the context of the scenario, would likely lead to criminal charges in Canada (where I am from)

            Also, In a Civil Suit, the plaintiff would certainly secure non-pecuniary damages related to the mental trauma of being assaulted in a closed off area by a stranger, in front of his mother. It would likely be very costly for you.

            So, no, this has nothing to do with my “opinion.” Rather, I suppose it’s now simply advise: while you may likely condone assaulting children in China (unless you are just being argumentative) don’t be under the impression you can do this sort of thing in the West without criminal charges/civil suit.

          • icup ✔️

            you can do it in the west, it’s considered not resorting to lawsuit for every little means.

            you may view hitting a kid can cause damage, others will see it as growth. like rick said, some of us will never see eye to eye.

          • Jannick Slavik

            Now assaulting a child is “every little means”?

            This is chaos. You just project your own prejudice and parochial values on what is “little means” instead of relying on a “code of laws.” to govern such remedies

          • Rick in China

            “Actually, both are assault. And assaulting a minor, within the context of the scenario, would likely lead to criminal charges in Canada (where I am from)”

            There are different levels of assault in different countries, including China. You’re also completely wrong, and either smacking or punching someone is battery – not assault – get your ‘facts’ straight before you come so hard, Jannick.

          • Jannick Slavik

            certainly, it could be assault/ battery depending on the jurisdication and/or circumstances.

            glancing at the limited info provided above, i would certainly suggest the child may have had apprehension of an intentional attack.

            Come so hard? Re-read your original post calling the parent of the minor that was assaulted a “coddling whining bitch”

            Again, my advise: don’t attempt this in Western Countries (as it sounds like you are condoning it)

          • Amused

            Please go to America sometime soon.
            Can’t wait to see you on Worldstar :)

          • Correct. Under common law – so Canada too. Assault is literally just touching someone. Where as battery is as described above.

            In most cases with the exception of China or the USA there is the application of the “reasonable man on the street” test and the fact that damages have to be, like “actual” not imagined. Otherwise we’d be suing everyone we bump into during rush hour.

          • Rick in China

            In China, as I have very intimate experience with this – there are actually levels & degrees that determine whether assault/battery lead to criminal prosecution or justify civil action, or both — basically there are 4 levels and 10 degrees within each, and after going to the hospital (if you go to the hospital) you can get a report, to which you can apply to another agency (I forget what it’s called) to have an official level/degree assigned to it. If the assault/battery is very light – like, a slap, there is no hospital treatment required, there is no real injury sustained, this would not lead to any criminal action for addition, it would not lead to any compensation, because there is no provable loss or pain & suffering, or lost wages/etc. If there were, then the police would be obliged to force the guards to reveal the person’s identity / show them tapes or whatever, but in this case, they can’t do shit. The mother can’t do shit either, because all that happened was her snotnosed 17 year old got smacked for being a dick.

          • arterius2

            Oh Jannick give it a rest, you sound just like the stuck up whinning bitch of a mom in this story, get that thorn out of your ass, go get laid or something, you obviously need it. I’ve smacked plenty of brats in China and in the west, and don’t shove all that law and civil crap on me, shit doesn’t work like that in the real world, you should get out once a while. Oh, trust me, they needed it too, and I’m sure they are going to thank me when they eventually puberty up, while we’re on this subject, you sound like you needed a good smack too.

          • Jannick Slavik

            So…you attack children.

            A real tough guy.


          • arterius2

            No, I don’t attack children you moron, of course not, I teach children. Think of me as a freaking mentor to them, a wise old Master.

          • Jannick Slavik

            lol. i’ll refrain from commenting on this further.

          • James in China

            You are 100% correct, in any case. A stranger striking your child IS assault, no matter what these wannabe tough guys think.

          • arterius2

            Be there in a sec.

          • James in China

            I hope you’re wearing your best skirt, faggot.

          • arterius2

            I brought you some lotion, for all those bruises after I’m done with you.

          • James in China

            Such a fag. I thought you were on the way, little girl?

          • James in China

            But you’re not, because you’re a typical internet tough guy. Your nuts are like raisins. Go back to hiding behind your keyboard, you cowardly little fuck.

          • mr.wiener

            Children… I think we can leave this thread about here. Since neither of you can take any physical action on the other, all you are doing is blustering..

          • James in China

            Mr. Wiener, if you’re a mod, then go ahead and moderate. This clown implied a physical threat, I simply gave him the opportunity to follow it up, which he of course declined. So, moderate, or do you normally let pieces of shit like him try to threaten people on the forum? My offer stands, arterius, Lane 799 Shangbo Rd, Shanghai, Room 504.

          • mr.wiener

            …And you are now being just as much of a clown as he is. You got trolled mate and you let him get to you ……calm down please.

          • Surfeit

            Clownin’ around, clownin’ around, turning frowns, upside down!

          • Surfeit

            I’m gona post you some of my pubes. In my culture, we’re practically married now.

          • James in China

            I hope you don’t teach children any longer, you fucking goof. I am, however, completely not surprised that someone with such an obviously poor grip on social issues as yourself is an English teacher in China. A horrid failure wherever you come from, and a horrid failure in China as well. You’re about as much of a mentor or a wise old master as I am the King of Spain. Fucking losers. Your only qualification for the job you do is likely the language of the country in which you were born. Wise old master my ass.

          • arterius2

            Never said I’m a teacher you dumb pig fuck. I said I teach them, as in teaching them a lesson. You need one as well.

          • James in China

            Ooooh an internet tough guy, how cute. Simple fucking moron. Lane 799 Shangbo Road, Shanghai, room 504. There you are mr. internet tough guy, hop in a cab and come teach me a lesson.

          • This is funny. I think in psychology it is called “Projection”, From a deep seated self loathing or hatred or need to justify your own self loathing you project that which you see as a problem (in this case being an English teacher) and project it on to others. How else can you explain such a neat and pre packaged sequence of venom on a profession that was never raised or mentioned and with such vitriol?

            Anyone that does not post under their real name really has the right to label anyone else an internet tough guy. Simple lesson in life mate; don’t act tough unless you are. And actual real tough people, people that have been in real fights, don’t go soliciting for them online or in person.

          • James in China

            You’re a huuuuge faggot. That is all.

          • Jannick Slavik

            respectfully, if you laid hands on my child, you would be in a wheelchair, despite whatever you think you are teaching them

          • Barney Rubble

            My son’s 14, and if he acted like a twat in public I’d welcome his elders to give him a slap.

          • Jannick Slavik

            do you think your definition of “acting like a twat” may differ from another persons? As that is a shifting definition, it’s more likely than not that you wouldn’t be OK with your 14 year old son being assaulted by a random stranger.

          • mistertibbs4u

            You’re calling young men who are one year away from attending college…. children?

            Maybe you need to be smacked.

          • icup ✔️

            if someone punched you out of the blue, then yes that’s an act of violence against you and you should press charges… but if you was drunk and stumbling around and bumped into someone who then turned around and punch you then you deserved it for the disorderly behavior.

            that’s what i mean by “every little means”… you committed an act and paid for it. it wasn’t severe enough to put you in the hospital so why complain? there was a lesson to be learned from it.

          • Jannick Slavik

            yes, the lessons here are 1) the building needs to implement bylaws that would permit the levying of fines for such behavior, 2) Chinese mothers need to better manage their little emperors, and 3) it’s not OK for adults to assault minors….ever.

          • arterius2

            I can see you not doing so well in this world, you really should have lived in one where apples are perfectly round and gold nuggets grow on trees.

          • Jannick Slavik

            “I can see you not doing so well in this world,”

            Well, I am in my early 30s, worked as a diplomatic attache in China, have 2 post graduate designations, and now run my own 7 figure holdings company.

            I work 12 hours a day and love what I do.

            I’m doing fine, by my definition anyway.

            I also don’t beat minors, like you admitted to doing.

          • Yes!

            In an Asian context, that slap is an education, not assault. Especially if the slap is deemed warranted and enjoy strong social/ public approval. A similar scenario would be a wife and her bunch of friends slapping, punching, kicking and stripping her husband’s mistress in public. The general public approve of this, the police will look the other way. There are times, in China, when “the people” get to rule and this is one of those rare times. Perhaps, 20 years down road, we might see the “slapper” and “the wife and her friends” prosecuted on point of law.

          • Xia

            Sounds a lot like mob lynching to me, probably with Chinese characteristics. Just like during the days of the Cultural Revolution, when young people beat their teachers in public.

          • marshmallow

            he’s almost 18 just 1 year difference make someone a child and a adult? he deserved it. or whether let the bitch get slapped for allowing her grown son to do stupid things.

          • Balkan

            A slap is an assault? I think this is exaggerated. An assault is used for more severe situations. Being pushed back or slapped is not an assault.

          • ozraiel

            Actually, if we’re splitting hairs, neither is an assault. Both are considered battery, because there was touching in both scenarios.
            I guess now your argument is invalid.

            *sarcasm off*

          • Jannick Slavik

            sure it is. In Canada “assault” is defined as without the consent of another person, applying force intentionally to that other person, directly or indirectly,

            more broadly,

            assault is the intentional creation of the apprehension of imminent harmful or offensive contact…

            “An assault can be committed without a battery and battery can occur without an assault preceding it. For example, swinging at someone and missing is an assault but not a battery. Striking someone from behind, without his or her knowledge, is a battery but not an assault. Conduct which intentionally arouses apprehension of an imminent battery constitites an assault. Shaking a fist at another person, lunging at someone in an effort to attack and swinging an axe at another person are actionable assaults.”

          • Jannick Slavik

            more recently, the adult that intentionally tripped the minor in a post-game hockey scrum in Canada was recently sentenced to”assault” – 15 days in jail.

          • Rick in China

            That’s a point I was trying to make, also – it’s fun to watch someone call everything assault, and spout ‘legal definitions’ and make jokes about how other people need to get good lawyers rather than defend themselves, etc.. when the entirety of their comment spew makes a common simple mistake like assault instead of battery. The media also makes this mistake sometimes. Actually – so does Chinese translation of indictments, mine translated to intentional assault causing injury (which I suppose is accurate as well, since it has the suffix of ‘causing injury’) – when in fact, it should be battery, because I absolutely meant to slam that fuckface hit-and-run fat fuck in the face and make him pay, and did. Ultimately of course, I paid, a lot, but absolutely no regrets for many reasons. :D

          • Kai

            Come on, dude, “coddling whining bitch” is excessive, don’t you think?

            The security guards knocked on their door, didn’t say what for, and she merely went along with them to the security office. No one knew the other resident was going to smack the kid. As a mother, I don’t think her reaction of being upset that a grown man smacked her kid is unreasonable either.

            I don’t think the mom’s reaction in wanting an apology is unreasonable either. She’s not even threatening to sue. As much as we can empathize and consider it subjectively satisfying to bitchslap someone for doing something so inconsiderate, it’s still pretty excessive for something like this.

            Moreover, as far as we know, the kid wasn’t a little flippant dick about it. He knew he was wrong and owned up to it. It wasn’t the other resident’s place to exact physical retribution or even administer corporal punishment. He should apologize for losing his temper.

            If there’s a risk for the other resident and property management, it is the possibility of legal recourse if they testify admitting that such a thing happened. That said, the most likely result would be the parties being taken to the police station where the cops mediate a private resolution without further legal action. Technically, the mom could press things further, as she’s allowed to under the law, but it’ll probably be more trouble than it is worth.

            I don’t think she’s asking for too much, and she’s self-conscious enough to re-emphasize that her son was wrong for what he did and make it clear that they know that. If she was downplaying her son’s own culpability as if he’s some angel who was the only party wronged in all this, then I might think “coddling whining bitch” may be justified. As is, I don’t think it is.

          • Rick in China

            “Technically, the mom could press things further, as she’s allowed to under the law, but it’ll probably be more trouble than it is worth.”

            Civil – yes. Criminal – no. This would be classified as a level 1 injury with severity maybe like, 1-5, depending on whether there was really swelling or tissue damage…I don’t know, but it would never lead through to any investigation (PSB, let alone through procuratorate or anywhere else. EVER. Legally.)

            Civil, I don’t even know how they would justify damages. Damages in China are calculated by medical costs, lost wages, pain and suffering (must be some way to prove it via injury severity etc, and it’s a VERY little amount) or something else. Where is this kid’s loss? I believe article 120 of the civil law code mentions something about the right to dignity / honor etc, and perhaps something could be gained from that, but it would not be in the range that would constitute any sort of lawsuit or be worth even an hour of a lawyers time. 20 kuai? 50 kuai? How much do you really think a slap would get you here. Don’t be silly.

            RE: “being too harsh” and “what’s justified” (paraphrased)

            This is a 17 year old kid. He’s not a little boy, mischievous and troublesome. He’s almost a fully grown man. The only information we have to go on is what the MOTHER said. The kid did not say anything – did he? Where’s his quotes? Where is he apologizing profusely for being a douchebag, and admitting his mistake? You may be correct in all your presumptions of him being a good kid who admitted his mistake and wont do it again, I..however…call bullshit. Buckets full of bullshit. If he was truly self-aware he wouldn’t be in this situation in the first place for something so stupid, what kind of idiot, at that age, behaves like that – when he’s out with his mom? I’ll tell you what type in more explicit words than used before: but you’d just call me ‘too harsh’ again.

          • Kai

            Yes, civil way more so than criminal, and yeah, as I already said, it’d be more trouble than it is worth, and the cops would aim for mediation for a private resolution.

            Re: “harsh”

            First, notice that I actually didn’t even use that word.

            Second, and more importantly, re-read what I wrote.

            You’re responding as if I argued that you’re being too harsh on the kid. I was actually remarking about your judgement of the mom. I said your characterization of her as a “coddling whining bitch” was “excessive”.

            I don’t think it’s legitimate to characterize me as being presumptuous when you’re being just as presumptuous. I, at the very least, am going by what information we all have before us. You, on the other hand, are dismissing the information we have and substituting a completely fabricted straw man of the kid (“buckets of bullshit”) based on nothing but your own presumptions and prejudices.

            I never presumed or characterized the kid to be “a good kid” either. That’s you straw-manning me. I merely said he owned up to what he did and “as far as we know, the kid wasn’t a little flippant dick about it.”

            I don’t think it is reasonable to assume that every person who does something mischievous should be so as thoroughly lambasted as you have done. People make mistakes and bad decisions, at any age. If they’re unapologetic about it, they should be censured, but you’re not just being skeptical about the kid’s remorse, you’re presumptively demonizing the kid.

            AND the mother.

            In contradiction to or even complete disregard of the information we have.

          • Rick in China

            *sigh* What you’re saying I am presuming or being flippant about, you are too, just in the other direction. For example, the following can be easily flipped:

            “”as far as we know, the kid wasn’t a little flippant dick about it.””
            “”as far as we know, the kid was a little flippant dick about it.”

            Why? There simply isn’t any real evidence whatsoever in this story to provide any evidence of either way. There is only what the mom says. She’s the only one telling her story beyond “I pressed all the buttons because I was curious” or whatever the stupid kid said, so THAT is why I call her a coddling whining bitch – she’s coddling him protecting him from the situation he created rather than letting him speak and deal with it himself in any sense..she’s whining going to the police because her son was smacked and she ‘wants an apology’, and she’s a bitch because, um, just being presumptuous. She comes off as a bitch to me.

            “I, at the very least, am going by what information we all have before us.”

            No, you aren’t. You are being extremely presumptive also. You are basically reiterating what the mother says her side of the story is in an entirety of maybe 20 seconds of paraphrased speech, and presuming you have a grip on the entirety of the situation. The mother says she chided the kid — uh huh, what else is she going to tell the reporter. Do you really think she has no motivation to make sure her side of the story makes them seem like the victims here?

            Is there any ounce of objective evidence or proof to support your side, or are you in agreement – that you’re reading and accepting everything mommy is saying as fact, and working off of that? Because when I read someone’s ‘facts’, I take into consideration their motivations, their circumstance, a little bit of judgement, and typically come to the conclusion that it’s not always exactly as presented and often have my own feelings about what some other strong possibilities may be.

          • Kai

            Please read what I’m saying.

            What you’re saying I am presuming or being flippant about, you are too,

            1. Where did I say you were being flippant?

            2. I already addressed the issue of presumption. What are my “presumptions”? Have I actually “presumed” anything that isn’t based on the information we have available in the article?

            For example, the following can be easily flipped:

            No, it can’t. “As far as we know” is referencing the information we have in the article. There is nothing in the article to suggest he was a “flippant dick” when confronted about his mischief. Therefore, it is reasonably safe to say that based on the information we have, he “wasn’t a little flippant dick about it”.

            To assert that he was, you’d have to cite from the information we have behaviors or reactions that suggested he WAS “a little flippant dick” when confronted about his mischief. But there isn’t anything to support it.

            There’s a qualitative difference between:

            Me: Based on the information we have, he wasn’t a little flippant dick about it.

            You: Based on information we don’t have and my own presumptions of what really happened and what kind of people these are, he was a little flippant dick about it.

            Since I’m limiting my position to the only information we have, shouldn’t you recognize that my position is supported by the information? Shouldn’t you then qualify your position as acknowledging that you are merely SUSPECTING and PRESUMING a whole host of things about the kid and his mother and what transpired?

            Wouldn’t it be fair to recognize where my logic is consistent and what assumptions must be accepted to see things as you represent them?

            Why? There simply isn’t any real evidence whatsoever in this story to provide any evidence of either way.

            Ever hear the saying: “extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof”? How about “innocent until proven guilty”?

            The information we have doesn’t suggest he was a flippant dick so I’ve said the information doesn’t say he was when confronted. You’re arguing that the information doesn’t prove that he wasn’t a flippant dick so you should be allowed to presume he was one when confronted.

            There is only what the mom says.

            Sure, I recognize that. My position is based on the only testimony we have. Your position is based on your personal prejudices and suspicions. You cite you base it on their motivations and circumstance, except we don’t have any information about their motivations or circumstance. You are presuming those too.

            she’s coddling him protecting him from the situation he created rather than letting him speak and deal with it himself in any sense..

            That’s a huge stretch to me. How is she “protecting” him from the situation he created if she’s chastised himself personally and am publicly affirming that he had done something wrong? That doesn’t strike me as “coddling”. That strikes me as being very fair, reasonable, and responsible.

            Sure, you can be skeptical about her chastising him when they got out of the elevator and home. I have skepticism about that too. However, it cannot be denied that she is publicly acknowledging that he did something wrong and deserves censure for that. She is not Li Tianyi’s mom whitewashing what her kid did. She’s going on public record to make clear that what he did was wrong.

            she’s whining going to the police because her son was smacked and she ‘wants an apology’,

            I think wanting an apology is very reasonable. Her kid did something wrong but that doesn’t justify someone else also doing something wrong. To her, her son is not shirking responsibility and neither is she. However, the other resident, a grown man, and property management ARE. They were complicit in committing an unwarranted offense and complicit in not taking responsibility for it. It is not unreasonable for everyone to meet halfway and take responsibility for what they themselves are guilty of. Her son shouldn’t have played the prank and the grown man shouldn’t have escalated to physical violence. Why not have everyone apologize for where they made their mistakes and/or went too far?

            If the people responsible or complicit in the matter are stonewalling you, then yes, you escalate it to a higher level of authority. Yes, I get that you and many others would rather they just take it as a lesson in life and move on. However, she’s trying to redress her grievance in a civilized manner through civilized channels.

            Do you really think she has no motivation to make sure her side of the story makes them seem like the victims here?

            Expressing skepticism is one thing. Fabricating an alternative narrative based on subjective presumptions and prejudices is another. You’re doing the latter. There’s a difference between:

            a. I’m skeptical that your side of the story is all there is to it.

            b. You’re a coddling, whining bitch.

          • Rick in China

            “1. Where did I say you were being flippant?”

            I was not directly quoting your use of the word, but, your entire comment implies I am being flippant with both my replies to jannick and comments about the mother in the article. If you really need evidence to support this, I think you can glean that from reading the criticisms of my comments and accusations.

            “What are my “presumptions”? Have I actually “presumed” anything that isn’t based on the information we have available in the article?”

            Are you serious? First, lets define what a presumption is:

            “1 an assumption that is taken for granted [syn: given, precondition]

            2 (law) an inference of the truth of a fact from other facts proved or admitted or judicially noticed”

            Do you agree with these definitions? If so, let me show you why your entire position on this is based on presumption.

            “The security guards knocked on their door, didn’t say what for, and she merely went along with them to the security office.”

            According to the mother. There is no corroborative evidence to support this statement. It is a presumption based on hearsay, NOT necessarily fact.

            “She’s not even threatening to sue.”

            Entirely a presumption. How do you know she didn’t threaten to sue? You are presuming that she didn’t threaten to sue based on the fact it doesn’t explicitly say she did threaten to sue. If the article explicitly and objectively stated as such, we could consider that evidence of fact, but there is none.

            “it’s still pretty excessive for something like this.”

            You’re presuming that all that occurred was exactly as presented in the few quotes by the mother. You’re saying that the recourse was over the top, and lesser punishment is the only justified punishment. You are entirely presumptuous in that you’ve come to a conclusion without understanding or possibly knowing the entirety of what occurred, what was said, what type of attitude the kid had, etc. Just as I am saying he seems like a little asshole and she seems like a coddling bitch by not allowing him to speak for himself and trying to take the brunt of the issue on her shoulders on his behalf, even though he surely thinks himself a man in reality. Also a presumption. I’m also making presumptions, but don’t deny you are too.

            “He knew he was wrong and owned up to it.”

            How do you know this? Because the mother said “My child was wrong, but he already admitted his mistake, so he shouldn’t have been slapped,”? That’s not evidence of fact, that’s hearsay. I did not see the kid admit his mistake, or admit to anyone in any way whatsoever that what he did was wrong, why? Because all he said was this: “I was just curious at the time, and pressed to light up the buttons for floors 3 to 27 before exiting the elevator,” and lets dissect that. He did not say anything about what he did being wrong, or apologising, or even calling it a mistake, all he described was exactly what he did, with no reference to any remorse or acknowledgement of wrongdoing whatsoever. You are only presuming that somehow somewhere the adolescent knows he is wrong because the MOTHER knows he is wrong, and because you are presuming that because she knows he is wrong and seems to claim he does, that he also does, that is called a presumption as well.

            Enough with the presumptions nonsense. I think we can both finally agree that you are, indeed, making presumptions – as am I, as does almost everyone about almost every one of the articles posted on the site, or any site with news/stories involved. Next…..

            The information we have doesn’t suggest he was a flippant dick when he was confronted so I’ve said the information doesn’t say he was.

            I would argue that is not entirely the case. The fact that the dude slapped the kid and the guards involved are not cooperating whatsoever with the police, even, implies that the kid was indeed a dick, and deserved a slap. That implication is as much evidence that he was a dick and needed a good smack in the chops, as does the mommy saying “he still has dignity” or whatever it is that makes you think he wasn’t a flippant dick does. Argue this if you like, but it’ll be pointless, just another circular argument.

            “They were complicit in committing an unwarranted offense and complicit in not taking responsibility for it.”

            Oh, back to presumptions I guess. Unwarranted, was it? According to…whom? We don’t know what went on in that security room.

            There’s a difference between:

            a. I’m skeptical that your side of the story is all there is to it.

            b. You’re a coddling, whining bitch.

            Yes, there is a difference between those two options, however, they are not mutually exclusive. I would say that I am sure that I am skeptical that her story is entirely accurate, AND based on what I am presuming about the situation as described, she’s a coddling whining bitch. Both may be wrong, but it’s my opinion, and I’ll live with the consequences.

            NOTE: Do you really manually blockquote and strong stuff? I typically don’t but prefer to use these, and don’t like typing them manually, it breaks my ranting up. However, this time, I had to edit twice to fix both a missed blockquote and a missed < on that missed blockquote. Is there a way to enable a click-style in the disqus comments window?

          • Kai

            “Flippant” wouldn’t be the word I would use. As much as I think you’re often too aggressive in expressing yourself, that’s not the crux of my disagreement with you here. The crux is that I think you’re not giving credit where it is due. That includes qualifying your speculations with recognition of what the information we have says as well as acknowledging the valid points other people make. I think discussion would be smoother if people did this.

            According to the mother. There is no corroborative evidence to support this statement. It is a presumption based on hearsay, NOT necessarily fact.

            No dude, under this logic, we couldn’t hold a discussion at all.

            The only information we have available is this news article written by a journalist’s investigation incorporating testimony from the mother.

            Yes, the mother’s testimony is hearsay. All testimony is hearsay. Even so, it is still the only information we have from which we should draw conclusions and judgements.

            The moment you draw conclusions that aren’t based on or even reasonably supported by the information we have, that is the moment you are making presumptions, because you are making assumptions that you take for granted.


            In logic, my conclusions are warrantable because they are based on the only information we have, this news article. Yours are presumptions because they are NOT based on the information we have but instead on things you have thought up and projected onto the information we have.

            Under this misunderstanding of presumption, we could dismiss the entire news story. We can dismiss that the child pressed any elevator buttons at all, because you can say the report of him doing so is hearsay and thus “presumption”.

            Under this misinterpretation of “presumption”, it begs the question of why you accept certain “presumptions” in the story but not others when they are all equally guilty of being “hearsay”.

            So again, that is not the standard for what is “presuming” and what isn’t.

            There is a difference between:

            a) This is my conclusion based on these details in the news article.

            b) This is my conclusion based on things I have subjectively projected onto the characters in the news article that have no corroboration in the news article.

            No one is failing to recognize that the details in the news article are necessarily hearsay and not true, objective fact.

            What I am saying is that conclusions based on the information we DO have is qualitatively different from conclusions that disregard the information we have and incorporate completely fabricated projections of motivation and circumstance. The latter characterizes your position.

            This isn’t a court of law, but think about how conclusions and judgements are made based on available information and testimony in court. They are done that way because it makes good sense, because they avoid conclusions based on mere presumption and speculation like yours.

            Neither party, laywers, jury, or the judge can simply dismiss the information and testimony available by offering their own presumptions of what they think really happened or are the motivations and circumstance of the people involved. When one party fails to show up to court and offer their side, the court is bound to rule based on what information and testimony is available.

            That is similar to the situation we have here. The mother has shown up in court and given her side. Neither the other resident or property management is showing up in court to offer their sides. Good sense dictates that our conclusions be based on what information we have. We cannot simply let our prejudices say “well, I refuse to acknowledge what the mother says because I prefer to think of her and her son as such and such.” That’s drawing conclusions based on presumption rather than the available information.

            I am doing the former. You are doing the latter. They are not equivalent, not equal, and thus not equally “presumptuous”.

            Entirely a presumption. How do you know she didn’t threaten to sue? You are presuming that she didn’t threaten to sue based on the fact it doesn’t explicitly say she did threaten to sue. If the article explicitly and objectively stated as such, we could consider that evidence of fact, but there is none.

            Based on what we know and based on the information we have available, she didn’t threaten to sue.

            Are you going to accuse me of wanting to murder you because I haven’t explicitly said I don’t want to? Come on, dude…

            You are entirely presumptuous in that you’ve come to a conclusion without understanding or possibly knowing the entirety of what occurred, what was said, what type of attitude the kid had, etc.

            No, I have clearly based on my conlusion on what we know and what information we have available:

            “I, at the very least, am going by what information we all have before us.”

            I am not claiming that my conclusion is based on the absolute truth of the matter. I just don’t think it makes sense to presume things about the mother for which we have no basis except subjective prejudice. I recognize that the article with the mother’s testimony may not be the complete picture, but it’s all we can see about the picture, so the sensible thing to do is to limit our conclusions to what can be supported by the information we have.

            And if I want to speculate about other things, I will acknowledge that they are unsupported speculations based on my subjective prejudices.

            Just as I am saying he seems like a little asshole and she seems like a coddling bitch by not allowing him to speak for himself and trying to take the brunt of the issue on her shoulders on his behalf, even though he surely thinks himself a man in reality.

            I think there’s a significant qualitiative difference between, for example:

            a) My “presumption” that she didn’t threaten to sue because the article said in multiple instances that she was seeking an apology and makes no mention of seeking legal restitution.

            b) Your presumption that she didn’t “allow” him to speak and is “trying to take the brunt of the issue on her shoulders on his behalf” because the article didn’t include any remarks by the son.

            I’m confident mine is more warrantable conclusion because it is a lesser claim. Remember what I said about “extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof” and “innocent until proven guilty”?

            Until the information we have says she threatened to sue, I don’t think it is unreasonable to conclude that she didn’t. Until the information says she didn’t allow her son to speak, I’m not going to assume she didn’t and her motivations must be because she wants to coddle him. You are making way stronger claims with even less information to infer from.

            I’m also making presumptions, but don’t deny you are too.

            The difference is that I’m prefacing what I’m saying with “based on what we know” or “based on the information we have available”, whereas you are just projecting subjective presumptions.

            Rick, you’ve admitted as much in your comment that you recognize a difference.

            Please revisit my original reply to you. I think your conclusion about the mother was “excessive”. Everything we’ve argued afterward is for the purpose of justifying or dismissing my disagreement with you. My central argument is that your conclusion is based on presumptions that aren’t adequately supported by the information we have. Therefore, “excessive”.

            A simple recognition that, yes, the information we have doesn’t reasonably suggest she she’s a “coddling whining bitch” would’ve sufficed. It’d be fair of you to recognize her acknowledging her son’s fault in the matter multiple times and publicly for the record as weakening any premise you have for accusing her of being “coddling”. It’d be fair of you to recognize that it may be unfair to accuse a mother of “whining” because she’s upset that her child was smacked by a grown stranger.

            We have different predispositions when it comes to judging and name-calling people, but I think there’s very little information here to conclude she’s a “bitch”. I think you really have to presume a lot of things about her character and motivations, that require a huge stretch to infer from the information we have, in order to do so. Hence, again, “excessive”.

            Do you really feel I haven’t adequately substantiated my disagreement with you? I don’t think the information justifies “coddling whining bitch”. I’m not arguing that the information says she or her son is a saint; I’m just arguing that your conclusion reflects your presumptions more than they reflect the actual information we have.

            NOTE: Do you really manually blockquote and strong stuff? I typically don’t but prefer to use these, and don’t like typing them manually, it breaks my ranting up. However, this time, I had to edit twice to fix both a missed blockquote and a missed < on that missed blockquote. Is there a way to enable a click-style in the disqus comments window?

            No, there’s no formatting buttons for Disqus as far as I’m aware. Yeah, I manually blockquote and strong stuff. Hah, yeah, it can break your train of thought but it doesn’t bother me too much. I sometimes format as I write and I sometimes add formatting in after writing for clarity and emphasis, in the oft-times I proofread what I wrote.

            As an aside, try not to “rant” so much, man. Of course, I understand if it’s some sort of catharsis, or just subjectively amusing for you. The thing is, I think you have plenty to offer as a commenter, but your tendency to be really “in your face” with others is often–I think–unnecessarily distracting and off-putting. Yeah, you’ll live with it, and it may be your personality or just your intended persona here (as you’ve said before), but please take this in the spirit it is intended, as a friendly entreaty with the aim of making the comments section and commenting community a more constructive rather than needlessly combative/polemic environment. We’re seriously thinking of instituting a Quora-esque BNBR policy, especially after the latest “let’s fistfight in real life” episode we had here.

          • Rick in China

            We’re not going to agree on this, because apparently our understanding of the word presumption is different. Once again – without fact, it’s a presumption based on some other basic fact or based on no fact, and since your presumptions do NOT have basic facts or truthes, they are indeed presumptions. You may say my presumptions are less evidence based than your own, but your conclusions are by the definition of what a presumption is – presumptions. Not going to continue this, will just be circular like so many others.

            The rant part though: I do indeed find it cathartic most of the time. I think that sometimes my rants are enjoyed by others – also. This one, for instance, is at the top of the votes by far far, and has a long argument thread after it. I like to think many of my posts will be loved or hated, and try to avoid being completely middle and ‘fair’ – who needs that..there is no fun in that.

          • Kai

            The problem is that your use of the word “presumption” makes it impossible to have a meaningful discussion. Under your working definition, we can dismiss any detail in the reporting AND even the report itself as “hearsay” and thus “not fact”. In that scenario, we’re no longer discussing something but just proposing different fabrications.

            To have a discussion, we have to have a shared premise to draw conclusions from. The only premise we have is the reporting available. Our conclusions are then measured by how supported they are by the reporting.

            A conclusion is “warrantable” if the reporting provides basis for it. It is less warrantable to unwarrantable if the reporting doesn’t. This is where we can have a meaningful distinction between what is a “presumption” and what isn’t.

            If it makes any difference, you can opt to compare the degree of “presumption” between your position and mine. My disagreement would remain the same: you are being more presumptuous than I am and thus I consider your characterization of the mother “excessive”.

            For example, consider the different degree of “presumption” between:

            a) The mother may be coddling her son.

            b) The mother is coddling her son.

            The difference in a single word illustrates a meaningful distinction in degree of presumption. B is more presumptuous than A when it comes to how much they are supported by the information available.

            Does this help? Would you agree that my conclusions about the mother require less presumption about information we don’t have than your conclusions?

            Re: rant

            I agree your rants are enjoyed by others, but I worry is the justification of populism and demagoguery, which is too often destructive rather than constructive. It’s catering to and pandering to the id instead of the ego, much less the superego.

            Yeah, I know, I’m sure that paints me too earnest or too serious, either too idealistic or too uptight, but I like to think that on an intuitive level, you do indeed understand my perspective and good intentions. Cheers.

          • Surfeit

            Presuming the report presumes nothing, and other presumptions are made not on experience and/or wisdom, I’d presume you’re correct.

          • Kai


            LoL, seriously though, the thing here is: if you accept some parts of the report/testimony/hearsay (like the kid pressed the buttons), you have to articulate a really damn good reason for why you don’t accept or disregard other parts when the information comes from the same source. The use of ‘presumption” in this case is only meaningful when it is about how much our conclusions are warranted by information we have. The moment the operating definition of “presumption” is set that low is the moment any discussion about differences or disagreements becomes meaningless. We should judge something by how much it fits the information we have, not by how much it fits our preferences or whimsy for what we wish to think.

          • Surfeit

            No comment.

          • Rick in China

            I didn’t have the ‘net for the weekend. I think we’re at the end of this conversation on this topic, though, there are some other stuff that needs excessive criticism!

            but I like to think that on an intuitive level, you do indeed understand my perspective and good intentions.

            I absolutely do. It doesn’t mean I wont drag on about how exhaustive and pedantic you can be. :D

          • I fully support you Rick. We shouldn’t be over protective and always resort to being overly kind and gentle over a bad behaving child. A simple smack is nothing. Heck, I’ve received worst kinds of abuse from choking to black eyes, but that’s not the guy’s fault for doing that to me. It’s because he was educated to think doing something like that is right from his dick-face dad (grandpa). Welcome to the Showa Era, where beating up your kids is the right thing to do!

          • mistertibbs4u

            A lazy ass parent.

          • Simon China

            I have a kid, 16 yo. If he’d do something like that, he’d probably get a rotating ass kick from me as well.

    • Apothis

      Hey Rick,
      You really are an asshole.

  • narsfweasels

    Why are people on the Second Floor using the elevator? Are your legs broken? No? IT CAN BE ARRANGED.

  • Surfeit

    Whoa! That’s bang out of order. I mean, if someone was in the lift and gave him a slap then yah cool, get it. Carting him off after the fact, like some kind of secret police, and then smacking the lad, just no. That is not your job, maaaaan.

    • David

      Except if somebody was in the elevator they could have pressed the buttons again and it would have been corrected. It actually would have been less of a big deal (but yes, probably would have at least been yelled at). I suspect he would not have had the nerve to do it with somebody in there with him.

      • Surfeit

        You managed to say nothing at all just then.

  • AbC

    The title is a bit misleading… Although a 17 yo is technically not an adult, but describing him as a child (rather than a teenager) doesn’t make much sense to me.

    Anyhow, the brat deserves all the slaps he got for wasting 7 minutes of other people’s time.

    P.s. I can understand if it was a 7 yo boy being a bit mischievous… But a 17 yo should know better.

    • arterius2

      Most chinese adults has the maturity of a child, let alone this 17 year old, he’s still a todler at heart.

      • Jannick Slavik

        says the fellow who previously admitted to striking minors in both the Western countries and China. Hmmmmmmm.

        Yes, i’m sure you are very “mature” with your fancy English teaching certificate and Expat “lifestyle” in China – living the high life you are – a man around town – easily able to look down on the uppity “immature” locals.

        Must be nice to lead such a life.

        • arterius2

          Why do you so liberally use these words: Attack, Strike, Assult, such serious choice of vocabulary. Have you been violently abused as a child? Does your daddy secretly rape you for afternoon tea? Are you hiding something about your dark past? Do you enjoy lying to yourself, it must be great living in a black and white world.

          • Jannick Slavik


            So about these comments you made earlier:

            “‘I’ve smacked plenty of brats in China and in the west, and don’t shove all that law and civil crap on me, shit doesn’t work like that in the real world, you should get out once a while.”


          • Jannick Slavik

            Hide your kids China! Artetrius is going to lose his cool again and smack them around!

            A real TOUGH GUY


          • Guest

            Ok, true story, about a week ago, there was this kid obviously dosed high on caffeine in the elevator with me, he kept pressing on the open-door button when I’m trying to close it, after about 4-5 attempts, I gave him 3 warnings, and he didn’t heed warning, while still laughing like a lunatic, so I gave him a solid bitch slap on the back skull, his head bounced about on the elevator door and that shut his fucker up nicely. What did we both get out of this? I got my fix and he got the best lesson he will ever receive in his life – for free, he will surely never attempt this stupid stunt again and sure as hell would thank the shit out of me later for who knows what might happen – like end up in a body bag when he’s met the wrong person at the wrong time, in the wrong place.

            Hell, I just saved this kid’s life.

          • Jannick Slavik

            and when the kids dad’s friends come around and break your legs later that night……..who couldn’t say you shouldn’t have see that coming?

          • arterius2

            What? Did I reveal something shocking? No, I just did what pretty much every (normal) person would have done in the same circumstance, except you, oh no, you are the defender of humanity, no, you are the guardian of the galaxy. Shit. you are more holy than Jesus himself.

          • Jannick Slavik

            So…about these minors you have “smacked” around…..have you thought of a different profession?

          • arterius2

            Oh hell no, there are always brats that needs a good smackin’ and you can bet I’ll be just around the corner to make it happen. Come sue the living shit out of me, mate.

          • jin

            I can see that you’re NOT immature like the most grown ups.

          • arterius2

            Society needs people like me to call it and end the party at 9.

          • James in China

            He’s such a tough guy, isn’t he? “I’m not afraid to hit children” just oozes masculinity and toughness.

          • James in China

            Here you go, you simple fuck. I even did the research for you.

            Here’s the definition of assault. Maybe you should read it 2 or 3 times to make sure you understand it.

            1. Intentionally putting another person in reasonable apprehension of an imminent harmful or offensive contact. No intent to cause physical injury needs to exist, and no physical injury needs to result. So defined in tort law and thecriminal statutes of some states.

            2. With the intent to cause physical injury, making another person reasonably apprehend an imminent harmful or offensive contact. Essentially, an attempted battery. So defined in the criminal statutes of some states.

            3. With the intent to cause physical injury, actually causing such injury to another person. Essentially, the same as abattery. So defined in the criminal statutes of some states, and so understood in popular usage.

            Now here’s the definition of battery, as in “assault and battery”. Once again, read it slowly so you don’t get confused.

            1. In criminal law, a physical act that results in harmful or offensive contact with another’s person without that person’s consent.

            2. In tort law, the intentional causation of harmful or offensive contact with another’s person without that person’s consent.

            Happy to help, fuckwit.

          • arterius2

            Right, and I’m not ashamed of doing it again.. and again. Whats your point? COME AT ME BRUH. COME STOP ME.

          • James in China

            Oh my, your reading comprehension is terrible. You’re a bitch AND a moron. You made a comment about the other poster’s use of vocabulary, and I simply did what you are apparently incapable of doing, which is reading and understanding what you’ve read. Still waiting for my doorbell to ring, little girl.

        • David

          What is your problem with teachers? Living in China and being a teacher is not something to be ashamed of. Why do you keep referring to the teaching profession as if it is something to be ashamed of?

          • Ken Morgan

            Because there are ‘teachers’ and there are teachers the ESL world is really bad for this in China with super low standards. Japan, Taiwan, Korea have cleaned up their act and do all sorts of checks preventing the riff raff getting into the country.

            One group are often mistaken for the other. Genuine teachers have teaching qualifications, have work experience and actually care about their learners. Sometimes there are those without qualifications but their passion can (sometimes) make up for it.

            Then you get the much loathed ‘teachers’ unqualified, no work experience and no real passion for the job. Sometimes they use their passports as a key to getting the job, sometimes white face. They just do it to make money. Sometimes they are running away from something. Sometimes they can’t make it back home and therefore run away to China where the wages afford them a better quality of life than back home. You see them drinking in bars of any big city looking simply for sex and not caring.

            These folks are hated by the real teachers especially the white ones who are lumped into the ‘you got this job cus you were white’. As it gives a very negative impression onto the Chinese locals of how western people are like. They also suppress wages by sheer numbers.

            For example on CS I wrote about Richard, from Stevenage UK. He went to teach at Anhui university he has bog all qualifications (let alone teaching qualifications). He openly boasts how bad a job he does and how he can get away with teaching the students wrong things. He does drugs and boasts about getting drunk daily. He also got expat bubblitis whereby because he has such a good life in China he thinks he is some kind of god and that everyone back home in the UK (people who are building good careers, buying homes and starting families) are losers compared to him.

            On reddit there is a pizza delivery guy from the US. He faked his qualifications at a print shop and taught at a top 50 Chinese university. He was found out and sacked. He then went back on a tourist visa and taught illegally before being thrown out. You want a pizza delivery guy to be a teacher of children… considering children are at an age where they are impressionable?

            Or forums filled with fratboys who consider China to be a party country like Thailand who talk about sex with local girls drugs and about how they turn up to lessons drunk, hung over or have to take time off from fights.

            There is a big CS article about this titled:

            The Great Pretenders: China’s “Unfire-able” English Teachers.

            Times are very slowly changing however as China gets richer they will do what S Korea, Japan and Taiwan have done and start demanding real qualifications and actually check the authenticity of them. People like Richard are going to be up shit creek when this happens.

          • Jannick Slavik


            The folks teaching in China that are credentialed and career-oriented educators are more often than not professionals, like any other professional.

            I met several “teachers” in China, however, who forged their credentials, leveraged their skin color, and were “finding themselves.” Nothing wrong with that I guess, but it doesn’t do the teaching profession in China any good.

            China should really clean up their act.

          • Alex Dương

            China should really clean up their act.

            I agree with this. I do think the “teachers” you and Ken refer to are tools, but at the same time, China bears fault for not having better background checks / application requirements and for excessively valuing the “look” of the teacher.

          • David

            And she thinks insulting all teachers is the remedy? Wow, she seems to have all the answers. Should I say “Well, she has no morals and the personality of a snail, she must be a lawyer” because some lawyers are ambulance chasers? It makes as much sense as the argument she have presented here. Take that how you like.

          • Ken Morgan

            I don’t know, I do however sympathise with her view. The point however is that it resonates with many as the bad image of ‘teachers’ and westerners in general is somewhat self inflicted. Individuals have deeper loathing than say a bad restaurant because teaching affects the students in the long term and if you are teaching individuals of an impressionable age then repercussions can last a life time.

            There are A LOT of expat ‘teachers’ who live in an expat bubble consider arterius2’s comments. He suggests the locals are immature and thus inferior to himself or his own countrymen for some unknown reason (if he is a teacher then he forgot to qualify/justify his statement).

            As above I’ve seen this a lot, where an ESL teacher making 10,000 RMB (and thus more than the locals) lets it go to their head and acts superior to the local people. When really it is a case of luck and circumstance rather than the outstanding qualities of the person in question.

          • David

            I understand her view, don’t hit children ever, even if I disagree. It is certainly a point worthy of rational and fair debate. Why does she not simply say that instead of bringing many irrelevant points (like if the guy was in Canada, what the law would be, how ignorant anybody who is a teacher in China is, how the legal system in China is screwed up etc. . .) and refusing to acknowledge that her point of view is not the only valid one, especially in a different country and with people from a different culture. No, I am not asking you to defend or explain, I am simply saying why that argument was so frustrating.

          • Ken Morgan

            Well it was obvious it was a weak argument anyway as she made an assumption and turned it into an ad hominem attack.

          • whuddyasack

            @Jannick Slavik Thank you for these posts.Thanks to people like you and a couple others, I now know that not all “expats” in China are the same and I shouldn’t paint them all with the same brush no matter how tempting it is.

            Totally agree with you about the “English teacher/ foreigner” problems in China though genuine teachers deserve all the respect in the world. I used to complain that pedophiles like Neil Robinson and Kenneth Freeman could get into the country way too easily and it was “the Chinese” government’s job to enforce tighter controls over this. Yet, I was called a “racist” by a majority of the posters here. Go figure. They also brought up such trivial yet utterly irrelevant obfuscations such as “Asian men do it all the time” or it “happens in every country”. Basically, they tried to draw attention away from the pedophile and many of them openly attacked those who boldly reported the creep.


            Then there’s this other group who calls themselves PUA but are actually just sexual abusers, plain and simple. They aren’t just found in China, but all over Asia. Here are some of these “creatures” in Japan:

            What I found really impressive was how quickly, efficiently and united the Japanese response was to all this. It’s what I’ve always said, a lot of the nonsense you see in China would never be tolerated in Japan. Even the foreigners in Japan stood up against that lowlife though of course there are still those that try to defend this man under the guise of freedom of speech, giving him too much publicity or Japanese “racism”. All of it bullshit churned from their rear ends. Unfortunately, in China, the second group of foreigners are by FAR the majority. I remember the whole David Bond video and how it created so much controversy in “HK” and how literally all the CS and shanghaiist commentators save a few tried to play this down or turn the issue to one about “Asian men”. To me, it really did seem like not all expats are equal.

            The petition is still opened and has reached 30,000 signatures:

            But change is coming. Slowly, but surely.

          • Ken Morgan

            Over the long term many these fake ESL people are s****ed anyway. If they do it for longer than a short period 6-12 months then it strips them of marketable skills. The sensible ones go home and do something positive towards their careers. Starting right at the bottom but a year behind. The less savvy ones stay too long invalidating their degrees (if they have one). They come back and have to compete with people graduating now who are more up to date who have more work experience from sandwich years. So employers have a choice between young malleable desperate fresh new graduates. Or somebody who took some time out doing a non job. Which means many are stuck up s**** creek without a paddle and have to continue ‘teaching’. Which messes them them up even more. While at the same time countries tighten up their visa requirements. Exactly like China is doing now.

            Being a fake ESLer is a bad place to be right now. Thailand just stopped visa runs, Vietnam now demands 5 years experience. S Korea is winding down EPIK. China is lowering the weighting for English on the Gao Kao. Also ASEAN intel sharing agreements are coming online in 2015 meaning people will get PIA on their records if they get caught in one country it will show up on other countries border control databases.

          • Jannick Slavik

            I have no problem with teachers.

            But…I think it’s amusing how many teachers I saw in China that saw the stint as a fun way to spend a gap year, and that often acted in ways that were in no way professional. Given their newly realized social mobility, I met many who thereafter became haughty and arrogant, believing themselves culturally more advanced than those around them…while on their weekly binge drinking sessions of course…..

          • David

            Then the next time you decide to insult a person you do not know over the internet that is open to everybody, why don’t you use the term asshole instead of teacher (because that is what your describing). Or you could use the synonym for asshole, lawyer.

          • whuddyasack

            I agree with your views that discipline, even if it means physical discipline is healthy for a child’s mental and spiritual development. I also think there needs to be a differentiation between teachers and “predators” and “leeches”. The former are genuinely making the world a better place and I have more respect for that profession than “consultants”. I am sure you agree with me on what utterly opprobrious parasites the latter are. Here’s an example in Tokyo:

            And it’s not even down to game. The girl in the convenience store in particular was clearly uncomfortable and nervous. It’s just plain old sexual assault and misogyny. I love how these losers need to size up and come down on a much smaller woman, five to one. They also do the same in Oslo. I don’t think women enjoy random men choking them and pushing their heads into a man’s crotch. I usually refer to these and their defenders as SWAM (Single, White and Angry Males) and they tend to be a nuisance everywhere. Not just in China. Here’s Julien “Blanc” performing the “choke opener” in Oslo. What a total creep.

      • AbC

        You could actually replace “Chinese” with [insert nationality here] and it’d still be true in most instances. The maturity level half the world over could be described as juvenile. Singling out China is a bit prejudice.

        • Jannick Slavik

          yes and no.

          China is a special case since it contains some 20% of the worlds population within a system existing largely around ad hoc fiats, non-transparent tacit understandings, and shady compromises.

        • arterius2

          I disagree, Chinese is well known for their emperor-like upbringing of their child, some of it might contribute to the one-child policy. Nowadays Chinese children are especially spoiled in larger cities and families at and above average income, they are rarely considered adults until well into their late 20s. In fact most Chinese live with their parents for the rest of their life and talking about their parents as “mommy and daddy” as if they’re still a toddler.

          • James in China

            Fuck, man take the time to read some of those fancy English books you teach in China. “Chinese is well know”. Sweet baby jesus, you’re a fucking moron.

          • arterius2

            I don’t teach English, but you should learn how to spell.

          • James in China

            Point out a mistake in my spelling, except my deliberate refusal to capitalize the word jesus.

          • arterius2

            Oh I didn’t even get to the word jesus yet, look again.

          • James in China

            Wow, it takes you that long to read such a short comment. I’m starting to feel sorry for you. It must have been hard for your parents, raising a kid with Down’s Syndrome and all.

          • arterius2

            You still don’t see it do you?

          • James in China

            You’re still not here, bitch.

          • James in China

            Still waiting on a spelling error, and still waiting for my doorbell to ring. You’re a bitch and a moron. You made a threat, I gave you my address to come carry it out. Yet you’re still sitting in front of your computer wanking at your own perceived wit. You’re a bitch, and everyone knows it.

          • arterius2

            You’ve used the word ‘bitch’ and ‘moron’ several times already in the same argument, dude, I get it, your wife said hi and you are still angry about it, but trust me, you don’t look any smarter the more you use it.

          • James in China

            OOOOoooooh how clever. I’m still waiting, bitch. Although, I think it’s best you stick with hitting children, as they won’t beat your teeth out of your mouth and then face fuck you like I will.

          • arterius2

            Tell your wife it was a good spankin’ ! I’ll come around next time when you’re around.

          • James in China

            She’s here now, bitch. Swing by. Lane 799, Shangbo Rd., Room 504, Shanghai. We’ll tag team her.

          • James in China

            Oh wait, are you still home? Not on your way to my apartment to cover me in bruises? Fucking bitch.

          • arterius2

            I came over, you weren’t home, or hiding in the toilet for whatever fucks I know, tho I smacked your bitch real good, ask her about it later.

          • AbC

            I do agree that most Chinese kids in semi-wealthy families are spoilt rotten (partly due to the one child policy) and act like selfish little brats. However, even in developed countries, the maturity level of the majority of young adults nowadays is clearly lacking.
            All the parents nowadays are either too scared or don’t know how to discipline their kids. You see kids everywhere chucking tantrums until they get what they want on a daily basis. It’s as if parents have all suddenly forgotten how to say ‘no’. When these kids grow up… They generally end up getting in trouble on a monthly basis as they have never been taught to be responsible.

  • Bluex

    17 year old? That is certainly not a “child”. Anyone doing that at that age deserves no sympathy. Also, don’t forget to blame the parents for not even educating their child right.

  • vincent_t

    That guy put in so much effort to track down the boy? I know the boy’s behavior is irritating but seriously?
    I bet this guy is more or less a little emperor in his family too.

    • Jannick Slavik

      actually, since the institutions are lacking in China, it’s common to resort to the little emperor role for self protection

      too bad the strata couldn’t just levy a fine to remedy such behavior…..but that would take common sense, coordination, transparency, precision…….

  • Just_Banlas

    He’s 17. She should have kneed him in the nuts.

  • coupled with being unsafe deathtraps, elevators in china are as slow as the elderly walking backwards

    hey, it’s great about the child abuse, but everyone is missing the point

  • Probotector

    “Even if the child is wrong, you still shouldn’t hit a child, because children have their dignity.”

    Fuck off, whoever wrote that. Children need discipline, structure and boundaries, not softly softly liberal crap that emboldens them. The people that are affected by rambunctious little shits like this have their dignity too. Moreover, this kid is 17!

    Having said that, when I read the headline, I thought the dude smacked the lil’ bastard at the time he was in the elevator, not later on with the bao an present. In which case, that was a bit over the top, as the moment had passed. The kid just needed a dressing down.

    Then again, even with a good talking to the mother would still have lost face and gone ape shit as they normally do…

    I’m with this guy:

    “When you don’t properly teach your child at home, then someone is going to teach them for you. Deserved it and was hit/slapped too few times.”

    • I bet he was wearing a pink polo shirt with the collar folded up. Some iPhone in his ears with a hello kitty case on it. Never played a day or sport in his life with his father or on weekends as a regular event. Probably has hair product in use with some colour in their too and complains if it is too cold.

      Maybe this kid will grow up to gang rape soon too? Or beat up old people out the front of their apartment complex because they interrupted his street racing?

      • takasar1

        of course…..let’s immediately stereotype every mis-behaving kid as some sort of rich, second generation playboy bereft of ‘fatherely’ companionship. lol

        • Not a stereotype. My opinion based on what I witnessed in my complex over 10 years. No fathers. Just grand parents and mothers tending to and playing with kids in arvo’s and weekends.

          • takasar1

            well then, i regret to inform you, but you’ve been living in a bubble. as someone who is regularly all over the country, i’ve only ever seen that in thhe countryside and occasionally in dalian. try visiting a park or even a popular tourist site.

      • Kai
    • takasar1

      have you not seen the world. this is the future! where kids can’t even be touched by strangers before the police are involved.

    • hehehehh

      he deserved a smack, but not by some stranger…

      and it doesnt matter if hes a child or an adult, you just dont smack strangers, thats assault..

  • Irvin

    wow! 17 years old and still considered a “boy”. I still remember when I was 16 I had to drive and deliver meat and beverage for my parent’s restaurant daily after school and had to carry everything to the second floor by myself, if the cook was sick I had to sub in and cook, bail my mother out of jail and bribe officials to let the matter drop, translate and interpret for legal matters, write contacts for employees and generally deals with anything that requires english.

    “Young men” in china these days got it good.

    • Zappa Frank

      You’ve been an amazing child

      • Irvin

        amazingly unfortunate, I wished I had elevators to push every floor back then, unfortunately the highest floor in my building was only 3flats.

        • Zappa Frank

          mine had just 4 floors (5 if we consider the ground floor), we had a lift, no floor’s memory, just one by one… but I’ve remain blocked inside pushing too many times consequently the red button of to stop it.

    • David

      Be careful or a certain Jannick Slavick will have your parents brought up on child abuse charges. BTW I am sure the work, as much as you must have disliked it at the time, made you a successful adult.

      • Jannick Slavik

        Oh yes, David is the worldly expat who “lives in China” as he previously boosted, full of context and knowledge, looking down at the non-expats with derision.

        Anyway, keenly note that if you attack a minor in the West, you could be up for a whole host of trouble. Not only that, you might have to deal with the parents of the child, many of which could see to it you have an “accident” one day.

        But again, you’re a worldly expat, I’m sure you already know that.

        • David

          LMAO you sound like a little kid trying to pretend she is grown up.

      • Irvin

        Not at all, all those forced labors made me quite appreciative of the privilege to slack off and I slack off every chance I get now.

  • FYIADragoon

    If you’re under floor 5 and you don’t have gray hair yet, you shouldn’t even be taking the damn elevator. Should have hit both of them across the face. 17 years old and still pulling stupid shit like this? Spoiled child. Someone needs to give him and his mother a spanking.

    • jin

      I don’t mind spanking his mother if she’s hot.

    • icup ✔️

      what if you have bags?

  • Xia

    A 17-year old boy is not a child, he is an adolescent or a young adult.

    Slapping people is not OK, regardless of age, because civilized people resolve arguments with words not with violence.

    • David

      I think you misunderstand history. For all of recorded history (about 6000 year), in every single society, civilized people have resolved problems with violence and very seldom with words (and those words that did work were almost always backed up by the threat of violence). That being sad, this man might have saved the kid a sever beating later, or possibly he was just a grouchy jerk. either way I think it is clear from the vast majority of Chinese comments and comments by foreigners who live in China, that the kid was pushing his karma when he decided to push the buttons.

      • Xia

        For all of our recorded history, our world has been a barbaric place. If that’s karma, do you think the boy should return the beating when he got the chance one day? If that’s the type of education he receives, I bet he will.

        • icup ✔️

          it’s the boy’s fault, if he wants to escalate the violence until someone dies that doesn’t change the fact that he created that cause and effect.

        • David

          Lessons are not taught in a vacuum. If they were nobody would evolve beyond fire. Simply using force to teaching a person a lesson does not mean they will only learn violence. Every famous person throughout history, until the last 50 years, has been taught lessons occasionally with the back of the hand. Adults who have experience and understanding and can use judgment know when this works and when it does not.

      • Jannick Slavik

        Yes, and in the civilized societies, the corollary to resolving problems with violence was the provision of remedies allowing for restitution.

        honestly, you don’t understand that?

        • PeterScriabin

          JS: although I’ve read through your single-handed slaying of the (how shall we characterize them?) lower beings here, and Liked your approach, I think we have to remember that the BOTTOM LINE is: how to discourage anti-social behavior? Fines, shaming and beatings are different means-to-an-end from this point of view.

          There is no ABSOLUTE sanction or prohibition, regarding violence. If a little slap deterred everything from robbery to murder to elevator buttons, I think even you and I would close our eyes and OK it.

          Violence gives the beater deep satisfaction. We know that from all the comments, Chinese and CS. Ask (p)Rick in China about it. You and I don’t like it, because it disturbs us and gives us a bad feeling, because revenge is a possibility, and above all because we noticed it just doesn’t work very well (ie. deter the unwanted behavior in future). We think there are, in practice, better ways, if only we can just learn, as a group, to control ourselves in the heat of the moment.

          My point is that there’s really nothing absolute (or higher) about non-violence. It’s about what works, all the way from a slap on a 4 year-old’s bottom, to the death penalty. And we’re also free to feel that the means do not justify the end in any given case. Half the people in this world still dig violence for its own sake. It’s such fun, don’t you know.

          • Jannick Slavik

            didn’t you hear? folks like David and “Rick In China” are worldly expats! They have context by the buckets, and have laddered up the social hierarchy by virtue of being “Western”

          • Kai

            I wanted to upvote for your point, but I don’t want to be seen as condoning the (p)Rick thing.

          • PeterScriabin

            It’s OK. I still feel good that I almost got an upvote from you. And the count is all square, because I accidentally Liked my own post (amazed one can do that).

            I also rather regretted giving in to the urge to write (p)Rick. I often agree with his PoV, but NOT in this thread.

            Violence as a disincentive to victim behavior undesired by the perp is always and everywhere a complete moral failure UNLESS the perp has no respect whatever for the victim. It’s always a lousy, meaningless way of (not) resolving a dispute.

            The urge to violence ALWAYS and EVERYWHERE indicates a deep problem with the perp not the victim! UNLESS, as I tried to say, it is committed in full consciousness that there is no alternative means of dispute resolution (like, er, talking it out reasonably). That is why I always kill mosquitos on the bedroom wall, and why I would fight ISIS (were I still young enough) to the death. [ISIS kills those whose beliefs do not meet their standard. There is nothing to do but kill them all, or be killed by them.]

        • David

          Honestly, do you think you are making points in your argument? I am not yet convinced you understand what ‘civilized’ means. OR that you can place your opinion in context. Therefore it is difficult to take your argument seriously.

  • JayJay

    This is so mundane compared with little English yobs in my neighbourhood, which, IMO, is a result of smacking laws and all of the none-sense child protection laws. I say well-smacked!!

  • Some guy

    So the mother watched him push all 24 buttons and did nothing at all at the time. After it turned into a big thing she says she “criticized him after she got home”. Bullshit, why not do it at the time?

    The brat did something considered unacceptable, he got a slap across the face for it and maybe learned something his mother would never think to teach him. Maybe it will make him a better person.

    • Kai

      If the mother watched him slowly press each button one at a time, she deserves more censure. If he pressed them all very quickly (not that hard to do, depending on the button layout and setup) and wasn’t looking until he was already done or halfway through it, I think she can be forgiven for not stopping him in time. She could even be praised for not letting it slide by chastising him.

      For a 6 unit, 2 lift setup, home may just be a few steps away from the elevator, so if she only noticed what he did as they were were getting off, she was more or less criticizing him “at the time”.

  • Amused

    A good asswhipping is a time tested teaching technique that has worked for literally thousands of years. It’s only recently that people have become so weird and soft.

    • Teacher in China

      But honestly, people became weird and soft for a pretty good reason. Children can get beaten too hard and end up getting killed, paralyzed, or seriously brain damaged. Too many fathers/mothers could drunkenly smack around their kids for no apparent reason, causing psychological damage, even if the physical damage was slight.

      These are very good reasons to be against the random beating of children.

      On the other hand, and here’s what I believe personally, a spanking done not out of anger, where the child fully understands what the wrong doing was and why he/she is being punished, doesn’t do anyone any harm.

      That, however, I see as very different from the random slap of someone else’s kid, whether it’s the guy in this story, or the several people earlier in this thread who seem somehow proud that they have randomly beaten one or several different children.

      • Amused

        Sure, there’s zero reason for the random beating of ANYONE, much less a kid. And no one should “man-beat” a kid for acting the fool. On the other hand, knowing that there ARE consequences if you piss other people off helps keep a young man out of the hospital, jail or the morgue.

        I’ve been on both the giving and receiving end of these things.

        When I was about 19 I made the mistake of running my mouth and disrespecting a guy in his 40’s in front of his wife and kids. He asked me to apologize. I declined rather rudely. He proceeded to hand me my ass in front of the friends I was trying to impress.
        To this day I haven’t forgotten the lesson, and I’m not pissed he beat my ass, just a bit ashamed I was ever such a dickhead.

        • Teacher in China

          Fair enough. I’m willing to accept that there are times when someone goes too far and maybe deserves what’s coming to him, but it’s a slippery slope from that to the random slapping of someone for an honestly pretty insignificant offense, to the random beating of someone on the street that looks at you funny. When it gets to under 18, I think the reasons would have to be pretty damn big to make me say it’s ok to smack him around.

  • commander

    By the way, can the buttons in the elevator which were mischievously pressed by the inquisitive boy be undone by pressing them again?

    • icup ✔️

      i don’t think i’ve seen an elevator like that… one might exist somewhere in a rich building but most i’ve seen is press and it’s set.

      • ClausRasmussen

        Try it out! Walk into a high rise, press all buttons, then try to un-press them and see what happen… oh, wait… nevermind

        • Alex Dương

          It’s OK as long as you remember to leave before the elevator door closes the first time…

          • icup ✔️

            and make sure not to get caught by the security… think that’s where the problem lies.

      • commander

        not ncessarily in a skycraper. A simple set of added electrical lines inside the button box in an elevator will make it have an un-button function.

        No need to slap someone across the face.

    • Kai

      I’ve only run across I think ONE elevator in my life that had this feature. Most elevators don’t.

      • commander

        That means if you made the wrong floor button by mistake, you have to stop on the floor in an elevator?

        Even if so, I think a smack to him in his face is too much as it made him feel degraded.

        Verbal warning would have been enough in this case.

        • Kai

          Yep, I do that sometimes, accidentally hit the wrong button. It sucks. Lol.

          Yeah, hitting the kid wasn’t appropriate. He simply lost his temper. Given how the kid and mom seems to be accepting blame for the prank, I think the man should apologize for losing his temper.

          • commander

            I think, the criterion in judging the propriety of his action is whether he is angered or not when his child pulled such a prank and get smacked in his or her face.

            I believe he would have recoiled at the thought of his uncivil act if he had weighed that possibility.

            The proper apology can be made with the man smacking himself. You know it’s joke. Sincere apology to the boy and his parents will suffice.

  • Logic

    2 Elevators and the article never mentioned the second elevator was defect. The article mentioned if the elevator would depart from floor one up to 27 without stopping anywhere it would’ve taken a little over a minute. The ride took 7 minutes and 9 seconds. If you take off the little over one minute the total time the man waited longer than it should’ve is 6 minutes. If the second elevator wasn’t broken the elevator could’ve gone up and down for 5 times at least! I think the guy who slapped this boy didn’t wait for the elevator at all. The guy who hit the boy might be someone not living in that building at all. Also waiting 6 minutes for an elevator shouldn’t be too long when you assume the second elevator WAS broken. The boy is at fault but maybe he DID know it wasn’t rush hour! Because he was a 17 year old boy. I think the person who hit him that hard according to the article should be punished for this. But china is a lawless place. You could kill people and live freely without ever being caught.

  • Jannick Slavik

    Imagine how silly one of these sickos justifying child abuse would feel if they struck out on a 17 year old, only to discover the minor had a learning disability, or some other mental retardation?

    I mean, what’s even worse than beating a stranger? Beating a stranger that’s also a minor. What’s even worse than beating a stranger who is a minor? Beating a stranger who is a minor, who is also disabled.

    Anyway, amazing how many “tough guys” are trolling the China Expat message boards, bragging about their ability to “teach lessons” to minors..

    I wonder how tough they would be if the guardians of those minors came by with a gang of thugs and put them into a wheelchair? Is that also a lesson learned?

    • icup ✔️

      well we can all go in on “what ifs” scenarios all day and that would result in nothing but since this happened to a competent 17 yrs old who knew exactly what he was doing… well deserved slap.

      • Jannick Slavik

        Yes, and the scenario as described above, in an advanced economy, one would expect to get sued and suffer substantial reputation risk/formal police investigation.

        Legal Guardians have some leeway in determining corporal punishment….within reason. Random strangers…Not so much.

    • Teacher in China

      Totally agreed with you there Even if we disregard the argument of whether it’s morally right or wrong to beat random kids in China, which seems to be very contentious on this thread, there’s the indisputable fact that in doing so, you are risking your life. I don’t think there’s a single Chinese person who would take the beating of their kid by a foreigner kindly, and you will soon find yourself staring down a gang of thugs there to beat the living shit out of you. So even if one thinks it’s morally acceptable, it’s still really fucking stupid.

  • Msg

    I will take this as a warning to myself… I love do this ;)

  • A Gawd Dang Mongolian

    I did this once as a kid. 52 floors. Never got caught.

    • Alan Dale Brown

      Should we send you over to this building’s security office now, for a little remedial behavior modification therapy? :o)

      • A Gawd Dang Mongolian

        Good luck finding that building…

  • Kpop-is-a-drug

    You know, pressing all the buttons may have caused an inconvenience but a slap to the face is too harsh. He is wrong, but it doesn’t mean he should be slapped. You guys are twisted and illogical, so are the Chinese netizens…”So simply apologizing when you were wrong is enough? Then those who commit crimes don’t need to go to jail?” Excuse me, but last time I checked, pressing all the buttons on the elevator is not illegal, however, assaulting someone IS. This child was assaulted and even if he is in the wrong, he should also be protected by the law.

    • Jannick Slavik

      gasp. common sense.

      typically, bylaws would regulate behavior in a common strata property (elevator) with a possible remedy being the imposition of a fine.

      At least in advanced economies, I can tell you taking a minor into a room, surrounded by security guard(s) and have a strange adult implement what was presumably a pre-meditated assault would certainly lead to a pretty substantial civil suit, or even the recommendation of a formal police investigation.

  • nondimwit

    Eh, I’d rather this then the cigarette smoking guy that gets on with me and spits on the floor.

  • Boris

    The problem i see is that not many parents are being ‘parents’.

  • vincent_t

    if that guy would hit ur kid in front of u, i dun think he would listen to you. That guy seems like having anger management issue.

  • Kai

    LoL, pretty passive-aggressive (and may have further inconvenienced other people like you waiting on other floors) but I can empathize with how satisfying that must’ve felt.

  • Balkan

    ” 17-year-old Young Du” He’s not exactly a baby, is he? The only way this could be forgivable would be if the young man was mentally challenged or handicapped.

  • shave1

    “At present, Ms. He has already asked the police for help, wants the person who hit her son to come out and give her son an apology.”

    May be the man can meet Ms He and smack some sense into her too.

  • Alan Dale Brown

    It’s not that the kid shouldn’t have been disciplined for this, it’s about how and who disciplines him. There’s ways to make him realize that he’s been an idiot without smacking him.

    Years ago, I was a RA for a professor from Turkey. His views were an odd mix of PC and rural Turkish attitudes. He told me once that he really didn’t want his kid playing with toy guns, “might treat real guns like toys”. Then he told me about how they used to handle personal disputes in Turkey. “When I was boy, and I had an argument with another boy, I’d come with my father into town, he’d come with his father into town, and we’d fight it out. You can’t do that here” (in Palo Alto, CA) “They’d sue you!” He was completely, sincerely puzzled by this.

    I think China isn’t nearly as squeamish about people smacking each other in an argument. But call me soft, I don’t think security guards should be in the business of smacking people who push all of the buttons in an elevator, kid or not.

  • Dolph Grunt

    I was following this feeling nothing but compassion for this curious little boy, then I got to the line “the 17 year old…”

    17 years old? Seriously!?

  • Zen my Ass

    The idiot is 17, I’d say one slap is too little, too late.

  • Radioactive_Panda

    I did that once when my sister dropped me off at my aunts work place. And I was 14 years old. My aunt took care of old people in building near the beach.

    I wasn’t thinking of getting caught by security since the elevation had no camera’s in it. If that was me I’d through a shoe in their face when they least expected it.

    If an old hag is gonna slap you try dodging their hits and they might snap there hand when they miss you in the processes.

  • Dark Night

    This kid didn’t deserve to be slapped! No matter what, a man should not slap a boy. What’s wrong with you people. They are both male. As such the security person should have punched him. A slap? Seriously? A little swell on this 17 year-old kid will not teach him anything. A punch, or better yet, a kick would have served him better.

  • neldabg

    I was getting ready to side with this “child” that the title mention, but then I find out that he’s freaking 17. I’m only a year older than him, and I knew better since I was like six years old. I’d slap him too, and he deserved that slap.

  • Simon China

    Unbelievable (that a 17 yo did that, many other smaller kids do it in China). If it was me, and got caught and reported to my parents, I’d get slapped by my father and mother in rapid sequence as well……

  • Rick in China

    I understand. I wouldn’t let someone smack my kid either, but this isn’t a realistic scenario for this person who I, based on the fact her 17 year old actually did this and says essentially “oh I was just curious so I did it” as a response when questioned, that nobody keeps the kid in line. That’s why I called her a coddling bitch. I think the most accurate description of what situation I’d probably be in comes from ‘slob’ a couple posts away (although perhaps ‘beat the shit out of’ would be replaced with ‘make sure he knew what was coming’), he said:

    “p.s and yes if my 17 year old son was being a dick like that and somebody slapped him, I’d knock the guard out and then beat the shit out of my son. That’s reality.”

    The bottom line is, teenage boys are different than girls, and if you don’t want your son to end up in prison – and he’s a little fucker getting out of line routinely, you’re not doing a very good job of parenting them. Lots of people who were ‘kept in line’ by their folks appreciate it later in life. There’s a difficult to determine grey line, but definitely is one, between abuse and smartening up, and I suppose it differs for each individual parent and child and their relationship as such.

  • RobDiesel

    You are all douchebags as witnessed by the giant mess below. Resident shouldn’t have felt the need to slap the kid. The kid needed slapping, but maybe by the mom. Either way, it’s a slap. If we went to the police everytime we got pushed/slapped or poked, the world would be filling up with pussy-assed beta-males…wait,wait…oh shit. :( You win.

  • ytuque

    Do Chinese really think a 17 year old male is a child?

  • eugene

    This teenager just want to figured out what will happened after pressed the buttons. Then he figured out.

  • Croid

    spare da rod an spoil da child!!! da mammy shoulda bin doin da slappin fo reels

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