Taiwanese in Vietnam Riots Turn to Mainland China for Help

Anti-China Vietnamese protesters.

From Sina Weibo:

@龟速船长TurboS: Finally found Wifi! Yesterday night was basically a riot! Attacking! Killing! Looting! The living district for Chinese has been looted clean! Equipment valued at over a million [yuan] at the worksite has been destroyed!! Everyone is nervous! We’ve currently retreated to Formosa Plastic’s administration area. There are nearly ten thousand people gathered here. There’s no air conditioning, insufficient water, and the temperature here is close to 38° [~100.4°F]. Everyone is looking forward to going home! Mother country [here, referencing China], where are you? I’m at: Vietnam, Ky Anh District

Comments from Sina Weibo:

马卡龙奥斯丁:

I looked over the original poster’s account. It’s a new account. In a moment of emergency, registering a new Weibo account truly is both daring and resourceful. China organized an evacuation long ago, and the vast majority of those who stayed behind are Wan-wan [Taiwanese]. Now China is your “mother country”? You’re inviting tragedy, haha. Normally calling yourselves Taiwanese, but where’s that resolve now? Now you say you’re Chinese.

干吓公产冻:

Don’t worry, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs will strongly condemn the Vietnamese government [and nothing else, which is a popular domestic criticism of the Chinese government in matters of foreign affairs]. You guys organize all your workers to have a meeting, learn from the spirit of Jiao Yulu, and have your leaders walk The Mass Line. Once tired, just lay down, sleep for a bit and have a Chinese Dream. The difficulty will pass, and oh yeah, the Americans are on the road…

林朝lonelin:

Compatriots, stay strong! The mother country is counting cash! It has already broken four cash counters! So please, compatriots, stay strong! Tomorrow we will severely condemn Vietnam!

王cherie:

How are there this many shit youth? At times like this, if the diplomatic route is not taken, should we really declare war on Vietnam? Even if we declare war, would other countries sit by and not intervene? Wan-wan [Taiwanese people] sure are amusing. Normally shouting insistently about Taiwanese independence and how they aren’t Chinese, but in a critical moment, it’s all “mother country” and “countrymen” and “everybody is of one family”? I hope our countrymen are safe and sound. It’s best to first hide [retreat, avoid confrontation]. Don’t listen to those people inciting people to take up arms and fight back. They aren’t even the ones there [in the situation], so all their talk is of course blind to the consequences.

一本烟书:

After my father saw this on the news today, he was furious. As a result, I was yelled at and scolded. Was this fucking my fault?

假象真名:

OP, just where are you from actually? “When China started drilling on the platform on May 7th, it had already issued notices to [Chinese] businesses in Vietnam. Those who have suffered the most losses in this incident are Taiwanese businesses, over 100 companies. The five Chinese companies that have suffered losses were attacked because they were close to Taiwanese businesses and have had dealings with them… The majority of employees of Chinese businesses evacuated long ago, and those that didn’t were mainlanders working for Taiwanese businesses.” So you think of the mother country now, do you? How embarrassing.

米老鼠外婆:

A certain party of your mother country is busy counting money, secretly transferring assets over to Imperialist America.

难琢哥哥:

Fighting a war against Vietnam is inevitable, and better sooner than later. This has been decided by the larger international environment and the smaller Asian regional environment, and it will not be changed by our will. We love peace, but do not fear war. Now the first question is, should the first battle be at Hengdian? The second is, should the task of attacking be given to August First Film Studio or the general television and art center?

良景大神:

You guys [Taiwanese], each and every one of you, are always make making a fuss about separating [from China, with formal Taiwanese independence], making a fuss more reliably than ghosts, but the moment something goes wrong, your democratic Taiwan looks to the mainland for help. That one time, I don’t remember if it was Libya or Syria, but when Chinese were being evacuated, every one of you Taiwanese people were crying and begging to get a flight out on the mainland’s [charter] planes. Now why are you crying for the mainland’s help? Go cry to your American or Japanese dads [masters]. Aren’t you the most close with them? You Taiwanese people look down on us mainlanders so, sorry, we’re too poor to dispatch planes to save anyone other than Chinese people.

田天天天天天天天天天:

So you cry for the mother country now? Taiwanese people…

anti-chinese-protests-riots-vietnam-02

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  • China should write a book…”How to piss off your neighbors…Japan…Vietnam…Philippines…Malaysia….and not influence people”

    • Mighty曹

      Why bother writing a book when they’re already acting out on the scripts?

      • Jay K.

        ah i see what you did there! that’s upper management thinking ability right there

    • Mark_Wallace

      (Forcibly avoids mentioning North America/South America)

    • nqk123

      so much for peaceful rise right. you forgot s korea. while korean coast guard was busy with the sinking ferry, chinese fishermen was busy fishing in their water.

      • bang2tang

        you need to be opportunist to survive in this world.

    • bang2tang

      although china piss the world off, the world still depends on China to produce their PC peripheral.

  • bang2tang

    Viet mob is no different than mainland mob …

    wtf, Taiwanese factories getting burned because of mainland who start drilling in SCS… and apparently Viet mob (paid rioter???) cannot differentiate between Korean, SG, Taiwanese factories. Pretty weird since K-pop pretty famous in Viet.
    It seems they’re taking advantage from this situation for looting…

    • whuddyasack

      Sadly mob mentality brings out the worst in people. I remember the Chinese anti-Japan riots in 2005 and 2012 and they were just as horrendous. Judging from some of the race riots in Greece, Russia, US, Australia it ends up looking disturbing too, probably even more so as it’s not what we expect from “civilized” countries. I’ve been told from some Vietnamese friends that this was more a riot/looting based on opportunity as Japanese, Korean and Malaysian factories were also razed and looted. Thanks to clarification from Chucky3176, I think it really is a case of mistaken identity although the violence still isn’t justifiable. It would make sense since most of the Vietnamese mobs were those living in rural areas.

      • Mihel

        race riots in Greece

        I’m familiar with several riots in Greece, but I’ve never heard of race riots. Care to clarify?

        • whuddyasack
          • Mihel

            Thanks for the links, I had not heard of these incidents.

          • Zappa Frank

            If you read the links you will see that one is not even a race riot, but a riot against police and the first is a consequence of stabbing.. However both during 2011 the black year for Greece far from being something common in Greece like recently whuddy like to present it..

          • whuddyasack

            Frank, unfortunately Golden Dawn is still active. They’ve been active in 2013 when one tried to punch the Greek mayor but hit a 12 year old girl instead. The party denied touching the girl. Classy right? Some of their activities in 2014.
            http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/in-greece-a-low-grade-street-war-brews-with-neo-nazi-golden-dawn-party/2014/02/03/c2329550-8cdb-11e3-98ab-fe5228217bd1_story.html

            They even bring their troubles abroad:
            http://overland.org.au/2014/04/false-dawn-fascism-in-greece-and-australia/comment-page-1/
            http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/golden-dawn-supporters-clash-with-antifascists-in-brisbane-20140502-37msg.html
            This is the same party that beats and stabs opposition members. Where internal conflicts resulted in the murder of their own members. Conveniently pulling the race card to justify their existence like POS aka school shooter, woman beater.

            And of course, they are eligible for election:
            http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-27371457

          • Zappa Frank

            And that’s make of Greece a dangerous country? I’m sorry for your friend, but I’ve been to Greece with no problems, my parents have been to Greece with Jo problems, several Chinese go there every years with no problems, among them many I know, even a group of 3 tiny girls that, how strange, did not have any problem too…
            Now if you would mind to tell us how come that every topic of china smack, even one about Vietnam, can be turned in an attack to the “white race” I think many of us would appreciate, because more and more you seem a broken record like Germandude said.

          • whuddyasack

            It isn’t unsafe, but it just carries some risks. I’ve got plenty of ethnic Greek friends and they’re all terrified and oppose the violence employed by GD. It’s not what you think. When we are talking comparatively and “potentially” though, of course Greece is more dangerous than say Finland or Japan.

            As for answering your question, it might sound like an attack on the “White race” but that is not my intention. The first comment was that mob mentality is always ugly no matter who does it and Asians do not have a monopoly on this. Now please answer my questions.

            Why do people keep bringing stereotypes about Chinese/Asian racism into this topic? Why is Japan so frequently brought up? Or Tibet? Or misogyny? Adultery? In fact, I think even before I posted here people were already stereotyping Asians as “racist collectivists” among other pseudo-intellectual nonsense.

            Why is it OK to judge 1.3 billion people based on a fringe minority of online comments but when it comes to judging the people who make mostly disparaging comments on Chinese/Asians, it’s wrong to generalize them too? Think about it.

            The only comments that are actually relevant to this topic are condolences to the victims, criticism of the violence that took place, suggestions of steps taken to prevent future violence and a disclaimer that not all Vietnamese are mindless thugs. But that would be boring, wouldn’t it?

          • Zappa Frank

            Ok got it, two wrongs make a right…..perfect.
            Actually in this articles you are the only one that attack whites, you just write some shit, mostly by second or third hand if ever, replying to imaginary questions to bring in whites people…. What can I say….good job. It has been a pleasure to talk with you, but now this pleasure is over… I’ll stop.

          • Mihel

            Yes, the first link is about a ‘normal’ riot turned up racist, but it’s not an article, more of a slideshow. The second riot is clearly anti-immigrants, but I cannot load the images provided in the article nor the ones in the original greek article, I cannot tell if the hate is just direcet at the fact that they are illegal or if it is because they are, I suppose, black.

          • whuddyasack

            You are welcome. I learnt about the situation in Greece from friends who warned me not to travel there. I did a little research and found out that foreign tourists were beaten by police. Upon more research, I discovered that the “Golden Dawn” was the instigator in almost all of these incidents. Women and girls were beaten for opposing them, an anti-fascists was stabbed amongst other things. For a while, it seemed like the whole nation was overrun by thugs.

            I apologize if in any way I come across as gloating about what’s happened in Greece. I’m actually very fond of Greeks and Greece and admire it’s historical, cultural significance and perseverance. What’s happened is a tragedy and something everyone else should seek to avoid.

          • Mihel

            I had an absolutely untroubled stay in Greece a couple of years ago, and many acquaintances like me have had no problem.
            I don’t doubt tourists were beaten by police, but given the popularity of Greece as a holiday destination and the relative rarity of such reports, I’d say it’s a fairly safe place to go on vacation.

          • whuddyasack

            Thanks for clearing that up. I guess media portrayals make it seem much more imposing than it really is.

  • Luck Of Fire

    What a bunch of nationalistic punkass. They have burned the Singapore flag as well – what a wonderful way to lose investor’s confidence. Soon, their own citizens will be crying – hell they are going to lose all those factory jobs.

    • bang2tang

      ignorance to the max…

      • Retarded Vietnamese…Why are they killing Innocent Chinese, Taiwanese, last count 21 dead..who won’t even get a single penny from the oil rig…They are just like ordinary people trying to earn a living by honest means…and they destroyed companies from Taiwan and killed Taiwanese whoever resembles a Chinese..

        Stop freaking killing innocents man…This is so retarded….

    • Jay K.

      in retrospect, burning the singaporean flag..wait there’s such a thing as a singaporean flag?

      All this time my chi-malay friends told me SG was just a city with incredulous amounts of autonomy from malaysia. what’s going on here.

      • Luck Of Fire

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singapore

        Singapore is a sovereign nation, we broke up with Malaysia in 1965

        • bang2tang

          Jay K. sounds like troll…

      • They killed anyone who looks like Chinese in Vietnam…Its retarded what they did

        • Zappa Frank

          If that’s the case they may kill themselves too, Vietnamese look a lot like Chinese and there have always been a lot of Chinese in Vietnam

      • WFH

        and I heard malaysia was a suburb of Singapore…

        wtf…so confusing….

    • Alex Dương

      Yeah, I don’t get why some rioters burned a Singapore flag. Singapore has no maritime disputes with Vietnam as far as I know. At least in Taiwan’s case, Taiwan actually claims the Paracel (and Spratly) Islands that Vietnam claims. With Singapore, it just seems like “if you’re Chinese by ethnicity or ancestry, then we don’t like you.”

      • bang2tang

        I think vietnamese and all SEA people except Papua native, have chinese blood on them, they looks more chinese than Pinoy or Malay …

      • WFH

        puzzling why lots of Viets claim they are actually of chinese ancestry….

        • Alex Dương

          Hmm, I’m not sure if I’ve had the same experience. I’ve certainly met some Vietnamese who have told me that they have Chinese ancestry (e.g. Hoa parents / grandparents).

          But it’s not like with the Thais. I’ve met many Thais who have no problems saying that they have Chinese ancestry. Vietnamese usually aren’t as comfortable as the Thais are in saying that, at least in my experience.

          • WFH

            yeah. strange. half the vietnamese folks I’ve met are very quick to say they have Chinese blood. same with many pinos. it’s more like a point of pride when they say it.

            maybe it’s just a skewed sample.

          • Alex Dương

            My sample could be skewed too; I can’t deny that possibility. In the case of Pinoys, I know that Ferdinand Marcos once said something like, “Yeah, I have Chinese ancestry. Pretty much every Filipino political leader does.” I guess the second part could be interpreted as a point of pride, though I had never thought of it that way.

      • whuddyasack

        It’s not just people of Chinese ethnicity that have been targeted apparently. Information from friends and scouring the web suggests that Korean, Malaysian and Japanese businesses were also subject to looting and burning. What’s important to note is that many Vietnamese are ashamed of the excessive and uncontrolled violence. Alex, I know it’s rude of me and I’ll apologize in advance. But are you a Chinese Vietnamese? If so, perhaps you know more about this and wherever possible, feel free to correct any misconceptions I might have.

        • chucky3176

          Korean companies put up Korean flags, and the problem was solved. There were no more cases of getting mistaked.

          • whuddyasack

            Thanks for clearing that up.

          • ScottLoar

            I find this hard to believe.

            A mob has as much sense as an agitated cephalopod; it reacts as a single body, it doesn’t reason. Moreover, Korean companies in Vietnam (and Micronesia) are infamous and hated for the arrogance and brutality of Korean managers; look to past incidents where Vietnamese workers went on strike against Korean management. Your claim that a Korean flag over a facility is protection against mob violence in Vietnam is without foundation.

            Koreans are not well accepted in Asian countries, most especially Korean management. A Korean flag is the same as waving a red flag at an angered SEA mob.

          • chucky3176

            It doesn’t matter what you believe. The reality is different. Out of over 400 Korean companies, 80 saw some damage. The Korean embassy suggested to put up the Korean flag, and take down the Chinese writing signs. Korean companies did so. This took immediate effect and zero Korean companies were damaged.

            http://dimg.donga.com/wps/NEWS/IMAGE/2014/05/16/63515907.1.jpg

            http://news.donga.com/Main/3/all/20140516/63515910/1

            Come to think of it, Same thing happened in China couple of years ago, when the anti-Japan riots happened all over China. Many Japanese and Korean businesses got damaged. Koreans put up Korean flag and avoided damage. Some Japanese also pretended to be Korean when they were asked their nationality to avoid being hurt. This was in the news at that time.

          • ScottLoar

            During the riots Asian companies were indiscriminately attacked. You yourself give example that of 400 Korean companies in Vietnam 80 were damaged. Then on day 2 (day 3? You tell me) and after the Vietnamese authorities are able to bring matters under control no further damage done which you attribute to hanging the Korean flag. Again, I doubt hanging the Korean flag stopped the mob. Chinese characters are commonly recognized in Vietnam, and locals surely know which companies are Korean and which Chinese and Taiwanese. Yeah, they really know.

          • Guest

            You’re not making any sense here. You’re claiming that Koreans are so hated in Vietnam that the Vietnamese will target them deliberately. Then after the Korean flags were hung by all those Korean companies, why weren’t there anymore attacks on Korean companies? The newspaper says the attacks were still ongoing yet the Korean ones seem to avoid anymore problems. If what you say is correct, shouldn’t the hanging of Korean flags invited more attacks instead? Yet there are none. How strange. What about attacks against Singapore and Japanese companies? If Vietnamese locals know which companies are from what countries, why would they attack Singapore and Japan?

          • ScottLoar

            I did not say Vietnamese would target Koreans intentionally in this instance, although Vietnamese had rioted against Korean managers in the past and seemingly with just cause against the arrogance and brutality of those managers. I did say the mob was mindless and looked to damage any alien Asian entity as witness the attacks on Singapore, Japanese, Chinese, Taiwanese and yes, Korean, companies. My point is clear: the Vietnamese government is exercising control and the riots stopped. It is that control and not the Korean flag that likely stopped the mobs. A mob of frustration is on the loose and you believe the Korean flag is making an oasis of serenity among the rioting flow.

            Of course locals know which companies are from which countries. They know their neighborhood, they know people who work for those companies; the Vietnamese language itself was expressed in Chinese characters before the present system of romanization became popularized during education beginning in the 1930’s and is still widely read and universally recognized as Chinese. So, answer your own question: why would they attack Singapore and Japan? Because it’s a mob rioting, mindless and looked to damage any alien Asian entity.

        • Alex Dương

          Not rude at all. I’m not Hoa; Alex is my given name, but Duong / Yang isn’t my surname. I picked Duong because I thought it had a nice ring to it.

          • whuddyasack

            Thanks for clarifying Alex. Yes, I guess I was curious to know if you were Vietnamese and wanted to understand Hoa better. Duong does have a nice ring to it ;-)

    • steviewah

      The reason goes well beyond the Parcel Islands, there has been an undercurrent of aggression towards foreign companies in Vietnam for years now. Local Vietnamese haven’t felt the economic benefits of these companies – low wages, foreign workers taking there jobs, etc. These people have nothing to lose and could care less about investor’s confidence.

      • Luck Of Fire

        Yea, but blaming everything on the Chinese? Who is the one taking bribes, suppressing trade unions and basically be useless and unaccountable to their own citizens?

        • Zappa Frank

          Yes how strange, look for an enemy outside to blame, who ever in the world has done that before?

  • ILoveGoldStandard

    There had been tensions for a long time over low wages and poor working conditions in Vietnam. The dispute over South China Sea just gave them a reason to loot and riot. A lot of the factories aren’t even Chinese owned. Some Vietnamese even says the protesters may have been agitated and manipulated bv a number of bad individuals. The Vietnamese government sort of turns a blind eye it since it serves their purpose. Sometimes you just have to wonder why the poor get so excited they shoot themselves in the foot.

    • Luck Of Fire

      Nope, they shoot themselves in the face. They’re going to lose their jobs!

      It’s unfair for the Vietnamese people to blame the Chinese entirely and fail to forget about their government – who is the one taking bribes and suppressing trade unions?

      SOURCE: http://www.hrw.org/news/2009/05/03/vietnam-end-crackdown-labor-activists

      http://www.amchamvietnam.com/1702/vietnam-in-bottom-third-of-corruption-perceptions-index-transparency-international/

    • bang2tang

      Yep, reminds me of 1998 riot in Indonesia, they exploited Indonesian born chinese to serve their own political agenda…

      • Irvin

        I would be interesting to see what the fallout would be, I doubt it’ll be as bad as indonesian having their currency plummet to hell but I can’t wait to find out.

      • whuddyasack

        I’m not too familiar with the 1998 riots, just learned a thing or two about it from people who’ve lived through it. But it must’ve been a terrible time for all involved.

        These riots also remind me of the anti-Japanese riots in 2012 with the difference that there were more casualties here. It seems politicians everywhere tend to create an external enemy to satisfy their own personal agenda.

        • bebek_loncat

          I deal with the riot in Indonesia, it was horrible and it is one of the reason that now I prefer to reside outside of Indonesia.

          Although nothing can justify a violent riot, but at least the riot in Vietnam was triggered by the dispute over China building the oil rig. I feel sorry for Koreans and Taiwanese for bearing the consequences as collateral damage.

          While in 1998, no one can explain why people attacking Indonesian with Chinese descent, and it still a big question mark till now. The riot in 1998 was far worse with lots of casualties and damages I hope this won’t happen again, to anyone, anywhere in the world.

          I lived in Vietnam about a year, couple years ago. The similarities between Indonesian and Vietnamese is that the majority of the people are both “uneducated” and easily provoked.

          Bottom line, this kind of conflict will never end as long as people tend to judge a race based on one person’s action.

          • whuddyasack

            I’m sorry to hear of what you’ve all endured, bebek_loncat. It’s the same everywhere, it’s always the uneducated and the uncouth who violently participate in riots. An us vs them mentality is quite easily taken advantage of and those living in poverty or not so well to do suffer more from it due to limited access to resources. The instigators, the ones behind it are always thugs in suits manipulating the mob to their advantage. I’ve seen videos of riots in Greece, China, Australia and personally in Canada. They’ve always been an ugly sight. You have a very good heart and I hope we’d never see riots like the ones in Indonesia ever again.

            Bottom line, this kind of conflict will never end as long as people tend to judge a race based on one person’s action.

            This is sadly true and unfortunately, given the way things are I think the world has a long way to go before race riots become an afterthought.

          • linette lee

            Just because two gov’ts have dispute don’t give them the right to kill Chinese people or Vietnamese with Chinese descent or riot against Chinese companies. That is just barbaric. In North Vietnam a lot of Vietnamese has Chinese blood and they have businesses but they are Vietnam citizens under Vietnam government. Can you believe your whole family living under their gov’t generations after generations and intermarried the locals but after so many years are still viewed as outsider. That is crazy.

      • linette lee

        That was disgusting how they killed Indo-Chinese. The Indo Chinese are Indonesians too their own countrymen. Many of them they intermarried the locals. It is just that a lot of them are wealthier and have businesses so the locals are jealous. But if you speak to Indo Chinese or Thai CHinese they don’t view China is their country. They will tell you their gov’t is Thai or Indo.

        • Zappa Frank

          there is a contradiction in what you say:

          ” The Indo Chinese are Indonesians too their own countrymen”
          if with countrymen you refer to Indonesians people, evidently not since they killed them for being Chinese.
          if with countrymen you refer to Chinese people, well how can they be their countrymen and in the same time they consider them Indonesians? And indo-chinese how can they be countrymen if they do not view china as their country?

      • John Snow

        yea, I was there. Went to the shopping mall in Jakarta and left 2hours before it was blown up. Our family high tailed out of there when we could after the back log of people could catch the plain. Remember driving to the airport at 4 am using the expressway without paying for tolls… just drove straight through… no one was there to accept our money.

  • Mighty曹

    Just reading the Weibo comments was pissing me off. All those ignorant fucks are so enjoying the fact that ‘Taiwanese’ (assuming they are Taiwanese) are crying to their ‘Mother’ country for help. The Motherfucking Country who set off this anti-Chinese violence by drilling.

    • Alex Dương

      The comments are certainly petty. It just goes to show that like (just about) everyone else, they get a kick out of schadenfreude.

      • Mighty曹

        Haha yeah, Shadenfreude best describes it.

    • whuddyasack

      Agreed, those negative comments and the gloating that comes with it were plenty frustrating to read. I can understand some of their sentiments, but on the other hand Chinese have to see things from the perspective of non mainlanders. As much as I don’t appreciate the way some more well to do Chinese look down on mainlanders, I find some of the views Chinese nationals have can be equally arrogant. It’s not just Taiwanese, HKers or overseas Chinese that differentiate themselves from mainlanders and cry for help when the moment arises. Mainlanders can be equally guilty of this.

      A bigger person would have shown sympathy and empathy inspite of their feelings even if they don’t get a thank you. Instead of taking the opportunity to come together, comfort each other and show the other side that they genuinely care, they ruin it with their gloating.

      • Mighty曹

        The way the renounce any kinship to overseas/foreign Chinese is disheartening because all non mainland born Chinese were taught at a young age to accept China as the mother land and the people as fellow Chinese.

        • noodles76

          They were?

          • Mighty曹

            WE were.

          • noodles76

            I wasn’t attacking your grammar. Genuinely curious if your statement is true or not.

            This bit..

            all non mainland born Chinese were taught at a young age to accept China as the mother land and the people as fellow Chinese.

          • Mighty曹

            I wasn’t making a correction. I was stressing ‘we’ to affirm that I am inclusive of that group.
            Yes, that bit is very much true and already echoed by another member here. It’ll be interesting to take a small survey to see the result.

        • whuddyasack

          Agreed. I think that is the biggest problem and it is nothing but hypocrisy to even think that Taiwanese only consider themselves Chinese when in need. I’ve seen mainlanders do the same thing, ESPECIALLY when disputing against Japan or any foreign country that’s slighted them. They want every overseas/foreign Chinese to espouse their views yet ditch them when it is most convenient. I find the needless bickering between Chinese truly sad, the less of that the better.

          My mother taught me the same thing. That it didn’t matter if I was born overseas, wasn’t a Chinese national or had loyalties/opinions different from the mainland. Despite being Canadian, China is still the motherland, the land of my ancestors and it is wrong to feel superior to those struggling in the mainland. No matter what their nationality, all Chinese are kin.

          It’s something I try to follow (key word try). Perhaps it is just me, but I have a soft spot for those of my race. Apparently, according to most on this blog, I’m racist yet isn’t it natural to feel concerned about those just like us? Since childhood, my closest friends were Asian and Native Canadians. I find few things as enjoyable as watching an Asian family having a picnic. I think that’s what really defines me, a person enjoying the best of both worlds and culture.

          • Mighty曹

            Yes, my siblings and I were taught to love our ancestral homeland and we’ve always identified ourselves as Chinese. I have stopped after seeing how the Chinese nationalists view us (American Chinese and Canadian Chinese). It was the comments I read in the story on American Chinese soldiers killed in the war. The comments were unbelievably cruel and it opened my eyes as to how the mainlanders feel toward us oversea Chinese. With the exception of my relatives who are in the mainland, I say ‘Fuck you!’ to all of them.

          • whuddyasack

            True, I think that’s something many Chinese have in common. Even if our parents didn’t teach us this view, there will always be some uncle or auntie somewhere who “ensured” we understand that China was our motherland. BTW, I read that article and I’ve got to say what happened to Pvt. Danny Chen was disgusting, made even worse by the Chinese nationalists. I’ve been called wumao and fenqing quite often, but to be honest I can’t identify with them at all.

            Those comments were sickening. Nationalists everywhere tend to be the same putrid creatures and when anyone identifies themselves as such, I naturally tune off. Notice how whenever something happens to ethnic Chinese abroad, these people would readily ditch their “brothers/sisters” and quickly say they are American, they are Canadian and wash their hands of any responsibility. Same comments can be seen in the NYC beating, someone claiming that the 68 year old is an American and thus not their problem.They also flushed the whole discussion down the sewer with the American running dog comments. Ugh.

            Yet I can’t hate all mainlanders. Many I know have been excellent people, and my friends and relatives there have been anything but obnoxious fenqing. There’s some pockets of good there still haha. I probably haven’t told you this, but I once visited the more rural areas of China with my dad and group of volunteers. They were volunteering with the villagers and providing free medical aid. For the first time, I saw the rural poor and knew how privileged I was to live in a developed nation. I think our game of soccer with scrunched up newspaper was my favorite game of all time. If you’ve read the article about the girl singing patriotic songs to satisfy her hunger, it’s this that truly moves me. It becomes even more relevant when you’ve been there in the midst of poverty, seen it, smelled it, touched it. I can understand why people hate the Chinese Government, feel it is inadequate. It made me take the usual nationalistic tripe with a grain of salt.

            With the exception of my relatives who’re in the mainland, I say ‘Fuck you!’ to all of them.

            I love this hahaha. Nice one XD

          • Mighty曹

            I agree not all are the same and I shouldn’t hate them all. Sorry, each time I rant about that article I tend to group them all as one. (For personal reasons I’m extra sensitive to that particular article). Yes the comments were sickening but you’re right, I shouldn’t hate them all.

          • whuddyasack

            I understand. You have every right to hate them if it makes you feel better. Sometimes we just need to let it all out when coping with loss. Those comments pissed me off too, and the lack of respect for the dead was just annoying.

            It’s one of those things that have real life implications and I don’t blame you. It was shocking and when I found out about what happened to Danny, it was a terrible feeling. I can’t even begin to imagine how it’s worse for those that personally knew him.

            I can’t fault you for the way you rant. Have you seen my rants? If I ever criticize or mock the way you rant, feel free to give me a virtual punch to the face ;-)

  • arterius2

    If you ever been to Vietnam, for the majority of their citizens(whom are mostly uneducated peons), its “us vs them” mentality, even towards western countries like US, France etc..

    • wes707

      Practically all Asian nations have an “us vs them” mentality – tribalism runs deep and is encouraged.

      • bang2tang

        but Asian love apple, fb, twitter …

        • Mark_Wallace

          Which only proves that there are stupid people in Asia, too.

      • steviewah

        That’s because Asian nations have a culture of insulation. They haven’t been able to adapt to globalization, so they use censorship and nationalism to protect themselves.

        • ILoveGoldStandard

          No. That’s not about it. It has nothing to do with globalization. Please don’t use “globalization” like a buzzword. You don’t even understand the principles behind it.

          • There is no principles here…I know my Kind being an Asian…5000+years of history and we haven’t learned anything except to still worship those in power..We are slaves Neo

          • ILoveGoldStandard

            You know everything about “your kind”? What are you? God? Seriously, i don’t buy that. I’m Asian too. Off course globalization has meaning. It’s transnationalization. That is not something we need. What Asian lacks is Rationalism. A belief of reality that has an intrinsically logical structure.

          • steviewah

            I used the term globalization very loosely, so sue me. However, the use of globalization was justified. Let me explain.

            Globalization is an economic term that dates back a few decades. More specifically it emerged during the 1970s and is still being played out today. The idea behind globalization is deregulation, laissez faire, the destruction of nation-states and the rise of multi-national corporations. Of course, with a more integrated economy means a merging of cultures, laws, regulation and customs. So there you have it, it doesn’t just impact the economy. There is a real political narrative behind globalization as well, it impacts culture. Through economic reality, cultures will collide and the dominate one survives. New world order anybody? That was the general idea behind globalization. I’m not going to debate further whether globalization is good for the world or not, I’ll leave that for another time. But the fact is it has changed how we all interact with each other and how nation-states position themselves.

            Asian countries have been slow react to these changes. I’m not talking about their economic impact mind you, I’m referring to the cultural and social impact of each nation. Whether you like it or not Western neoliberal ideology is the dominant force right now and many if not all Asian countries do not hold these same liberal views. They are still stuck in a very patriarchal society where seniority has more relevance. This in return encourages tribalism, but this type of thinking won’t survive, not in this global economy where countries are expects to be even closer integrated. Not with America having the dominant media outlet where anyone via Internet connection can access it.

          • ILoveGoldStandard

            Which is why i reject the idea of Western neo-liberalism. While in theory it is supposed to be laissez faire, a free market competition, in reality, It is Corporatocracy. It is Keynesianism. It is Consumerism. That is not the alternative you want to prefer to the current one. But also that is not to say that the current one is better either.

        • bang2tang

          I think Asian esp. China have great adaption skill judging from how they copy US pop culture and branded luxury goods…

        • I’m Asian…Basically, we are retarded and Not evolved enough…We can make all progress we want, get nice car and house but intellectually we are still in stone age…We can never be like Europe or America, countries which allows wide range of ideas to come to your minds and not just narrow thinking…

          Culture is a code word for devolution.

          …We are way to emotional, quick to judge an entire race based on one guys action, not give credit based on individuality…Basically, we are good at working in Nike Factories and then revolt by brainwashing state propaganda..

          • Zappa Frank

            The fact about judging a ‘race’ by one person act is especially true. I remember a Chinese girl that was desperately looking for any Ireland guy just because during a vacation she had great sex with one of them, and now she believed that all guys from Ireland are great lovers….well maybe is true..

          • Surfeit

            Ireland is the land of great lovers!

          • bang2tang
          • Zappa Frank

            No, but is the reaction described in the article is pretty common… Any non asian guy with an Asian girlfriend has experienced the frenzy reaction of some Asians males..here on china smack some even find a justification talking about how the Chinese are on the edge of the extinction and therefor must “protect their girls”

          • bang2tang

            “Chinese are on the edge of the extinction and therefor must “protect their girls”.

            Huh? with more than 1B chinese in mainland and hundreds of millions overseas chinese ? ROFL…

          • whuddyasack

            Frank, here is your problem. If you read the comments from that article and the following article, you’d see that 99% of the comments are NOT from Asians. They are laced with sexism too so why not just tell it as it is? It’s mostly from insecure White dudes who make it a point to feel better about their own poor success with women.

            Do you think it is right to secretly film sex videos of women and post these online without a woman’s consent? It’s illegal in the US. What I was taught was when a girl says NO she means NO (in reference to the Japanese woman). Outside of 2 or 3 White guys, every comment in shanghaiist chose to overlook this because Asians, duh. Put it this way, and answer honestly, would YOU like some married creeper randomly adding your young daughter on facebook and sweettalking/flirting with her for sex? What most of the HKers are doing are raising awareness so that the naive can make an informed choice. I understand them.

            Now I can’t believe you tied down my explanations on the extinction of East Asians to this?!?! WTF. It’s not about “protecting Asian girls” because of insecurity. I feel the same way about Asian males marrying White females. We’ve gone through this. East Asian populations are declining. I’ve seen the situation amongst native Americans first hand and know of some tragic acceptance issues amongst mixed children. That’s the crux of it. I understand you too.

          • Zappa Frank

            Yes like Asians guys never done this..
            Please..

            Hope bang2 tang read your post, else would be hard to believe it..

          • East Asian populations are declining?
            In which world do you live?

            I would rather say the population of white
            people in the world is declining. The number
            of mixed children is even insignificant.
            You have 2 billion ethnic east Asians
            worldwide vs. how many white people?

          • whuddyasack

            If by East Asia, you mean China, Japan, Korea, Taiwan, HK, Singapore, etc. then yes, they are declining. East Asian birthrates are lower than European birthrates, and that’s before we include Indians, Pakistanis, North Africans and Middle Easterners who form part of the Caucasian (White) race. If you google it, you’ll find that the EA birthrate averages around 1.3 while European birthrates average around 2.0, Caucasian birthrates being much higher.

            There are 2 billion ethnic East Asians worldwide, but there are 4 billion Caucasians (1 billion Europeans, 3 billion MENAs, SAs, WAs).

          • Alex Dương

            Any non asian guy with an Asian girlfriend has experienced the frenzy reaction of some Asians males

            I hope you don’t think that’s a one-way street.

          • Zappa Frank

            According to what io read no, it is not. But as you can understand I do not have direct experience. On my side I can say I knew some Italians girls with Chinese guys and, as far as I know, no one told anything, but this must be also because the kind of friends I have. Sure that some guys would not be friendly.

          • Nephilim

            The population of women in south east asian (Thailand, Burma, etc) is far greater than male counterparts. Thats considered Asia right? I assume you mean China and not all asian counterparts

          • Gordon Gogodancer

            I saw a Chinese guy with a white chick yesterday at Sichuan Uni. I didn’t stare at them, i just noticed them as they sat under the same pavilion as me avoiding the rain. Apart from my initial thought that a Chinese guy with a white chick was a rare sight….i didn’t feel offended in any way and i didn’t give them any weird looks. I don’t know white guy who gives a damn about an Asian guy with a white chick, i certainly don’t care.

          • Alex Dương

            Relationships are private; in other words, I don’t care about who other people see. Does that mean no one cares?

          • Gordon Gogodancer

            lol, interesting example :D

          • JayJay

            The effect of a good pint of Guinness… they do taste different in Ireland…

          • samuk1000

            Can I trade my western evolution with your Chinese ability to get nice car and house please?

      • Mark_Wallace

        But the USA is nothing like that, is it…?

        ITYM: “Practically all … nations have an “us vs them” mentality”

        • Zappa Frank

          It is up to the cultural level of the subject you are talking with.. However I can’t deny in china I’ve seen this more often even among so called educated people..

        • whuddyasack

          In my experience, “White” Americans can be some of the most racially driven,clannish archaic people of all. Wherever they are expats, be it China, Japan, Korea or Thailand, they form enclaves contributing to their host nations’ crime rates. They whine about Black Americans all the time but in reality, they are actually worse. For some reason, “everyone” is out to get them, even White women. That’s /sarcasm there. Articles are written about a new majority masquerading as some violated minority. The single, white and angry male. Case in point being a certain user who frequents this board and shanghaiist under 1000 disparaging and “wacist” pseudonyms.

    • nqk123

      not really. In general they are friendly people. some suspicion against westerner in northern Vietnam (mostly old people, war veteran). it’s understandable due to their history. overall though, the people are pro west and anti China. the sad situation for vietnamese people: government officials are mostly pro china and anti west (party over people, if you know what I mean).

    • ClausRasmussen

      >> uneducated peons

      It is not because they’re uneducated or because they’re peons, it is because it is basic human nature. This us-vs-them phenomenon can be seen all over the World where large groups of people go out of control.

      What makes this special, and most of all other instances where life is lost in riots, is that the authorities didn’t intervene and instead let the hooligans roam freely. The blame falls squarely on the Vietnamese authorities.

      • We don’t read enough, How many Asians do you see while on your travel to Asia, queuing up near Libraries and book store not at Samsung mobile store….Asia has the lowest book sales from Amazon….lol

        We easily get brainwashed…There is NO WAIT…LET ME THINK Mode in our brain cells…WE JUST REACT…& Attack…Basically Retarded….:)

        • Zappa Frank

          Come on, Asians read ebooks we all know this….on iPad, on smartphone, and so on.. . And anyway to read a book doesn’t mean anything if you read trash..

        • Irvin

          Asia pirate all their books just like everything else, doesn’t mean they don’t read.

        • bang2tang

          damn true… But nowadays it’s cheaper to visit e-library & wikipedia on internet…

        • whuddyasack

          This has more to do with India than anything. Women are gangraped and murdered, violence, racial riots are a daily occurrence and supression/discrimination of minorities the norm. And that’s before we even bring up the gigantic MRAs operating there. All because they want to continue their bride burning tradition.

          While it’s true that the Indian majority are geographically Asian, culturally, physically and genetically, they have more in common with Europeans (themselves a rather brutish, clannish people).

          • Zappa Frank

            I find amusing read all time people that write about something they don’t know anything.

            Clannish people, you can really write that without laugh? Brutish, yes, not like Asians, well known for good manners and exquisite etiquette.
            But I am sure you can rely on some maybe never existed friends that told you about what Europeans do or think.
            And again your desperately attempt to link Indian and Europeans… Like if what happen in India have to reflect on Europeans, but i guess you’ve never been in Europe ..
            I don’t really get what’s your problem with white people, I guess one of us dumbed your sister, because I really cannot find any other explanation for such persecution that become more and more ridiculous.
            Look here, you go so far to reply with something completely unrelated with what other people were talking just to attack once more white people.. Isn’t this pathetic?

      • whuddyasack

        This us-vs-them phenomenon can be seen all over the World

        Sadly, this is all too true. America and to a lesser extent Canada and NZ are good examples that the “us vs them” mindset happens anywhere. They’ve become shattered nations because of the self-serving divisive tactics of politicians, corporations, media and large unchecked swathes of “patriotic- traitors” who readily ditch their compatriots because of race. The media outrage generated from Katy Perry, Avril Lavigne and Miley Cyrus’s supposedly “racist” portrayals of Asians is frustrating because it distracts from genuine grievances.

        Every year in Canada, people would violently riot over hockey “games”, occasionally resulting in injury or death. Racial riots are rife across Europe, and Greece is close to a disaster zone with the Golden Dawn running wild and murdering opposition party members.

        I’ve known Asian Americans who push for segregation and while I disagree with running from the problem, I can empathize with them. It’s hard to live amongst tiny-minded people who still hold archaic mindsets and stubbornly cling onto them.

        As crazy as they sound, Jenny and Suey make some decent points vis-a-vis their mouth foaming, braindead opposition.

        • ScottLoar

          You’ve gone far, far too far in your prejudice.

          Asians, no matter from what country, ethnicity, religion, find the US to be tolerant, welcoming, and without hassles. I know many, many Asians, particulary mainland Chinese, who have visited the US not once but multiple times and their general experience is one of finding friendliness, respect and in turn giving high regard to their visit in the US. Nobody hassles them, no one turns their head to spit invective, no one thinks to cheat or otherwise abuse them, no one calls them “chink” , “alien” or worse; in short America, a country largely composed of immigrants, does not see itself as a “white” monolith and US culture encourages multi-culturism as it denigrates exclusivity. My Chinese wife lived in the US more than 30 years, worked in commercial enterprises and later taught high school students in Chicago, and not once experienced the prejudice, invective, hate and disgust that you and others casually attribute to Americans. Just where do you get off? How are you qualified to make pronouncements about the US that I, my wife, my friends find so contrary to our experience and knowledge?

          You and several others use this forum as a podium to castigate, denounce, and generally throw shit. Enough! I’ve lived in four different countries in two continents and concede that among them all the US is the most tolerant. Any number of persons with experience of the US from Taiwan, Hong Kong, Malaysia, Singapore, mainland China, Japan and Korea would agree with me.

          • Alex Dương

            I’m Asian American. My parents emigrated from China, and I was born here. I disagree with whuddyasack that “self-serving divisive tactics of politicians, corporations, media and
            large unchecked swathes of ‘patriotic- traitors’ who readily ditch their compatriots because of race” is a common practice in the U.S. 2014 is not 1954, far from it.

            However, I also disagree with you that “Nobody hassles them, no one turns their head to spit invective, no one thinks to cheat or otherwise abuse them, no one calls them ‘chink’ , ‘alien’ or worse.” If whuddyasack’s statement is an exaggeration, then yours is also an exaggeration on the other side of the spectrum.

            When I was in middle school, I was the only one in my class who was not immediately issued a school ID. The staff who took the photos asked for my social security card. WTF, I was eleven years old then; I didn’t know what that was, much less carry it on me at all times. I asked my friends whether she had asked them for theirs, and none of them said yes. I was “hassled” because I wasn’t white or black.

            Racism is much, much, much less of a problem than it once was. But you are seriously understating its existence if you are honestly saying that no one harasses Asians because of their ancestry. That was not a common experience for me in middle and high school, but I did have to experience it on occasion. A guy I did not know would occasionally walk past me between class changes and say “chingchongtingtong” to me every time he saw me. After he did it the third time, I ran up to him and asked him if he had a problem. He said no, so I gave him a firm push and said “good.” He never harassed me again.

          • ScottLoar

            Alex, you weren’t “hassled” by being asked for a social security card. It is common practice for East Asian (okay, Korean and Chinese) parents to dump their kids in an apartment in the US so they can attend school, so much so that the local schools have to visit families at the
            given address to verify that is their residence and they are legal. Proving that you are a citizen is not prejudice; it is necessary because of the very people who take advantage of tolerance and exploit loop holes, just like the pregnant Chinese mothers coming to the US to birth a
            child and get that oh-so-important US citizenship.

            “Chingchongtingtong”? That’s childish, was meant to goad you, and coming from one lout. And I commonly hear “Hello” used in Mandarin as a noun for all foreigners, which is not meant to goad me; it’s just the way foreigners are commonly regarded and talked about. At least you are understood when speaking English without a doubt; after more than 40 years I get dumb looks about one of every four or five times I speak Mandarin.

            Racism. Alex, you yourself well know that the most racist group you’ll find in the US is not the red necks you love to trot out as tired example but the recent immigrants who want to maintain their supposed racial and cultural purity, and Asians.

            So the point is exactly as I said, “in short America, a country largely composed of immigrants, does not see
            itself as a “white” monolith and US culture encourages multi-culturism as it denigrates exclusivity.” Americans are among the most tolerant people I’ve met despite the example of one Alex who had to face a bully in American high school saying “chingchongtingtong”. Alex, read as
            example the articles in the popular Chinese press like that in the publication 大家 then judge how supposed “racist” America compares.

          • Alex Dương

            Proving that you are a citizen is not prejudice; it is necessary because of the very people who take advantage of tolerance and exploit loop holes, just like the pregnant Chinese mothers coming to the US to birth a child and get that oh-so-important US citizenship.

            It’s prejudice when I’m the only one who needs to prove that I am a citizen. If everyone were asked to do that, fine. But that was not the case.

            At least you are understood when speaking English without a doubt; after more than 40 years I get dumb looks about one of every four or five times I speak Mandarin.

            Why shouldn’t I be understood when speaking English? I learned the language natively and went to public schools for K-12.

            Were you born and raised in China? If not, then I don’t think our situations are comparable.

            Alex, you yourself well know that the most racist group you’ll find in the US is not the red necks you love to trot out as tired example but the recent immigrants who want to maintain their supposed racial and cultural purity, and Asians.

            Who has an “us versus them” mentality now?

            Americans are among the most tolerant people I’ve met despite the example of one Alex who had to face a bully in American high school saying “chingchongtingtong”.

            Wow. The delusion here is mind blowing. I wouldn’t trade my U.S. citizenship for any other citizenship in the world. And I very, very, very strongly disagree with people who want to say that we are still stuck in 1954. We are not.

            But I disagree just as strongly with people such as yourself who want to pretend that to the extent there is any racism in the United States, it is from new immigrants. That is nonsense.

          • ScottLoar

            1) The authorities cannot vet every person. They
            can profile (racial profiling has been challenged in court ) and it does work; customs officials, border agents, police and others well know what groups and types are most likely suspect for a particular offense. These agents are not prejudiced; they are tasked with a responsibility and their experience and statistics show which groups are most likely suspect. A white American I know who wears a beard visited the Middle East several times for business over the course of a few months; of course he was pulled aside after a few trips and thoroughly checked. Me? I’m a white American male with a beard travelling often to and from Asia and only once in decades was I randomly checked. Can’t you understand the difference? Or, ask Chinese, or Singaporean or Hong Kong customs officials which group of airline passengers is most likely to carry prohibited goods. Hint: It’s not the average white foreigners they’re looking to. But you foolishly insist ALL must be checked in the name of racial equality, and that failing to do so equates to racism.

            2) Alex, my accent and pronunciation of Mandarin was schooled at university in both the US and Taiwan, and I am literate in the language. Now, why do some fail to understand me? Because the white face speaking Mandarin cannot be accepted by 1 out of every 4 or 5 Chinese mainlanders. I was in a small public park in Chicago speaking Mandarin to my then 5 year-old daughter; Mandarin is her mother tongue, the language of our household (even the cat responded to
            Mandarin, not English). The only other persons were a mainland Chinese motherwith her young daughter; you could tell from the clothes, the color combinations, and their Mandarin they were from mainland China. My daughter wandered away some distance so I loudly called her back and spoke some few sentences to her. This woman suddenly heard Mandarin being spoken, and despite I was the only other person and a male voice as well, she looked all around for the source. She even looked up searching the sky! What a hoot! She never did grasp that white man was speaking – what! Mandarin. And all because of my skin colour. I can give countless examples of Chinese failing to grasp that Mandarin is not a language particular to Chinese; some mainland Chinese even get angry when I speak Mandarin or pretend not to understand, insisting I speak English to them.

            3) Noting that the most racist in America are typically new immigrants wanting to protect their supposed racial purity and culture ain’t prejudice, it’s the way it is. They don’t want their children marrying outside the tribe, they try to protect the tribe in police matters, and most often prey upon their own members in the name of preserving the tribe (look to the Irish example of the 19th century). And you well know resident Asians in America are among the worst, even to the extent of voting against further immigration.

            4) No, I did not say nor can a reasonable person infer that racism in America is solely from new immigrants. As I again stress, racism is most common among new immigrants who cannot quite accept that in the US tolerance and cultural diversity are inherent to American life (as example look to those insisting on Hindi and Muslim practices even when those practices contravene local custom, established morals, federal law and
            the majority of their own kind). Granted, tolerance and understanding are in some more so than others; I don’t credit Americans with superior virtue, but I do recognize American cultural traits of tolerance fostered by long experience of immigration further supported by law and our public education.

            Now, stop accusing me of spreading nonsense, and read with understanding.

          • Alex Dương

            The authorities cannot vet every person.

            In my case, the school could have vetted every student. It was simply a matter of the principal sending a notice home with each student: “bring your child’s Social Security card on [date], where your child will be issued a school ID.” No such notice was issued. That staff on the spot asked me, and only me, for my Social Security card.

            If you want to justify racial profiling, fine. But racial profiling is hassling. You can say it’s appropriate or justified hassling, but you can’t say it’s not hassling. So in this sense, by so strongly insisting that I was “merely” racially profiled, you’ve already contradicted your original claim that no Asians in the U.S. are hassled because of their ancestry.

            Alex, my accent and pronunciation of Mandarin was schooled at university in both the US and Taiwan, and I am literate in the language.

            OK, thanks for confirming that our situations are not similar at all. I learned English natively at daycare at the age of two. You learned Mandarin as a foreign language at university after you turned eighteen. There’s no reason for anyone to not understand my English in the U.S., and yet, I have met people who have pretended not to understand me.

            Unlike you, I’m not so tone deaf as to fail to extrapolate from my own experiences. I accept yours even though you do not accept mine.

            Noting that the most racist in America are typically new immigrants wanting to protect their supposed racial purity and culture ain’t prejudice, it’s the way it is.

            No, that’s your opinion. Setting aside that I disagree with it, I find it amusing that this whole subdiscussion started because some people thought “us versus them” was an Asian thing. Your comments make it clear that it is a universal thing.

            I do recognize American cultural traits of tolerance fostered by long experience of immigration further supported by law and our public education.

            Then I think your understanding or knowledge of American history is very poor. “Tolerance” is a recent thing. Nativism and anti-immigrant sentiment dates back at least to the 1850s, when the Know Nothings opposed immigration from Irish and Germans who happened to be Catholic instead of Protestant. Over a century later, anti-Catholic sentiment had subsided but was still prevalent enough that JFK had to give a speech in 1960 about his faith.

            As Americans came to accept Irish and Germans, did that acceptance transfer to other groups? No. The purpose of the Immigration Act of 1924 was to restrict immigration from Southern and Eastern Europeans, especially from Italians and Slavic Jews. The Act’s supporters thought these people were lesser humans who couldn’t ever really be “American.”

            Every example I’ve listed in the previous two paragraphs pertained to immigration from white Europeans. Gee, if white Americans wanted to restrict immigration from other whites, what do you think happened to non-whites like Asians? I hope no comment is necessary and that you know what happened to the Chinese by law and the Japanese by “gentleman’s agreement.”

            Of course, I haven’t mentioned the elephant in the room: black Americans. “Tolerance” sure as hell didn’t apply to black Americans throughout most of American history considering that the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was only passed fifty years ago.

            I don’t get this. All I said was that racism is much less common than it used to be, but it’s not extinct. Somehow, such an obvious and to me non-offensive statement irked you to the point where you want to whitewash U.S. history and pretend that we’ve always been so welcoming and so tolerant and that the people who’ve disturbed this balance are people like my parents.

          • ScottLoar

            “I don’t get this. All I said was that racism is much less common than it used to be, but it’s not extinct. Somehow, such an obvious and to me non-offensive statement irked you to the point where you want to whitewash U.S. history and pretend that we’ve always been so welcoming and so tolerant and that the people who’ve disturbed this balance are people like my parents.” Which summation shows how little you care to understand.

            I never said, implied nor can a reasonable person (and you’ve proven to be not) infer that racism is extinct, non-existent, gone, vanished, disappeared from the US. I did not whitewash US history and pretend that Americans have “always been so welcome and tolerant”; each of those fallacies is your own creation which you attribute to me. Then you attribute this to me, “the people who’ve disturbed this balance are people like my parents.”

            You can’t beat the bushes for the slightest whiff of racism when your own stink is overpowering. I repeat, ” I do recognize American cultural traits of tolerance fostered by long experience of immigration further supported by law and our public education.” You don’t. Even a passing comment in high school so occupies your memory that one can only doubt how you truly regard yourself.

            The Civil Rights Act was initiated and passed to redress inequalities that persisted in the culture despite the fact of the US Civil War. Catholicism was never an issue in the Kennedy race, despite newscasters fishing for a story and anti-Catholic fliers planted by the Kennedy advance team itself. Kennedy was elected as were Catholics before and after him; Catholics in office as Jews in office did not begin with that era. Obama was elected. Asians hold cabinet positions and hold both appointed and elected offices. It all escapes that sanctimonious sniffer Alex.

            Last, I speak Mandarin on the phone. That day or the next the same person on the phone meets me, then looks around for the one who is surely accompanying me because I cannot possibly speak Mandarin. But you still don’t want to understand, excusing this studied ignorance.

          • Alex Dương

            I never said, implied nor can a reasonable person (and you’ve proven to be not) infer that racism is extinct, non-existent, gone, vanished, disappeared from the US.

            Oh spare me your self-righteousness. Don’t give me that “reasonable” bullshit when you said, quote, “Americans are among the most tolerant people I’ve met despite the example of one Alex who had to face a bully in American high school
            saying ‘chingchongtingtong.'”

            And please, let’s not forget your paragraph where you claimed, quote, “no one” in the U.S. has any prejudice against Asians: “Nobody hassles them, no one turns their head to spit invective, no one thinks to cheat or otherwise abuse them, no one calls them ‘chink,’ ‘alien,’ or worse.”

            I did not whitewash US history and pretend that Americans have “always been so welcome and tolerant”;

            Uh, yeah, you did. You said, quote, “I do recognize American cultural traits of tolerance fostered by long experience of immigration further supported by law and our public education.” And then you pathetically tried to insinuate that I don’t recognize tolerance. I recognize it, but it isn’t a longstanding cultural trait. To say otherwise shows how shitty your knowledge of U.S. history is.

            You can’t beat the bushes for the slightest whiff of racism when your own stink is overpowering.

            Provide a direct quote of my alleged racism, or else shut the fuck up.

            The Civil Rights Act was initiated and passed to redress inequalities that persisted in the culture despite the fact of the US Civil War.

            Holy shit, Batman, you actually think the Civil War really did anything to redress “inequalities that persisted in the culture”? Fuck man, did you fall asleep in U.S. history when your teacher covered Reconstruction and what happened afterward? Does “Jim Crow” not mean a goddamn thing to you? Jesus H. Christ, the ignorance here is astounding.

            Catholicism was never an issue in the Kennedy race, despite newscasters fishing for a story and anti-Catholic fliers planted by the Kennedy advance team itself.

            Yes, of course it was never an issue. That’s why JFK gave a full speech on it. Because it wasn’t an issue.

          • whuddyasack

            Alex, when you ever come across situations like this again, I hope you’d keep my advice in mind. Don’t let it get to you, be snarky, witty, snide, whatever. But never ever take these people seriously.

            Scottloar is obviously too pigheaded to ever give you a “reasonable” reply. Reasonable in quotes because you can’t expect reason in the unreasonable.

            He is not ignorant and in the US, a worldly man has no excuse to be ignorant. Rather he is just being disingenuous. I’ve showed direct proof and even blogs and articles where Asians were the victims of hate crime or experienced some form of racism. One of those has even become a topic in Chinasmack, so I don’t even see why he feels the need to skittle and dance around the issue that “wacism” exists in America. IMO, Asian Americans are the LEAST racist and LEAST likely participants of a hate crime or racial riot.

            I know how you and I disagree to certain extents on the prevalence of discrimination in America but to me over 60% of Asian Americans being cyber bullied an 54% bullied in class is disturbing. I don’t speak for myself but for those who otherwise would be shut up by the same people that you’re trying your best to be civil with.

            Like you, I hate the illusion that America is perfectly tolerant and safe, safer than countries in East Asia. It fosters makes Asians (especially recent immigrants, students an tourists) far too trusting, doing stuff that they’d normally do in their hometowns or even bolder things under the false impression that they are safe. It makes them forget that they are in a foreign country and should always keep their guard.

            The people who assure them that it’s safe, that there are no “rapists”, “muggers”, “assaulters”, “haters” etc. aren’t the ones risking their own lives or those of their families.

          • Alex Dương

            I’ve read his comments before, and none of them were this dishonest. At most, I can give him a benefit of the doubt and say that he simply, for whatever reason, refused to back down from his claims.

          • whuddyasack

            Yes, you’re right about not backing down. Then again, I’m like that too haha. Perhaps it was because of “my tone” that he felt obliged to be this disingenuous. Exaggerating to try to get to me somehow as asinine as that is. Losers on the internet don’t affect nor faze me, especially coming from non-Asians. I find myself caring MUCH more when I’m talking to a fellow Asian. Like I said before, the person is intelligent enough to think outside of the box. He willfully doesn’t want to. With that said, at least he has the courage and conviction to not have to hide his posts.

          • ScottLoar

            Alex, you cannot read with understanding. I’m sure this is not the first time persons have noted so, and habits like that made by viewing from a narrow prism are not easily corrected.

            JK gave a full speech on being Catholic to gain voter sympathies and play on prejudices in the same way the Tawana Brawley case was fabricated to gain sympathies. Again, his advance team spread flyers denouncing Catholics to stir up voter sympathies (JFK denied knowledge of it; perhaps he didn’t know). Alex, read history.

            Look to this simple sentence: The Civil Rights Act was initiated and passed to redress inequalities that persisted in the culture despite the fact of the US Civil War. Subject – verb – object. The US Civil War was fought over slavery and ended in the defeat of those seceding states intending to create their own slave empires. The Civil Rights Act a hundred years later was initiated and passed to redress (racial) inequalities that persisted in US culture. That includes Jim Crow, Alex. Can’t you understand simple cause and effect?

            You are studiously ignorant. You casually accuse me of stupidity even as you fail to understand straightforward sentences and vocabulary. My comments to you are not unique; again and again others here note your narrow prejudice in reading and interpretation. Frustrated in argument you stamp your feet, louder and louder each time. I’ve avoided anything but plain prose so that you may not misunderstand but now accept you’re not here for any kind of exchange; you’re here to proclaim a position.

          • noodles76

            I remember when I was a student…the school would do lice checks once or twice a year. One kid was called out from class after. He was the only one. Was that racism too?
            Did it ever cross your mind that the school perhaps had copies of everybody’s social security card on file but your own? Nope. The only explanation is racism. Obviously.

          • ex-expat

            Kids pick on each other for being different. If someone calls me “four eyes” that does not necessarily mean that society is prejudiced towards people who wear glasses.

          • Alex Dương

            I really don’t see why you and Scott want to pretend that there is no racism or prejudice in the United States.

          • ex-expat

            Lol please show me where I said that.

          • Alex Dương

            Your reply to me was an attempt to downplay my experience as “kids will be kids” and to dismiss it by giving an example of being picked on that had nothing to do with race, ethnicity, or ancestry. To me, that seems like an attempt to pretend that there is no racism or prejudice in the U.S.

          • ex-expat

            What I said was “does not necessarily mean,” which is true. It may have been because the child was racist, but kids do get picked on all the time for being different, whether it be acne, glasses, or whatever is the most readily visible. Do you really disagree that kids make fun of each other for being different? But you have made a huge, and pretty silly, extrapolation.

          • noodles76

            I don’t think that’s what either of them were saying.

          • Alex Dương

            I think Scott said, quote,

            Nobody hassles them, no one turns their head to spit invective, no one thinks to cheat or otherwise abuse them, no one calls them “chink” , “alien” or worse

            and that is simply not true. Is racism prevalent in the U.S.? No. This is where I disagree with whuddyasack. Is racism nonexistent in the U.S.? No. This is where I disagree with Scott, ex-expat, and you.

          • ex-expat

            Again, I never said racism was nonexistent. Please stop making things up. As taken from my earlier post:

            “There are certainly instances of racism, as there are anywhere, but that does not mean it is not tolerant as a whole.”

            You and I actually agree on this point.

          • Alex Dương

            Yes, I do agree with that. What I disagree with and found distasteful was your attempt to downplay my experience by basically saying “kids will be kids.”

            In fact, let’s take a step back. Why are the two of us even arguing if you knew that I agreed with that statement because I made a similar statement myself?

          • ex-expat

            I did not attempt to downplay, I just merely pointed out that given the circumstances, it is possible that it was not due to genuine racism. It may have very well been, but given that kids often say mean and idiotic things, it is hard to say with absolute certainty.

            I am not arguing with you on racism in the US, just your assertion that I pretend it doesn’t exist. But I believe that is cleared up now.

          • Alex Dương

            Clarification accepted.

          • noodles76

            You are putting words in my mouth. I never said racism is non-existent in the U.S.. Uncommon and generally disapproved of and punishable in many cases… yes…but it exists. By the way, perhaps if you reread his post in it’s entirety you’d comprehend his meaning. The quote you posted sounds nice and all but….now put what he said into context…as he did.

            I know many, many Asians, particulary mainland Chinese, who have visited the US not once but multiple times and their general experience is one of finding friendliness, respect and in turn giving high regard to their visit in the US. Nobody hassles them, no one turns their head to spit invective, no one thinks to cheat or otherwise abuse them, no one calls them “chink” , “alien” or worse; in short America, a country largely composed of immigrants, does not see itself as a “white” monolith and US culture encourages multi-culturism as it denigrates exclusivity.

          • Alex Dương

            You might’ve had a point had he not doubled down on his remarks with, quote,

            Americans are among the most tolerant
            people I’ve met despite the example of one Alex who had to face a bully in American high school saying “chingchongtingtong”.

            I don’t understand why the two of you feel the need to downplay my experiences. I never said they were everyday occurrences or that racism is commonplace. I merely recounted some experiences to illustrate my disagreement.

          • noodles76

            Getting picked on in high school and middle school? Seriously? You can put away your victim card….everybody is picked on for one thing or another in school.

          • Alex Dương

            If you want to pretend that there is no racism or prejudice in the U.S., hey, it’s your right to be deluded.

          • noodles76

            Show me where I said there is no racism. I’ll wait……

          • Alex Dương

            I won’t play exact words with you. I gave some personal experiences, and you try to downplay and dismiss them with your cries of “victim card” and your rationalization of “kids will be kids.” You think I’ll just accept that? Are you that obtuse?

            Seriously, this is the second time you’ve tried to do something like this (i.e. force your views on someone else who obviously disagrees with you and strongly). The first time was when you tried to get me to say that the history behind the Diaoyu / Senkaku Islands before 1895 is irrelevant. Gee, buddy, when I make a post describing some facts in detail, do you really think I’ll just instantly agree with you that they’re irrelevant?

          • noodles76

            You need to lighten up. Using middle school and high school as your basis for saying people hassle and abuse Chinese in general is lacking credibility. It’s not exclusively anti-Chinese as you try to make it out to be. You were picked on in school just the same as everyone else was. That’s ….fair. Sure, for you they may have used words like ‘chink’ or ‘gook’ or whatever as opposed to the different hateful words used when picking on others. And? Accept it or not….kids are kids. The fat kids got picked on, the ugly ones, the poor ones, the black ones, the brown ones, the ones with strange(to some) names, glasses, funny clothes, the people who walk a little strange…everyone got picked on for any number of reasons.

            And I am not trying to force my views on anyone. I am making points I feel are valid. If you do not feel they are valid, that’s your choice but you take this whole thing too personally. it’s a f’n blog. People have different views…like it or not. Learn to be a man and agree to disagree without cursing and calling names like a child as you did in that other thread you mentioned.

          • Alex Dương

            When did I ever say it was exclusively anti-Chinese or anti-Asian? I merely gave my experiences – which are by definition personal, so of course I take it “personally” – yet both you and Scott felt the need to downplay and dismiss them. Scott overexaggerated, and I called him out for it. It’s as simple as that.

            I don’t have a problem with you disagreeing with me. I have a problem with you trying to force your views on me. Like I told you, in that other article, I was willing to leave the discussion very early on. You agreed with me on one key point, so I didn’t care if you disagreed with me on others.

            But no, that wasn’t enough for you. You pressed hard on me to agree with you that the facts were irrelevant. And when I didn’t, you got increasingly pissy in your tone. It was only then that I “called names like a child.”

            If you want to discuss with me person-to-person, I’m happy to. Just spare me your self-righteousness and condescending attitude.

          • noodles76

            Everything I have seen you accuse others of, you are guilty of yourself.

          • Alex Dương

            Maybe. At least I look in the mirror every now and then instead of acting as if my shit doesn’t stink.

          • ex-expat

            Exactly!

          • Jahar

            I think this is gonna vary from community to community. Where I’m from in Canada, there are very, very few minorities, but they are generally accepted by the majority of the citizens. Far East Asians moreso than others. But there are always some, usually less educated or from poor upbringings, that dislike them, and pick on them.

            But of course, as Noodles says below, kids will pick on each other for anything. Try having psoriasis on your head in elementary school. or being the only poor guy. Or being as short as the smallest girl in your class. Yeah race is a bad thing to judge people on. Most kids will grow out of it though.
            After school, was it much of a problem?

          • Alex Dương

            I’d just like to point out that there has been a huge goalpost shift here. Scott explicitly said that, quote,

            Nobody hassles them, no one turns their head to spit invective, no one thinks to cheat or otherwise abuse them, no one calls them “chink” , “alien” or worse

            I give examples of my experiences contradicting his claim, and what happens? Goalpost shift: it’s not that it doesn’t happen; it’s that “kids will be kids.”

            Um, k. If you want to roll with that, I don’t agree, but fine. Just be aware that we’re no longer talking about what was originally claimed.

            This exchange has been quite amusing to me. I never said racism was a commonplace, everyday thing in the U.S. I simply said you can’t say it doesn’t exist anymore. Somehow, this statement is so offensive that three or four whites need to come tell me that I’m wrong.

          • Jahar

            I’m not saying that you are wrong. I was just giving my point of view, as to why, and what it is like where I’m from. Asians face racism, just not to a very high degree. And I was just stating that kids do like to find any excuse to pick on anyone who’s different. And I’m sure the Asian-Canadians I’ve met that are mostly treated well as far as I can see face racism that I haven’t.

            I’d still like to know if you still encounter it often as an adult.

          • Alex Dương

            It was not a common occurrence when I was in middle and high school, and it is even less common now. After a few additional replies from you and ex-expat, I feel that it is Scott and noodles who are most aggressive in pushing what I perceive as a false, whitewashed view of the U.S.

            As I said, I wouldn’t trade my U.S. citizenship for the citizenship of any other country in the world. But I will never agree to any view of the U.S. as being “traditionally” accepting and tolerant of immigrants. That is a very recent thing; for most of U.S. history, nativism was the norm.

          • Jahar

            Haha have you seen “Gangs of New York”?

          • Alex Dương

            It’s fiction, but its setting is much more accurate to history than the whitewashed revisionism Scott is spewing.

          • whuddyasack

            Yes, of course. But yet it’s A-OK to generalize the Chinese/Asians as a racist people based on a handful of netizen comments on politically sensitive issues. Here’s the thing, negativity, insults and all out nastiness are the norm whenever an article relating to China is brought up. I certainly don’t see signs of a welcoming, tolerant bunch. I see a degenerate, rabid mob intent on making enemies. On the internet at least, hostility is widely accepted and supported. Entire websites, blogs and forums are dedicated to tasteless, divisive us vs them nonsense.

            If America was so tolerant, why are Black power, Muslim extremist and White hate groups and so many more allowed free reign to practice hate speech and organize events that eventually lead to violence?
            http://blogs.houstonpress.com/hairballs/2013/12/katy_man_charged_with_hate_cri.php

            Nobody hassles them, no one turns their head to spit invective, no one thinks to cheat or otherwise abuse them

            If only that were the case. this person experienced everything that you claim nobody experiences.
            http://www.xojane.com/it-happened-to-me/it-happened-to-me-a-stranger-called-me-a-chinese-btch-and-then-spat-in-my-face

            Of course it could have been worse:
            http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/chinese-man-family-hate-crime-charges-nyc-murder-article-1.1792426

            Alright, going to be fair. Not just America.
            http://stayingsafeabroad.blogspot.com.au/2012/04/australia-japanese-tourist-29-held.html

            One reason why you rarely hear any complaints from Asians is because they’re typically not a whiny bunch. If they were like everyone else (and some expats in Asia) you wouldn’t hear the end of it. They suck it all up and just carry on with life. But most importantly, many are genuinely grateful for the rich opportunities they have experienced in America and understand that they can’t have it all. Many choose to suffer in silence, and that’s why I “throw shit around”. I’ll be honest, I’ve never experienced any form of racism but that doesn’t mean I’m going to hush-hush the experiences of those who have.

          • ex-expat

            If the US is not a tolerant country, how did the current president get elected, and why do over 400,000 Asians a year decide to make the US their home?

            There are certainly instances of racism, as there are anywhere, but that does not mean it is not tolerant as a whole.

            I am not a racist, but I do have issues with a lot of things about mainland China. It is not about race, but more about the government and some of the effects it has had on the culture.

            If you really have an issue with the way some things are, why not take a page from Ghandi’s book instead of spewing the same garbage that you complain about?

          • whuddyasack

            why do over 400,000 Asians a year decide to make the US their home?

            For a variety of reasons, mainly economic. The Asian immigrants come from developing countries with very little security. This is the same reason you don’t see Japanese immigrants flocking to the West. Tolerance is very low on the list. Most who move to the US are unaware of the racial divide going on. No country markets their intolerance to the world, in fact quite the opposite. There was a WaPo article that self-proclaimed America to be the least racist country of all.

            And why are the Asian immigrants accepted? Obviously because they benefit America. Asian American immigrants tend to be skilled and well off. Impoverished, starving Asians who need a green card don’t receive it.

            Now I never called you a racist, so if you feel that way it’s your own racial allegiance kicking in. My main issue is this, it’s perfectly fine to brand Chinese/Asians as the most racist people based on hearsay and netizen comments but unreasonable to brand Caucasians for the same thing or worse.

            More importantly, Asians have come a long way. Asian Americans started out as unwanted, low-skilled laborers but have progressed to one of America’s biggest success stories. They flourished in spite of prejudice. They never complained, never generalized, never formed clannish race-driven enclaves but worked with their eyes down and chin up. Compared to Woodford and Desbarres these people are a miracle. So why not take a page from their books? Less whining, more productivity.

          • ex-expat

            You answered one of my questions, which is great, but:

            If America is so racist, how were the people able to elect a minority as president, twice?

            You did not call me a racist directly, but I am white, American, and have made anti-PRC comments. According to you, don’t I pretty much have to be?

            The reason why I brought up Ghandi was because of his quote, “Be the change that you wish to see in the world.”

            Why not be like that rather than posting racist, hate-filled comments all the time?

          • whuddyasack

            No, you don’t have to be a racial chauvinist since criticism against the CCP is often valid. The thing is reasonable people can separate a people from its government. I fail to understand why this is such an issue for Caucasians. I’ve never ever seen any Japanese fail to distinguish between the two. Never. Those that do are almost certainly pretending Westerners.

            If anything, it’s your own clannishness taking hold. If you can feel this way, imagine how many Chinese feel when they read rubbish posted everywhere on the internet on a daily basis.

            Thank goodness it wasn’t “an eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind” because that’s failed. I’ve always said that I wanted to become a good example for other Chinese. I want them to adopt self-confidence, joy, critical thinking/debating skills, pride in their identity, moral justice and most importantly love for each other. I don’t want them to adopt the ugly hate, violence and insecure competitiveness you so often see amongst Black, White and Muslim nationalists.

            Now, seeing that I’ve explained everything to you in detail, I’ll give you an obvious answer to your question if you can respond to my request, it’s a simple test of character:

            Why not be like that rather than posting racist, hate-filled comments all the time?

            Give me examples.

          • ScottLoar

            “I’ll be honest, I’ve never experienced any form of racism but that doesn’t mean I’m going to hush-hush the experiences of those who have.”

            Do us all and yourself a favor; just talk about what you know and of which you have direct experience. Now look to ex-expat’s comment to you, “If you really have an issue with the way some things are, why not take a page from Ghandi’s book instead of spewing the same garbage that you complain about?”

          • whuddyasack

            I didn’t know that direct experience was a necessity in speaking up for those who have experienced real problems. So it basically sums up to this, what happened to this girl http://www.xojane.com/it-happened-to-me/it-happened-to-me-a-stranger-called-me-a-chinese-btch-and-then-spat-in-my-face is nothing to worry about. Startling statistics that Asians are the most bullied racial group, primarily because of their race doesn’t matter:
            http://www.dallasholocaustmuseum.org/news/recent/the-secret-pain-of-the-most-bullied-and-abused-ethnic-group-in-america
            http://www.8asians.com/2011/11/01/asian-american-students-are-most-bullied-in-school/
            With such attitudes, is it any wonder that you’ve never heard any Asian complain of being hassled? A few have personally confided with me after exhausting all outlets, some cases so horrific I won’t bring them up. I can definitely agree with the statistics on cyber-bullying just trudging through the internet.

            Personally, I think what Zadie Smith has to say is more relevant than Gandhi. Most Asian Americans and Asians as a whole are liberal minded yet no one here has a problem with branding them all racists, much less the biggest racists. Asian hate groups in Asia and the West are almost non-existent, yet thousands of Black, Latino, White and Muslim hate groups run rampant across America. As I recall, it’s only White and Black savages that partake in the racially charged knockout games, and never Asians.

          • ScottLoar

            ScottLoar: “You and several others use this forum as a podium to castigate, denounce, and generally throw shit. Enough! I’ve lived in four different countries in two continents and concede that among them all the US is
            the most tolerant. Any number of persons with experience of the US from Taiwan, Hong Kong, Malaysia, Singapore, mainland China, Japan and Korea would agree with me.”

            Whuddyasack:”I’ll be honest, I’ve never experienced any form of racism but that doesn’t mean I’m going to hush-hush the experiences of those who have.”

            Your claim about speaking for those who can’t rings hollow and false; it is merely an opportunity to vent your own prejudice. Your claim that I’m ignorant or distanced from the very people and culture I’ve been with for more than 40 years is an insult. You remain what we see: the very thing you say you despise, and of your own making no less.

            I’ll have nothing more to do with you.

          • whuddyasack

            No, they would not. Intolerance means different things to different people. For myself and many others, it means a prevalence of hate groups and violence. Out of all the countries listed, only Malaysia has a bigger issue here than the US. By far. Most Blacks and MENAs describe East Asians as inquisitive and ignorant but never hateful. These same people would find living in Europe hell, your typical example of riots, violence, segregation and hate. On both sides. Perhaps these are the most racist recent immigrants in America. They certainly bring their bad habits abroad.

            As for my claim about you. Ignorant no. Dismissive yes. You are just one person and I’ve given real examples, sometimes resulting in death. Take it for what it is. Prejudiced or not, I don’t care as this is the reality. All too often, Asians are exploited and picked on because they are too nice and don’t discriminate. Yet they are called racists by opportunistic, xenophobic mobs.

            With your shortsightedness, you had nothing to offer in the first place.

  • Jay K.

    Something just doesn’t sound right here, who in their moment of despair would make a weibo account and claim to be from taiwan from cry to mainland china for help. it’s illogical.

    Seems more like it was an opportune (troll bait perhaps?) for a mainlander to pose on the net as a person whois from taiwan and cry, just for the LULZ.

    I quote the Chinese netizens “This must be thoroughly investigated!”

    • fabulous

      I agree.
      When I lose my internet connection, I do some strange things. But signing up for a new twitter account and asking France to come save me would not be one of them.

    • Mark_Wallace

      It’s not exactly what you’d call a formal request for aid from a recognised authority, is it?

      Maybe it’s OK to start internet rumours in Vietnam.

    • Irvin

      Well……..people do alot of things they don’t usually do at moments of despair I think.

    • ptptp

      I don’t read Chinese so I really can’t tell if the post was written in simplified or traditional Chinese. That would be a give away, wouldn’t it?

      • Mihel

        Seconded. Anybody here who could tell traditional chinese characters from simplified?
        Google translate used to distinguish between the two, but has now merged them into just ‘Chinese.’

        • whuddyasack

          @ptptp I’m just basing this on the OP’s comment that CSmack directly links to (and not the weibo post). The post was written in simplified Chinese.

        • Google Translate only merged them for the input box. Since it can automatically detect whether they’re simplified or traditional, there’s no reason to make users choose one over the other in order to translate it. So you can post Chinese characters into the input box and “translate” them to either simplified or traditional to see which one matches.

          As whuddyasack pointed out, the original comment posted on chinaSMACK is in simplified characters.

          • Mihel

            there’s no reason to make users choose one over the other in order to translate it

            No but it was useful because if you pasted chinese text with the ‘Detect Language’ function it would also specify which one of the two sets of characters it was translating from.
            Fundamentally, it does the same exact thing, only now it’s hidden from the user.

            Not really a bothersome thing, it just adds one more step to the process in this case.

      • Brian227

        A lot of character typing software uses pinyin input which would be the same regardless of how the characters are rendered on the screen. My feeling would be that word choice would be the main giveaway if it were faked – there are some lexicon differences between PRC Mandarin and ROC Mandarin.

        • ptptp

          Thanks! Interesting explanation. I have quite a few Taiwanese friends and I can’t imagine any of them asking China for help… Taiwan, America, Japan, South Korea yes, China no… so I’m skeptical even if my suspected clue is nothing of the sort. Even if the person is Taiwanese, it doesn’t indicate anything other than that the person was really scared.

          • Brian227

            I guess it depends on the individual and the circumstances. I know one Taiwanese lady who came down with malaria in an African country which didn’t have a Taiwan Representative Office. She and her partner turned in the absence of any other option to the PRC embassy and they fell over themselves to demonstrate how good they were to their ‘Taiwanese compatriots.’

  • Jay K.

    song of the incident:

    Bulls on Parade-Rage Against the Machines

  • Irvin

    The aftermath of the riot would be investors pulling out from vietnam due to social instability while china will grab their business, well played china, well played.

  • JayJay

    It’s sad the neighbours can’t get along… maybe what they need is to start a couple of World Wars and form an ‘Asian Union’ as did the Europeans did.

    • Filo

      The EU is not necessarily doing so hot. However, it evolved after the two countries that have historically tried to concur Europe (France and Germany) agreed to share politically. Of course, they forgot about Russia… Maybe after China is done trying to concur, in fifty years or so Japan and China will share. Then Korea might somehow unify and try its hand….

    • bang2tang

      I don’t want scene from “Grave of Fireflies” happen again in Asia.

    • whuddyasack

      Come on, you know that’s nonsense. I think more World Wars would just fragment Asia even more and they’d just have to start from scratch again. Both problem and solution lie in the politicians seeking to take advantage of creating pseudo enemies across their borders.

  • vonskippy

    What a bunch of whiners – if you don’t like the country you’re living in – MOVE BACK HOME.

    • Alex Dương

      I normally agree with your sentiment, but it’s one thing to bitch about a country when things are calm and quite another thing to “whine” when you’ve just experienced rioting.

      • Surfeit

        If the supposition that it’s a Taiwanese poster is correct.

        • Alex Dương

          I don’t think that matters for my reply.

  • I wish there were a vietBAM or vietSMASH or some other onomatopoeia-inspired site to document what average Vietnamese netizens think about this whole thing.

    • YourSupremeCommander

      They have it, its called VietCon.

      • Irvin

        LOL good one.

    • Tova Rischi

      I think Vietnam has a really tiny net presence though due to the mix of the over reaching government and the not as much money in the pot.

      I mean not an expert but I imagine what you’d be able to get is mostly government news, spoiled rich 3rd gen party kids complaining about stupid shit, and diaspora stuff. Maybe a combined SEA thing or something, or use a country to fit in more country perspectives kinda like how IndoBoom also picks up Malaysian stuff due to share language…

      Also maybe not the place but if mods see it and get ideas an IndiaSpolsion or something like that is also something in demand… at least by one reader. Especially with the recent election…

      • I’ve spent quite a few hours browsing the most popular domestic websites in Vietnam listed on Alexa [1], and it does seem to be mostly bureaucratic news sites with no comment functionality or limited commenting presence. I wonder if there’s no dedicated Vietnamese equivalent to Kaskus for Indonesia, Sina Weibo / NetEase for China, Twitter / Yahoo for Japan, and Daum / Naver for Korea. That said, there are over 31 million Vietnamese Internet users (nearly three-quarters the number of Korean Internet users [2]) so I figure they must be conversing en masse somewhere.

        VN Express seems to have by far the most vibrant commenting community. The following are the most-commented articles I found, along with their Google Translated titles and headers.

        vnexpress.net/tin-tuc/thoi-su/nhieu-ke-kich-dong-cong-nhan-trong-cuoc-bieu-tinh-phan-doi-trung-quoc-2990053.html
        May 14, 2014 | comments: 570 | top comment: 7,254 upvotes

        Many workers who provoked the protests in China
        Tens of thousands of workers in industrial zones south to the streets to protest the Chinese aggression in the South China Sea. Many took advantage of the agitator, who instigated the burning factory, assault and protection of many business professionals.

        vnexpress.net/tin-tuc/thoi-su/canh-sat-bien-cung-ngu-dan-tao-the-lien-hoan-quanh-gian-khoan-981-2990743.html
        May 14, 2014 | comments: 55 | top comment: 479 upvotes

        Coast Guard and fishermen that create continuous around 981 rigs
        Today, the number of Chinese fishing vessels over 40 iron shell to break the continuum of maritime police forces, control of fishing vessels and fishermen dozens Vietnam Hai Duong rig around 981.

        vnexpress.net/tin-tuc/thoi-su/trung-quoc-thay-doi-phuong-an-ngan-tau-viet-nam-chap-phap-2990785.html
        May 14, 2014 | comments: 176 | top comment: 2,288 upvotes

        China plans change compartment Vietnam train law enforcement
        Rather than preventing ships from Vietnam in positions 8-10 knots rigs as before, on 14/5, to protect Chinese ships by focusing rig vessel at a distance of 6.5 nautical miles.

        vnexpress.net/tin-tuc/thoi-su/chu-tich-nuoc-khong-co-chuyen-so-trong-dau-tranh-bao-ve-chu-quyen-2991566.html
        May 16, 2014 | comments: 65 | top comment: 1,481 upvotes

        President: ‘There is no fear in the struggle for sovereignty’
        Speaking with HCMC voters, President Truong Tan Sang said the struggle for equality between sovereign nations, no matter afraid or not afraid.

        vnexpress.net/tin-tuc/thoi-su/cong-nhan-duoc-phat-tien-de-du-do-di-bieu-tinh-2991656.html
        May 16, 2014 | comments: 82 | top comment: 1,706 upvotes

        Their workers with money to lure protesters away
        Group provoking, disturbing in a number of recent marches have bought national flag, coat given to workers, for money to lure protesters away.

        vnexpress.net/tin-tuc/thoi-su/trung-quoc-trien-khai-4-lop-tau-quanh-gian-khoan-2991726.html
        May 16, 2014 | comments: 97 | top comment: 1,329 upvotes

        China 4 class ships deployed around the rig
        Lieutenant Colonel Phan Duy Cuong, assistant warfare Coast Guard Command, said China mobilized a large force, 4 class ships deployed around 981 rigs in Hai Duong, Vietnam forces but always solid.

        I’d post the Google Translations of the most upvoted comments, but it’s mostly gibberish. This is why I wish there were a site dedicated to translating this stuff. I honestly think it would get more traffic than indoBOOM or russiaSLAM (You listening, chinasmack staff??).

        An India-based translation site would be interesting, but it seems to me like most Indian online discussion is already conducted in English anyway, although a lot of it is conducted in romanized Indian languages, which would be prime candidates for manual translation since they can’t be input into Google Translate.

        Sources:
        1: alexa.com/topsites/countries/VN
        2: internetworldstats.com/top20.htm

    • whuddyasack

      For what it’s worth:
      http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-05-14/anti-china-protests-in-vietnam-spur-warnings-factory-closures.htmlI

      I avoided the CNN article as it’s become a trolling nightmare, but I think the bloomberg one has some credibility. And it’s mostly in English too. From what I gather, there are some Vietnamese commentators who say that their views are consistent with Vietnamese forums. The general populace condemns these acts of violence while protesting against China. Ties in nicely with what my friends have to say too.

      My conclusion is that opinions are not one-dimensional, some support the violence, some don’t.

  • Teacher in China

    These riots remind me of China v Japan riots last winter, but surprisingly more violent.

    • socali

      Well, China actually stole territory from its ASEAN partners so you can expect this type of backlash. Most Chinese didn’t even know Senkaku islands existed before 2 years ago. These areas where China is stealing from belonged to South East Asians since ancient times…

      • Alex Dương

        The difference between the Paracel / Spratly Islands and the Diaoyu / Senkaku Islands is that the Chinese never “forgot” about the Paracel / Spratly Islands. They have been in the dispute since the 1930s at least, as has Vietnam.

      • Irvin

        According to science, all humans came from africa “since ancient times”, does it mean we can all have a piece of africa since it belonged to our ancestor?

        History is only a formality in territorial claim, the real deciding factor is power.

  • ScottLoar

    “Everyone is looking forward to going home! Mother country [here,
    referencing China], where are you? I’m at: Vietnam, Ky Anh District.”

    People from Taiwan do not think of China when recalling “home”. People from Taiwan do not call on “the mother country” when in need, nor do most of them even think of China as the mother country. At best this is a mainland Chinese employee at a Taiwan firm.

    And why is everyone surprised by anti-Chinese rioting in Vietnam? The expulsion of masses of Chinese from Vietnam, the tragedy of the boat people is so far removed from public knowledge? And that anti-Chinese riots in Vietnam devolve to general rioting against Asian businesses seems strange?

  • Don’t expect too much to come out of us….WARNING….Being an Asian…If you are white in China or Vietnam or in SEA….After we are done with all mindless looting, killing and still we are losing…

    Our favorite punch bag is white people…We will in the end blame it on white devil….Everything ends in Asia blaming white guys for our problems….sooner or later…you will be the target..

  • socali

    This is clearly political propaganda. Yes Taiwanese own the factories but Mainland Chinese are the workers. It makes no sense for Taiwanese workers to move out of Taiwan to work in Vietnam.

    • Alex Dương

      But it does make sense for Taiwanese managers to oversee operations in Vietnam.

      http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2014/05/16/2003590475

      It’s possible that the Weibo post that sparked all of this was not from a Taiwanese person, but there certainly were Taiwanese in Vietnam who were affected by these riots.

      • socali

        yes. I agree with you there. I just find it really suspicious that a Taiwanese person would open up a weibo account and beg the ‘mother country’. It just doesn’t add up.

        • Irvin

          Adds up if they never had to use weibo until now, facebook is only blocked in china not taiwan I think.

    • Surfeit

      Shit man I’m working in China; It makes perfect sense to me.

      • socali

        Considering you are posting here, I would say you are not the typical China factory sweatshop worker.

        • Surfeit

          I mean I moved from Britain to work in China, so a Taiwanese moving to Vietnam for work doesn’t seem so strange to me.

          • socali

            Were you impoverished in Britain? Like rural country poor? If you were then yes I stand corrected. However, if you are in China working in a white collar job, or are teaching english, I doubt the circumstances are the same.

          • Surfeit

            HAHA! I find rhetorical questions the worst literary device for making a point. It’s clear you’re reading into the situation deeper than myself.

            My simplistic approach is that if doing my job in a different country is going to pay more than doing my job in my own country, I will go to that country for work.

            That makes sense to me, therefore I can imagine it makes sense to others. I don’t really see how the status of the job affects that, as the principle is purely financial gain, but I’m sure you have your own ideas.

  • Zappa Frank

    However any war among eu countries is now even unthinkable… Isn’t a good result? German and France were worse that japan and china or Korea and china or japan and Korea. Now all the hatred is gone..

    • Irvin

      You sure it’s worst than japan and china? Every chinese knows the story of the Nanjing massacre, what exactly happened in france then?

      • Zappa Frank

        We’ll sure I’ve exaggerated a bit.. It was just to say that even a big hatred can pass if there is the will to let it go…unlucky in Asia people like to think about even what happened 100 years ago 500 or 1000 as reasonable cause to hate someone.

        • Irvin

          It’s hard to let go if the other person doesn’t acknowledge any wrong doing much less make amends while we have a museum in china that dedicated to this particular point in history with pictures and videos reminding us everyday of what happened.

          What they did to china it’s hard to forget in a 100 years, lesser transgressions are remembered for much longer. It’s how species survived for so long, we remembered what hurt us as to not get burn twice, fool me once and all that.

          • noodles76

            It’s very hard to let past transgressions pass if it’s continually shoved down your throat in the media and by the gov’t.

  • Surfeit

    I’m failing to read the part when the OP suggests they are Taiwanese. The idea I get from the comments is that they must be, because all Chinese would have been evacuated by now. Really, guys? Now you trust them? Having said that, if it is a new Weibo account, I can’t imagine how it could be a mainlander, because I can’t think of anyone without a Weibo. If I had to guess, which I feel I do, I’d go with a tactful use of grey propaganda, to invoke nationalistic feelings, from the government.

    It’s a pretty dope move.

    As for this talk of war, Russia just annexed the Crimea region. There’s no better time to grow some brass balls and start claiming shit this side of the world.

    • Irvin

      “As for this talk of war, Russia just annexed the Crimea region. There’s no better time to grow some brass balls and start claiming shit this side of the world.”

      Good point, and if ‘muricans interfere it’ll be easy to negotiation an alliance with russia……..or maybe…….this was a secret agreement between china and russia all along……oh the conspiracy!

      • Surfeit

        HAHA! Love this idea; Stranger things have happened!

  • Surfeit

    Chinasmack is translating popular Chinese news stories. Not making them.

  • IsurvivedChina

    The Chinese should learn from the Americans and get the fuck out of Vietnam, these guys are scary! They have not backed down from a fight ever! It took the French years to realise this and the Americans just as many! They won’t stop!

    • bang2tang

      PRC need Rambo!

    • Alex Dương

      Actually, the French and the Americans should’ve learned from the Chinese. China ruled Vietnam as a province for over 1,000 years from the 2nd Century BC to the 10th Century AD with only brief periods of interrupted rule. The Chinese tried one last time to rule Vietnam as a province in the 15th Century and basically quit trying after that.

      • Yes!

        The northern Vietnamese region is heavily populated with immigrants from Hainan island, not surprising that Vietnam/Vietcongs bear their characteristics – tough nuts with strong will. Hainanese have a rep for ruthlessness. Hainan island was historically China’s penal colony.

        • Alex Dương

          I’ve always respected the Vietnamese as being tough. I wasn’t aware that Hainanese had that kind of rep, though, so of course I never thought that there would be a connection between the two. I had always thought that the Vietnamese were tough because they are descended from people who resisted Chinese rule for over 1,000 years and indeed are the only “Yue” people who did not become assimilated into China.

    • noodles76

      They aren’t scary. The U.S and France ‘lost’ because they both tried the same thing. They tried to ‘half-ass’ a war. The U.S. fucked up more and let politicians have too much control. Both fucked up equally because there simply was very little support for the wars at home. You’d be somewhat delusional to believe that if the U.S. had the willpower at the time….that they would have not been balls deep into Vietnam.

      The U.S gave up on the idea of ‘winning’. I wrote ‘winning’ because it’s still not clear to me what the purpose or overall objectives were. When the U.S. stopped giving a shit (to some degree. Go Nixon!) there was clear and undeniable proof that we were beating the enemy…spanking the shit out of them actually. But…the politicians weren’t too keen on ripping into Laos and Cambodia which is what had to be done and what should have been done more.

      On some levels, I am glad the U.S. did not do so though. if we had done so….we’d have also have had to attack China for the same reasons. It would have been WWIII…not because of China (whose only advantage was the number of bodies it could throw at you as cannon fodder) but because it’s more than likely that the USSR would have taken a significantly more active role. Of course I mean other than the advisors, supplies, money, military hardware, training, and pilots they were already providing.

      • Alex Dương

        Whoa, the amount of bullshit historical revisionism here is too damn high.

        1. France lost the First Indochina War, full stop. They fought a pitched battle at Dien Bien Phu, and they were beaten. Moreover, decisions made before 1954 would have far-reaching consequences. Essentially, North Vietnamese generals had fought against the French at Dien Bien Phu; South Vietnamese generals had fought for the French at Dien Bien Phu. Psychologically, even though South Vietnamese people did not want to be ruled by Communists, they did not trust their military leaders as they were all previously traitors to Vietnam.

        2. There was never any “clear and undeniable proof that we were beating the enemy.” I hope you aren’t talking about that apocryphal claim falsely attributed to Vo Nguyen Giap that “You had us on the ropes. If you had pressed us a little harder, just for another day or two, we were ready to surrender!”

        While the North Vietnamese did return to the negotiations after Linebacker II, Linebacker II achieved nothing because the North Vietnamese had already agreed to what would later be the Paris Peace Accords in October 1972. It was Nguyen Van Thieu who refused to sign the agreement then, as he (correctly) predicted that signing it would be the downfall of South Vietnam. The Paris Peace Accords did not require that the North remove their troops from the South, and ~100,000 North Vietnamese soldiers were still in South Vietnam at the time of “peace.” You’d think that if Linebacker II were so decisive, we would’ve had more bargaining power at the negotiations. But we didn’t.

        3. Last but not least, if the Chinese couldn’t pacify the Vietnamese after over 1,000 years of ruling them as a province (not a colony), what makes you think the Vietnamese would’ve ever submitted to American rule?

  • jon9521

    Well you should not blame the Vietnamese people. The Viet government leaders have been in cahoots with the Chinese government to set up factories and Chinese towns over the Viet border. The Viet people do not want this but are powerless to stop it. Add to this that the Viet government does nothing when the Chinese set up oil rigs in what the Viet feels are their waters. Standard one party state acts in their own interest (corruption) and not the people situation.

  • whuddyasack

    White people have one of the most pronounced “us vs them” mob mentalities in the developed world. You can check whose typically involved in racially motivated hate crimes in the multicultural West. Asians almost never participate in these. They are also extremely competitive and everything is seen from an East-West context, everything an East Asian does has to be racialized.

    I think the grand irony is that it is usually the tribal fascists that pull the race card or like arguments. Archaic clannishness is encouraged amongst the European community, yet they’re concerned about non-existent fascism on another continent.

    While open-minded and progressive Asians are the majority, they are gladly taken advantage of and never appreciated. Conservatives will quickly jump to the fact that they mostly vote for the democrats to marginalize all of them. Liberals use them as surrogates to be bashed by aggrieved minorities. In the end, we’re just pawns to serve the political agendas of those in power who seem to want nothing better than a civil/race war. The Euronization of North America, turning it into something like Greece that tragic hellhole:
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1359891/Athens-riots-erupts-Greek-protesters-set-policemen-fire.html
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2004550/Greece-riots-2011-A-crisis-tear-Europe-apart.html

    • Zappa Frank

      Enough. Do you at least read what you post? Are articles pf 3 years ago, riots because of the crisis… What does this have to do with Americans, whites and so on?
      Open minded and progressives Asians? I hope you do not include yourself… Rarely on chinasmack we have seen someone with a mentality us vs all stronger than yours. In your delirium you cannot help but fill your posts with nonsense like the ones you were used to tell about the origin of the asian ‘race’, Chinese and Asians on the edge of extinction, now you no stop talking about what happen in Greece like you know something, but just posting old articles, an ‘encouraged archaic clannishness’ in Europe that I heard here now because in Europe nobody heard before.. All this just prove even more that you are the only one here with this kind of mentality yellow vs white, no one else in chinasmack ever wrote so much about this as you…do you realize it? You don not like live in a white man country? Back in china than… Do white men in china have even a fraction of your rights?

      • whuddyasack

        Frank, I’ll make it clear that I have nothing personal against you. In fact, it’s quite the opposite. But I do read what I post in the hope that other Asians will replace me, understand my POV and hopefully express what I want to say more convincingly and less offensively.

        I count myself as open-minded in that I’m willing to accept other viewpoints. Even if I think it’s baloney, they have a right to their opinion. But I would never consider myself progressive because I disagree with gay marriages, abortion, “forced atheism”, multiple sexual partners/小三, and don’t believe that race is a social construct. I also can’t tolerate Muslim Jihadists and people that belittle and demean women.

        Even on this thread, I am far from the only one with an East-West, us vs them mentality and if you were impartial and not clouded by inner biases you’d see this. No one can truly prove the origins of the human race, fossils and new discoveries are made everyday, don’t you think it is close-minded to dismiss this evidence? I brought up the declining birth rates in East Asian countries and demographic problems in that region. Populations in the East are destined to shrink, chinatowns are disappearing the world over and japantowns have disappeared altogether. Do you really think it is illogical not to be at least slightly concerned about this?

        no one else in chinasmack ever wrote so much about this as you…do you realize it?

        There are many CSmackers where 100% of their posts have an underlying me against you slant.

        • Zappa Frank

          Before criticizing or pretend there is such a huge rom for human race you should at least study something. Actually your. Position is like the one of people who deny evolution or global warming,… Is true that there are some grey areas, but the picture is done and you put yourself far outside the picture, in a position that is not supported by any evidence only you prejudices. Your. Is ion of race is like that, no evidences, only prejudices.

          Claim that Asians are on the edge of extinction is highly illogical, is obvious that birth rate decrease, thanks god, else country would never be able to develop, but does a reduction of birth rate means extinction? No, absolutely, and if you apply this to a group of 1.3 billions of people not even completely devolved , it is not just illogical is ridiculous. If clearly obvious that your vision come from , again, a prejudice, your living in a multiracial counties made you insecure..because in case should be other country that in order to preserve should close or expel all Chinese, if we apply your vision..

          Maybe there are other people with us vs all complex, however no one has it stronger than yours, you make of EVERY SINGLE ARTICLE on china smack an occasion to make your personal yellow vs whits battle.. Even when like now, whites are not even mentioned in the article. Funny thing is that you accuse other people to do what you are doing in the very same moment.

          • whuddyasack

            Sigh… Frank, I don’t think we’ll ever see eye to eye. You just can’t and won’t understand.Open up your mind a little and you will see that there is validity for the multiregional hypothesis theory. I’ve already stopped talking about the origins of Asians and the declining birthrates yet you continue to bring it up and ridicule it. That’s petty. If you don’t think there is a demographic problem in Japan, Taiwan, HK, etc.then tough luck.

            If clearly obvious that your vision come from , again, a prejudice, your living in a multiracial counties made you insecure

            All you think about is insecurity, hence your half-baked assessment that everything has to do with “White guy stealing Asian girl” almost like wishful thinking. Like I’ve said before, if Asians were really disturbed by this, they actually can stop this. Now take a deep breath and relax. Most Asians care about this.

            should close or expel all Chinese, if we apply your vision..

            And I’ve always opposed new Asian immigration into Europe knowing how riot prone it can get there. BTW, Frank, there is a difference between being a citizen and an expat.

            Like you said, my problem is seeing the wonders of multiculturalism #sarcasm. Nice, big cowardly White man beating up 5 foot Asian lady.

            And you know what? The assaulter got away WITHOUT any repercussions. And that’s just one case out of thousands, many that go unreported. Justice for you. If the roles were reversed, there’d be a big stink about it.

            Maybe there are other people with us vs all complex, however no one has it stronger than yours

            Rubbish. Remember, all I said was that mob mentality was ugly no matter who did it, and mentioned a few Western countries.Then everyone jumped. I don’t see “you” or my critics say anything about the following:

            And in behaving thus, they have merely behaved similarly to Mainland mobs. Those who, in one dreadful example from 2012, dragged another local Chinese from his Japanese car and beat him within an inch of his life with a bike lock for driving said vehicle. It’s indeed sad that Vietnamese would behave in a way similar to Mainland filth who think in totalizing blocks and have no patience for differentiations. Just rage, black and white. I good you bad. That should be the chengyu 成语 or idiom for this generation: 我好你不好。50 years that are an abomination to 5000.

            Yeah, of course because that guy was bashing the Chinese, eh? It’s fine as long as it’s Chinese lol… what crappy logic (not you, in general).

            Whatever bro. I was the fool for thinking I’d be able to take the tribalism out of the tribal. More generalizations about the “racism” and “xenophobia” of the Chinese are to be expected in future articles.

            It was a pleasure to talk to you. No hard feelings.

          • Packers

            “people who deny evolution or global warming” – Off topic but that statement riled me. Regardless of one’s position on either, those two things are not the same at all.

          • Zappa Frank

            it is just to say that there is a common academic vision on a certain topic, with just few scientist that do not agree.. Like whuddy that keep on talking about the multiregional model while it is considered by just a tiny fraction of scientists.
            I know that evolution and global warming are not related.

  • Rick in China

    The problem with the attitude of some of the translated, and many of the untranslated comments is as follows:

    If you want to rant about how Taiwan belongs to China. Great. Do so.

    If you want to give Taiwan freedom from China. Great. Let them.

    But if you are one who rants about Taiwan belonging to China, when Taiwanese cry for help, support their assistance. Why would anyone want to belong to a country which so vehemently and repeatedly calls the people in their segment of the world traitorous and unworthy? If you want to win hearts, hence support and respect, you don’t do it by being petty children with an “I told you so!” ChengGuan-like “now we’re superior, so you beckon, or else.” attitude.

  • jon9521

    You cannot blame Vietnamese people its the corrupt leaders that do cross border deals like the creation of Chinese only town and factories without the permission of the local Vietnamese people. Add to that the oil rig in what the Vietnamese people think is their waters (with the Vietnamese government doing little) and you are bound to have a reaction. China needs to calibrate their behaviour or else all its neighbours will be its enemies

  • Guest

    China please leave South East Asia alone!

  • Ralph Wiggim

    Are some of you starting to feel compassion for the Chinese now? Think they will feel compassion for you when they invade YOUR land and put some dashes on the map over it and come up with some nonsense that some Chinese guy sailed through there 8000 years ago? The Chinese have no compassion for anyone.

    • chucky3176

      That still does not justify murdering innocent people just because they’re Chinese or look Chinese.

      Having said that, yes, it’s frustrating and maddening that Chinese people think that entire Asia is rightfully belong to Chinese. I’m talking about stuff like this, where hundreds of Chinese fishing boats illegally fish off of Korean waters daily. These boats even dare to dock right inside Korea.

      http://english.chosun.com/site/data/img_dir/2014/05/02/2014050201268_0.jpg

      There are so many of them, they are like biblical locusts, Koreans can’t do anything, short of blasting them out of the water (which would be diplomatically impossible).

      • bang2tang

        I want koreabang article about this stuff, lmao…
        I thought you are HKers since you called them locust, lol…

  • Misiooo

    Their kicked Chinese asses already, maybe it is time to repeat.

  • Zappa Frank

    I didn’t say Ue has been a complete success, still every war inside Europe is highly unthinkable. About the possibility of a Eu broke up I wouldn’t say is high , actually is still unthinkable.

  • Mighty曹

    Although not on the same scale I think China is too calculative to engineer such a clandestine move like the Ruskies did with Crimea. Putin may very well pull this shit and send troops to “rescue compatriots”.

  • Mighty曹

    Hey Einstein, I wasn’t questioning as to why such animosity by the mainlanders.

    Gooks couldn’t care less how or what Westerners think because they always lead a better life than them. Our only concern is other gooks.

    Trolling? haha that’s funny. As for ‘get out more’ I’m not sure what you’re referring to but I hit the bars and clubs on the weekends. If you meant ‘traveling’ your ass will be wheelchair bound if you had to bend over for every city/country I’ve visited.

  • Vien Huynh

    Oh wow, how about this, in VN, all the newspapers say China invades VN water and the sentiment is against Chinese aggression. Even though there are riots, lot of people go against the looting and destruction of businesses. Please dont just read the news on one side. Same thing happen when Chinese riot and destroy just about everything that related to japan and non-Japan.

  • Jahar

    I don’t think it’s them expressing that they want to be part of the mainland or anything, I think it’s more along the lines of, “We are getting killed because of the shit you stirred up. do something about it.”

    Edit; nevermind, i didn’t read that first post

    • ScottLoar

      You assume the writer is from Taiwan. I gave several reasons why the writer was not from Taiwan and, at best, was a mainland Chinese employee with a Taiwan firm in Vietnam or, at worst, a paid shill.

  • bang2tang

    Vietnam stops anti-China protests after deadly riots, China evacuates
    http://news.yahoo.com/more-3-000-chinese-evacuated-vietnam-violence-xinhua-025436399–finance.html

  • PRC will invade and China will annex Vietnam

    • jon9521

      Then the USA will kick your asess back again

  • Zappa Frank

    i call them with their names… Paola, Cinzia, and so on…

  • Gordon Gogodancer

    One of my closest friend is a black Muslim and his girlfriend is white. He is a great guy and i never even thought one second about him being black and her being white.

  • RagnarDanneskjold

    You see the difference between Vietnam and Chinese protests? When Chinese protest Japan, they smash Chinese citizens cars and beat Chinese people into comas. When Vietnamese protest China, they attack Taiwanese exporters and foreign companies.

    • bang2tang

      :D

  • JayJay

    Euro-skeptics certainly have had louder voices these past 5 years on the back of the recession in Europe. But one of the fundamental goals during the establishment of the EU is to avoid another World War, and general conflicts in Europe. By and large, I believe it has achieved this. My vision is that of the same for Asia and China, Korea and Japan, and the wider pan-Asia area. It is better to make money together and trade than going to war on these petty issues imo. Britain has territorial issues with Spain on Gibraltar, but you don’t see us telling Torres to go home.

  • JayJay

    Like EU, regardless of the number of countries that can join, but the main players in region as a start. It is however unlikely as there are both internal and external forces that stop this from happening, also for historical reasons. Internally, China, Japan and Korea all shows unhealthy nationalistic views among its general public, and externally, US will not want to see this happen, and it is all part of their ‘divide and conquer’ plan and preserve their influence in the region. Also the fact that China is too big for its own good. It sees itself as an upcoming major power rival that of the US. So this is just wishful thinking… not the World War part… no sane person wants another World War…

  • whuddyasack

    I’m not even sure if you’re trying to be funny… Either you studied in a sham university or you studied “how to lie”. Ignoring your inane use of semantics as a ruse, I know exactly what hypothesis and theory mean. Multiregional Hypothesis is just one of 3 main theories relating to modern human origins. Despite what some here would like to believe, there is still a case for this model and the debate has far from died. The only other person who could construct a decent rebuttal never boasted of any fancy anthropological degrees. I gave up after realizing that there was not an intellectual peer amongst my critics.

    • Zappa Frank

      no this multiregional model is already outdated, and by long time. actually you are the only one who believe in it. It is like global warming, there are scientist that deny it, yes, but something like 0.1%, same goes for multiregional hypothesis. But again, you haven’t study anything about this, nor you read any of the link I gave, you simply googled and selected some outdated research.
      however, if you think is valid, thanks to find some research, possible after 2000.. let’s see how many and how they support the multiregional model.
      Multiregional models were supported, years ago, with some similarity in traits between some people and arcaic homo, with the arrive of genetic analysis are all gone..

      • whuddyasack

        I’ll give you this one haha.

        • Zappa Frank

          Whuddy you are a good guy and I apologize if I’ve been rude sometimes, but you have to admit that sometimes your statements about whites are provocative…
          I may have a vision that is distorted by my education that makes me look for equality of people, but the point above is actually the one of the mainstream in anthropology.
          However I can tell you something else that May interest you, something discussed on the other page about the “genetic” difference among races. Neoteny is the human characteristic to present in the adult form some traits typical of the juvenile stadium, this thing is also considered an index of “sapientization”, besides archaic Homo sapiens present a head that is more rugby ball like and less round, present a bone ridge oboe the eyes, I think the name is torus, it is difficult because I know just the Italian names, they were more robust and so on… With the pass of time the Homo sapiens became more gracile with a head more round, face less prominent, and so on.. Anyway just to say that according to the traits hat are considered sign of “sapientization” it is clear that those traits are by far more present in asian people

          • whuddyasack

            Whuddy you are a good guy and I apologize if I’ve been rude sometimes

            No apologies needed, it didn’t really bother me. It’s the internet and I don’t keep grudges haha. Perhaps my statements have been provocative but it’s only the way I see things. I forgot the basic rule that people are people, their views, thinking and allegiance limited to their own hives/tribes. The one exception being the Oriental race, i.e. my own. I’ll admit that sometimes I wished we were more like everyone else; ignoring race is a disadvantage when everyone else is so race-driven. Case in point, America vs Singapore. But then I realize that we don’t have to be, such discrepancies exist because we’re more evolved and should thus understand and accept the primitive natures in others.

            Neoteny is the human characteristic to present in the adult form some traits typical of the juvenile stadium

            Yes, this is very interesting and something I knew about quite a while ago. I learnt about this from emails from other Asian friends, the same ones who provided me the links and readings for genetics, archaelogical and anthropological data and sadly, the same ones who want race-segregated states in the US. I can sympathize their rhetoric but not support it. OTOH I subscribe to their scientific approach. I invited them to post here, but they want nothing to do with what they consider “Asian-bashing, foreign trash infested” websites. I guess it’s fair since I declined the offer to join their “group”.

            You are correct that compared to other races, Asian skulls are highly neotenized or pedomorphic, which is a sign of higher evolution. This makes sense, especially since out of all races, Asians are the youngest, their birth a result of a late ice age which can be further proven when looking at the natives in the world’s coldest, most unforgiving places, i.e. Siberia, Greenland, Alaska. This echoes Montagu’s thoughts:
            “The Mongoloid skull has proceeded further than in any other people, the Mongoloid skull, whether Chinese or Japanese, has been rather more neotenized than the Caucasoid or European”.The most archaic peoples are Australoids, and genetic evidence suggests that Australian Aborigines are closest to apes.

            I think this is also a product of domestication, comparisons between a wolf’s skull and a dog’s skull shows that an adult dog’s skull resembles that of a juvenile wolf’s. Mongoloids probably had civilizations longer than other races, hence their gracile bone structure.

            I think the name is torus, it is difficult because I know just the Italian names,

            In English, this is known as the brow ridge or supraorbital arch. And comparatively speaking, this is true. The average Negroid and Caucasian skulls have a higher dome/forehead than flatter Mongoloid skulls, although exceptions exist.

          • Zappa Frank

            Actually the genetic don’t show any evidence of a north origin of Easter people, on the opposite the most plausible one seems the south arrive since there is more DNA variations, further analysis suggest a picture with a north contribution that probably strictly linked with Central Asia but still remaining in the picture of a prevalently north contribution.
            Neoteny show a level of sapientization, but you should not go further saying ‘you are more evolved’, first is not fair and is the same argument used by racist against black people, than if Asians are more evolved Africans are the less evolved…but again neoteny by itself do not say that. Like about the age of the Asian ‘race’ but again please note that it doesn’t exist the concept of ‘race’ in anthropology not for prudery or politeness but for some real reason, let’s talk about “asian type “, is not that easy to determinate the age, I can assure that is not clear at all the moment when asian became “Asians” and got separated from what are now “Europeans” or the rest of asian people like Indians and so on.. The fact that Mongoliic type population reached the coldest areas do not imply their origin there.. I’ll try to provide some links tomorrow

          • whuddyasack

            It would be interesting to see your links. Yes, the Southern origins of East Asians, I’ve heard of that theory but of course we need to know how South is South. Another interesting thing about Asians is their love of cute things, in an almost childlike fashion. Asians mature later than the other races, which is perhaps another indication of neoteny.

            I’ve just been reading some disturbing, tragic news:
            http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2014/05/24/elliot-rodger-isla-vista-shooting-suspect-posted-racist-messages-on-misogynistic-website/
            http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/05/24/santa-barbara-shooter-had-history-of-posting-racist-misogynist-comments-on-hate-site/#comment-1403293599

            My feelings are sadness and anger. Sadness at the loss of life and suffering families. But anger because hate sites created this monster. This is why I hate the PUA/MRA types whose ultimate goal in life is “having sex with women”. Women are people that have feelings too… When I talk about more evolved, this is what I mean.

            Some of his comments:

            Here we are suffering on PuaHate when these lesser, undeserving men that I saw today are walking around with hot girls. It doesn’t make sense.

            By undeserving, he’s talking about Indians and Black men. His cruelty towards Asians is noteworthy, it’s actually quite common not only on the “manosphere” but even on the shanghaiist and CSmack, and his brand of racism gets support here.

            That’s why I’m against Asians turning to PUA sites for help, or believing all the crap on the internet. These people are a bad influence and what Asians, especially those living in the west need are real role models, people who genuinely care. I think the only people who fit the bill and can truly and wholly sympathize are fellow Asians. The rest are too tribal with their own racial chauvinism.

            When I talk about evolution, this is what I mean. Inspite of whatever suffering and abuse is heaped on Asians, Asians would never shoot up a school because:

            I’m a 22 year old virgin who can’t get laid!

            They also don’t set up hate sites like wizardchan which is just a copycat of Japanese innovation.

          • Zappa Frank

            here:

            http://www.nature.com/nrg/journal/v1/n2/full/nrg1100_126a.html

            seems now the articles is not available..if you want I can send you the .pdf

            this is the base, because from this other scientists will respond.

            fist response was this one:

            http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10038-004-0154-3

            against that look for an origin north – west..but is not considered so relevant

            http://www.cell.com/ajhg/abstract/S0002-9297(07)61171-9?cc=y?cc=y

            this is considered more and gives a complex result but still in a major south north migration

            http://rstb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/362/1482/987.short

            that is another one, that still say something about the differentiation north south asia, but still gives substantially a vision of south origin

            http://www.sciencemag.org/content/326/5959/1541.short

            this is the abstact contact me for the article, but is clear enough the position about south origin.

            http://mbe.oxfordjournals.org/content/28/1/513.short

            another one about south origin, but this time from mothers lines.

          • Zappa Frank

            Read prevalently south, I cannot correct the sentence

          • Dr Sun

            damn , not genetics being the driving force behind beliefs, attitudes and behaviour again.
            I’m staying out of this before my troll appears with more of his: my sperm is better than your sperm theories.

  • whuddyasack

    Commonsense, comprehension, logic. What you lack. What you need.

    Hint: Dictionary helps.

  • jon9521

    Its more than the Chinese oil rig in disputed waters. The Chinese factories and towns over on the Vietnamese side have been a constant aggravation with local people being molested. The vietnamese people feel powerless with their own government casting a blind eye to events.

  • mr.wiener

    Would you like some cheese with your whine?

  • Dr Sun

    the anthropological community , thought they died in the 1950’s

  • linette lee

    It’s really crazy with how these South East Asia countries are so racist against Chinese. Forget about them being Taiwanese companies but a lot of these Chinese working there they grew up. They have families over there. A lot of them intermarried and mixed in with the locals too. So how do you still treat them like foreigners and do all these anti Chinese riot to kill them.

  • Tamil Tiger

    Yeah, kill all the Chinese. they are big bully, robbing other people’s land.

    • linette lee

      You are retarded. The people who’s robbing their lands are their own corrupt government. Just like China gov’t robbing the Chinese of their lands and rights.

      • Tamil Tiger

        you are as retarded as your Chinese parents.

  • Insomnicide

    The difference is Japanese people don’t get lynched.

  • mr.wiener

    Who censored you?

  • mr.wiener

    No, why should it?

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