Jewish Girls With Guns, Chinese Netizen Reactions

Two Jewish girls in Israel carrying their guns.

On January 8, one of our readers (Nick), emailed me:

没想到以色列女兵这么漂亮, indeed
[Did not expect Israeli female soldiers to be this pretty, indeed.]

I did not get a chance to make a post at that time but eventually Danwei wrote about it recently on January 14. One week ago, I saw this interesting post on KDS with the title “Pretty girls on Israeli streets”. In the topic were many posted photographs of Jewish girls carrying big guns while walking around on Israel streets.

A Jewish girl poses for the camera with her machine gun. Another Jewish girl waits at a counter with a handgun on her waist.

Here are all the pictures posted on KDS and the only picture still available on Sina:

On KDS, the photos first began with girls carrying guns on the Israel streets. Later in the topic, the original poster posted Jewish girls he thought were good looking. Some appear to be in the military but some are uncertain.

Three Jewish girls in the Israeli IDF military.

Comments from KDS:

…look too many times and you will be shot to death.

Universal military service [?] Their women even have tank units.

They key is character, character.
If our country was like this, then everyday there would be fighting on the streets.

Hitting on these girls involves the risk of getting shot in the head!

This country is very frightening…

Israel’s women’s appearances are not bad.

If our country was like this, it would no longer be “a small group with ulterior motives” but immediately be an overthrow [of the government]…

I would rather live in a society where police do not need to carry guns.
The day you discover even traffic police carrying guns to work will be the day to start crying.

I would not go to this kind of place even if it was given to me for free…there is no safety at all…

God’s chosen people – having a gun on on your self all day.

Do you now feel the benefit of the government controlling firearms?

The pretty ones I bet are wild animals in bed.

It is very difficult to imagine what would happen to them after being captured by the enemy.

[Their] uniforms are very pretty.
Why are our army’s uniforms always so old-fashioned???

Playing an Israeli girl will result in a very horrible death.

I would prefer that everyone can carry guns. At least there would no longer be Xinjiang thieves.
I would prefer that everyone can carry guns. At least a society that can carry guns is “more fair.”
Whether they have stability or not for outsiders to say. At least their passports allow them to go to other countries.

If Shanghai was surrounded by Hamas, I would also want a gun to protect myself.

Two pictures of a Jewish girl in Israel carrying an assault rifle with her purse.

Comments from Sina:

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I really envy having such a nice gun. If I had that, it would be so nice. Whoever bullies me, I will take the gun and go kill his entire family.

Right, peace is not easy to come by. So we need to cherish it. I also hope the world can have fewer wars. It is not easy for people to be able to live.

Hope they can all have peace.

Interesting, bringing a gun to the bank to deposit money…hehe…Israel definitely does not have any thieves. No need to chase, shot at long-range. Definitely no perverts/lechers. No need to be afraid, shot at close-range.  emoticons|E___6086ZHWSSIB|吃黄瓜~

Do not marry these girls! If they get worried, they will drag you outside and shoot you!

In that kind of turbulent environment, in comparison, I feel I am lucky and also blessed…peace peace…ding

Israel is truly impressive, in that kind of environment creating that many miracles!

Israel seems to be a universal mandatory military service country.

In China, this would be inconceivable!!! Perhaps shot dead on the spot!!

A Jewish girl carrying a machine gun on the streets of Israel.

See Also:

Written by Fauna

Fauna is a mysterious young Shanghainese girl who lives in the only place a Shanghainese person would ever want to live: Shanghai. In mid-2008, she started chinaSMACK to combine her hobby of browsing Chinese internet forums with her goal of improving her English. Through her tireless translation of popular Chinese internet news and phenomenon, her English has apparently gotten dramatically better. At least, reading and writing-wise. Unfortunately, she's still not confident enough to have written this bio, about herself, by herself.

  • Beachgoer

    holy shit. there will be no bitch slap in israel, before you realize it, your head is f**king blown off.

  • Peteryang

    fits my taste.

  • Kai

    LoL, I like how the KDS forum gradually and inevitably degenerates into just posting pictures of pretty girls.

    • Shmalkandik

      And your problem with this is? Let us all degenerate this way!

  • fireworks

    They live in a war zone.

    Are they militia? or part of the regular IDF or Reserves.

    • Adam Kratt

      They could be either regular IDF or on Reserve. Israel has Universal Service (everyone must serve in the military) and then it has Universal Reserve (Everyone is in the Reserves)

      Both men (3 years) and women (2 years) when they turn 18 have mandatory universal military service.

      After the initial military service of 3 years for men and 2 years for women they are placed in the active reserve and serve one moth a year until they turn 43 years old. after 43 years of age reserve duty is voluntary

  • colin

    half those pictures are of people in military fatigues…and the other half are there to misdirect people that everyone in Israel walks around with an MP5. Use your heads people. Not everyone in China walks around doing kung fu or flying from roof top to roof top using their mystical kung fu’ie powers, though if you have been watching chinese movies you might think that, or that the japanese invasion/war with china is still going on.

    If I go take pictures of taxi’s and only taxi’s on the streets would you believe that there are only taxi’s here?

  • Peteryang

    I hope there are formal servicewomen. Men would usually pause at sexy females, giving the Israeli military a decisive advantage in combat.

    In gaming term:

    This skill grants you a 50% chance to daze your enemy for 3 seconds.

  • NL

    True, Peteryang, but, Israeli servicemen will also be gawking at their fellow combatant’s arse, thus any advantage to Israel would be cancelled out.
    (exceptional avatar by the way)

    The KDS “pretty girls on Israeli streets” is much more appropriate than “Jewish girls with guns”…unless guns is a sexy metaphor for breasts, in which case, bravo!

  • Gareth

    Reminds me of the old cramps song, Bikini girls with machine guns (sorry don’t know if youtube has stripped the soundtrack of this song or not)

  • Peteryang


    I thought they are separated from their male counterpart in combat. if not, this issue can be resolved by just doing that.

    Hamas on the other hand, could hardly amass any female soldier of value (besides C4 strappers who got shot in the face before they even get close, and a small portion of them explode randomly by accident) , on top of that, turban covers all crucial parts of the face that differentiate woman from man.

    • Adam Kratt

      In Israel women serve in frontline combat next to the men in regular IDF units. There are some designated units for the Heredi (Ultra Orthodox) which do not have female soldiers. Probably for the safety of the Heredi.. with their chauvenistic behavior they would probably be shot by the females.

      Israel has two extremes…. Ultra Orthodox and Secular both have a hard time interacting with the other.. the moderate or Masorti (Conservative Middle Ground)Although the largest movement of jews in America is rather small in Israel.

  • Gnah

    They are not separated. I’ve heard many tales from Israelis about sex in the army.

    But I didn’t know you could see weapons carried in the street by civilians like this.

    • Adam Kratt

      Civilians do not generally carry weapons in Israel. Soldiers though are required to carry their weapons at all times. So a Regular Army who is off duty would have a weapon or during your annual Reserve duty you would be required to have your weapon.

      Outside urban areas such as in outlaying town or in settlements gun control is more lax and you will see civilians carryingweapons. But in the main cities if they are carrying a gun their are usually IDF (regular/reserve) or police/security

  • enlighted

    Every citizen of Israel are obligated to military service. They finish schools while in army. Due geopolitical conditions in which Israel are, it is quite normal to see girls and hunks caring guns casually on the streets. Friend of my told me that Israel is like giant army camp, with very tight security on every place. Although, running in slippers with 5kg heavy gun and tight mini is not very convenient.

  • Peteryang

    yeah I can imagine what Israel is like, being surrounded by enemy nations who practice fundamentally different religion. God bless them.

  • Girls with guns are sexy. Maybe the new fashion trend should be girls with fake guns. :)

  • richard

    I find it very repulsive seeing Muslim women wearing those bags. For some reason, I have no respect for them or their culture.

    Israeli women are a breath of fresh air.

    I hope Israel does whatever is necessary, not matter what, to protect itself.

    • Billy

      Glad to see your not a bigot Dick. No group in the world is more insular than the Jews. Amazing that they have this civil rights rep in the United States. You’re another example of that groups big time hypocrisy. Big. Time.

      Youre prepared to do whatever it takes? Here’s an idea. Give back their land and just chalk it up to not being prepared 2000 years ago with the Romans.

  • socratestes

    Hmm…imagine if they have PMS bad. Once a month you’d risk having a massacre…

    • colin

      To “SOCRATESTES” – Your comment about these gun-toting babes having PMS is so funny,my belly is aching.
      If I made that comment in my country (New Zealand),the Feminist Brigade would BBQ me.

  • Peteryang


    I am with you on this one, islam is a backward and barbaric religion, it promotes violence and intolerance and has no place in civil society. its believers are primitive and stir up troubles around the world for their holey war. their women get executed for simply going to school.

    in any islamic country, the religion is the state is the government and is the law, thats why these arabic nations are poor as a bathroom sinkhole. these pathetic assholes think the world owes them eveything.

    tell you a little story of mine, few years ago I took a flight from New Zealand to China, sitting right besides me were two muslim men, for the whole 11 hours of the flight I had to keep my eyes on them, fearing they’d blow everyone up, and I noticed almost all surrounding passengers had the same nervous look.

    Jews on the other hand, were extremely unfortunate in their history, more than once they were near extinction, and are still fighting for survival today, but amid all these troubles they’ve managed to build a true modern and democratic nation on a wasteland and control much of american finance system.

    I salute their talents, indiligence and unity, I feel their pain and wholeheartedly support whatever they have to do for their nation.

    • Adam Kratt

      Any religion (Islam) that murders a 10 year old girl because her 30 year old uncle rapes her is barbaric.

      Any religion (Islam) that regularly supports genital mutilation of girls is Barbaric

      Any religion (Islam) that allows 50 year old men to marry and have sex with 9 year old girls is Barbaric

      Islam is Barbaric

  • @richard @Peteryang

    The problem isn’t with Islam it is with fundamentalists. there are plenty of Jewish fundamentalists and Christian fundamentalists too.

    If the Jewish government started to work towards a peaceful solution then perhaps we wouldn’t have these situations in the Gaza.

  • wu

    jews are the most dispicable race in the world

    • fuck wu

      Wu, you are a dumb gook. You are the Asian equivalent of George Bush.

    • colin

      Reply to “WU” – You are a Sick Racist.
      How dare you say “God bless Hitler”.If there is a God,Hitler (and you)will get what you deserve.

  • han

    Jews with the most sacred! We all need to help them to shout about what the Arabs do have a lot of years. I have a friend in Israel and Cool Dude – Thi State of Israel forever

  • Racheli

    Explanation (I’m Israeli):
    Those who are not wearing uniforms are on vacation from the army, but they mustn’t leave their wepons anywhere without supervising (by military law), so they stuck with it 24\7…

  • Of

    Wu – shame on you – I not belive you are Chinese . remember who was Hitler and who were his ally and what they did to China.
    the respect to Israel it’s more then what you can understand …you’re a loser !

  • Raab

    Monday, January 19, 2009 at 11:59 pm

    @richard @Peteryang

    The problem isn’t with Islam it is with fundamentalists. there are plenty of Jewish fundamentalists and Christian fundamentalists too.

    If the Jewish government started to work towards a peaceful solution then perhaps we wouldn’t have these situations in the Gaza.”

    The problem is, 99.9% of suicide bombers are Muslim, and if the Israeli gov’t (not Jewish government) *only* worked toward a UN-sanctioned peace agreement, fanatical Muslims would still bomb the hell out of Israeli civilians simply because they exist.

    Anyway, without getting too political.. Racheli’s spot on.

  • Hammy

    Dude Peteryang. That’s pretty racist and ignorant. Islam is a barbaric religion that promotes violence? What? Also, that little story of yours only shows your racism, not how dangerous Muslim people are. Only truly a tiny percentage of Muslims are terrorists and you are almost implying that all Muslims should be exterminated. What they do as religious practice and what they do to their woman is none of your business. That’s their national/religious sovereignty and they don’t want you to throw around your foreign moral judgments on what they do, especially when it doesn’t affect you. You are probably even more intolerant than any normal Muslim.

    Also, “jews control much of American financial system”? Maybe I don’t know, but can you show me a reliable source before you say something so generalizing.

  • Hammy

    Also, I don’t get people’s double standards against Muslims. It’s morally horrible when suicide bombers kill innocent civilians, but it’s perfectly fine when modern bombers bomb the hell out of innocent civilians. The only difference is that one is more primitive and kill less, while the other is more advanced and kill more. For however many unnecessary killings the Islam world did to the western world, the western world did 1000 times over to Islam world. And the western attacks are not all retaliatory. For example Iraq. What did Iraqi did to US? None of the 911 terrorists are iraqi and yet about 1 million Iraqi got killed and their whole nation broken.

    “…would still bomb the hell out of Israeli civilians simply because they exist.”
    That’s not the complete reason why the Muslim world hates Israel. To Muslims, Israel is an invader and it invaded their holy city. Before WWII and consequent Jewish resettlement decisions by the Allies, Jerusalem is predominately Muslims city. Now it became almost a complete Jewish city. To Muslims, they are only repelling invaders through the only method they have, suicide bombing. Also, Israel is the biggest US ally and support US’s agenda in oppressing the Arab world, so of course Muslims are going to hate Israel.

    • kyle

      Actually, since 1850 (and of course a long time before that), Jerusalem has been majority Jewish. And Jerusalem is not “their Holy city” — Mecca is. So much for your complete ignorance and your reliance on BS Arab propaganda. Muslims are killing each other – the issue is intolerance for anyone who does not believe exactly as you do. They hate Jews because they are not Arabs, not Muslims, etc., and also because they have a strong claim to the land that they do not have. The vast majority of Arabs in what was Palestine came quite recently (last 100 years) also – because of 20th Century development, primarily by the British and the Jews. Get your facts straight. And, by the way, over 700,000 Jews came to Israel after being forced out of Arab countries (and having their possessions stolen) after WWII. So, Iraq, Morocco, Syria, Eqypt, Algeria, Tunisia, etc. can say nothing about Arabs having to leave historic Palestine.

  • Following the recent events in south of Israel and the biased coverage in some of media channels, I invite everybody to watch my channel in YouTube:
    There are many films of global intersts and also in regard to the situation in our south [like 15 seconds in Sderot: the time ppl there can expect as alert before fall of rockets]. There are many playlists in my channel too, some of them also relate to subject of actual interest.
    People who know Hebrew and want to receive more information can write to [email protected] and I will send files with more data.
    BTW: I know someone who was now in the Gaza front, daughter of a friend. She is not really combat but does something technical that has to do with supporting fighting. However- we fight because we have no choice if we want to survive. Nobody enjoys it. And: You are also invited to visit our country, there is also alot of fun and interest.

  • kfir

    As an Israeli soldier and officer, you have to understand that to protect on almost 8 million people from almost 1 billion arabs is almost impossible mission.
    You could see that Hamas is holding the civilians like hostages, educating them that hate and war is the only way for them to live.
    In my time in Gaza i saw many tunnels for weapons, suicide bombers, weapons who were hiden in mosques and schools.
    Is this is the future that Hamas wants for Palastinian children ?

  • CN

    Israel whoring out women for tourism….LOL…who the hell wants to go to the MidEast – a desert full of religious fanatics.

  • Nathan

    “This is not the complete reason”….,your are so pathetic.While Israel existence is a proven istoric fact,the arabs living on the holly land is a relative recent mistake.The jewsh have eliberated their own land from the arab occupation.Is as simple as that.You see smart ass,the human history does not star or end with wwii.You may as well pretend that jews never exist befor that war,but hey,do not let facts and history to confuse you!Arab holy city,my ass,ignorant!And yeah there is a huge difference between a bomber and a suicidal terorrist.keep your dogs home and you’ll never test the bombs.What is Israel doing is just to protect their citizen,their children from mad dogs like hamas.It is so insane to claim to be a fighter while using children and womans as human shield.You have lost it,if you hope that israelis will let you bomb them just because the ‘fighters”launch and hide under their woman skirts.The old and goood time when ones could just burn jews alive is over.get use to it,The Great IDF is there to protect and punish,if is neccesary with bombers,so you just could wake up from your false dreams.God bless Israel

    • abbu

      If u r so much proud of IDF n their operations then y jewish girls r running away with palestenians who r hiding behind women n children.Bombing innocent civilians is actual terrorism my friend,n if u d’know how muslims behaved when they had captured u r land back in 6th century B.C then read history.

      • kyle

        well, at least you know it is the Jews’ land, Abbu — that is one step forward

  • שי

    אין כמו הצבא הישראלי בעולם!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • שמעון, עכו.

    !כשהערבים יניחו את נשקם, לא תהיה עוד מלחמה, כשישראל תניח את נשקה, לא תהיה עוד ישראל

  • enlighted


    Before WWII Kosovo was predominantly Serbian. Should we let them to take it back?

  • Nathan

    No Hammy,”we” have to do something about it,send some “martyrs” to search and distroy.The jews can be compared even to a bicycle if you want to,let alone serbian,albanian and so on.They do not have a history, a legacy or any importance.You can gas them,kill them,take away their right to exist,opress them as “we” want and please.Surely I can understand that “we” become increasingly outraged by their capacity to defend them self,after all “we” are used to see them die quietly.Isn’t it?

  • sl

    It’s a form of birth control for the colonizer. Necessary to maintain concentration camp Gaza.

    • kyle

      ha – birth control?? Gaza has the highest birthrate in the world! the ignorance here is astounding. Free food and $$ from the world to keep up this 1.5mm person “refugee camp” that sure looks like a small country and has new buildings, restaurants, etc. Cut out the free food and $$, and if the men get a job, the birthrate for breeding masses will drop. But for now, it is a bunch of rabbits.

    • kyle

      Israel could kill them all in one day if it wanted. That is why this posturing is complete nonsense. If you want to see killing, look at Iraqi and Pakistani Muslims bombing each others’ mosques and killing many with bombs every day! Israel vs. Gaza is like holiday camp compared to there.

  • Peteryang

    ok for those who disagree with me, let put it this way:

    What makes Buddhism, Taoism or Christianity (and the likes) different from Islam is that the formers are compatible with men’s conscience and morals, advocate peace, don’t meddle with politics, instill spiritual goodness in people, and its believers usually possess high tolerance toward each other and non-believers, so they can live, grow and interact with modern societies in a constructive way.

    Islam on the other hand, not only has none of these essential virtues, but is also bloody in its core. The Kuran specifically states to eradicate Israel, and Muslims believe so, this doctrine alone is enough to render it a killing guide, and you can’t find something ridiculous as this in other religions’ teaching. Now imagine if Japan’s constitution stipulates that China and all Chinese must be eliminated, and Japanese military fire rockets into Senkaku islands every fcuking day, how do you thing the Chinese will respond??

    and that doesn’t even tell the whole story, since Israel, unlike China, is located in the very heart of enemy territory, they ought to use whatever possible to defend and rightfully defend themselves. now THAT is called sovereignty!

    and Hammy I laugh at your “foreign moral judgement” line, I thought only chinese government uses this excuse. and you said “especially when it doesn’t affact you”, wrong, it affacts me, more specifically it affacts us Chinese, East Turkestan Islamic Movement is a major headache for Xinjiang region.

  • Peteryang

    I am not saying Hamas or any islamic nation should quit fighting, they can do whatever they like (as they already do) with Israel just as Israel does whatever it has to, but matter of fact for now is Hamas got their ass handed to Israel military.

  • Hammy

    You are rabbling dude. Are you a religious fanatic?
    Muslim living in Israel a relatively recent mistake? What? Read your history!! Recent as in ever since Islam is created!! Israel was never exclusively Jewish ever since there are Muslims. Hell, Israel was never exclusively Jewish ever since there are Christians. You think Jews can hold the Israel when the Arab civilization is the most prosperous? When the crusaders fought to conquer Jerusalem, it is mainly the Muslims that defend the city. Recent mistake!?!? I will say this, before WWII, Israel and Jerusalem had Muslims as the majority and Jews and Christians as the minority. Now there is hardly any Muslims, if there is any.

    “It is so insane to claim to be a fighter while using children and womans as human shield” Where and when and who used “womans” and children as shields? Is that the reasoning that Israel uses to kill these women and children? “Oh, every woman and child is only a human shield for the Hamas, so kill them before they are used.”

    Who is killing who? No one is burning Jews alive. But you could say that bombs are burning Muslims alive by the thousands. And stop dragging the Holocaust, nazis and Hitler into this. Those are not arguments. Nobody is oppressing the Jews now while definitely the whole western world is oppressing the Muslims by categorizing all Muslims as terrorists, so it’s fine to kill all of them.

    Wait, it’s ok for Israel to expel Muslims out of their land in the first place, but it’s not fine for the Muslims to fight back? First you have to get that there is no normal right or wrong in international conflicts. Nobody let anybody do anything. I am just saying the Muslims terrorist is not the only wrong ones. Israel is also wrong for starting this conflict by forcefully expelling Muslims from their holy city.

    I will respect you for fighting for your country, but just your first sentence is already striking me as dangerous and genocidal. You are assuming the entire 1 billion Arabs as your enemy.

    Hamas is not holding the Muslim civilian as hostage. Do you think that Hamas could have power in the first place, when they don’t have Palestinians support? Hamas is an extreme representation of a segment of Muslim popular opinion, if I want to hook this to democracy.

    Also, whose fault is it that the Palestinian children are in such a war zone? Do you expect the children to be perfectly content, when their families get killed by bombs? Israel and US are the best recruiters for terrorist groups. Do you think the only reason Palestinian hates Israel is because the Hamas is brainwashing them?

  • @ peteryang, your “story” proves nothing except that you and your fellow passengers are paranoid racists. I note, with some amusement, that the men you were sitting next to DIDN’T do anything.

    Islam is not a violent religion any more than Christianity is. Yes, there’s violence and advocation of killing nonbelievers in the Koran; have you read the Bible lately? That stuff is in almost any old religious book (Chinese texts not so much though, actually). The vast majority of muslims are peaceful, love peace, and have no interest in blowing anyone up. You just never hear about them because “Muslim guy doesn’t do anything dangerous at all” isn’t an exciting headline for a newspaper.

  • this is paid for by the israeli government. dude, murder is sexy, get with it.

    funny quote from the video: “we’re using new tools, in order to reach new audiences”. totally erases all my my concerns about them objectifying women…

  • Samael

    do they carry jew gold?

  • Hammy

    “The Kuran specifically states to eradicate Israel”????????????????????
    Dude, Dude, Dude! Stop right there. At least get your stuff right, before criticizing Islam. Just like Christianity/Buddhism/Taoism/Confucianism/Judaism/etc., Islam also preaches tolerance and all that other stuff. But how can you be tolerant, when the world is not tolerant towards you and assumes that your whole religion advocates endless violence and terrorism. You seem to have a complete misunderstanding of the Koran. You don’t even know anything and yet you are babbling your mouth.

    Also, learn history while you are at it. Israel is created only through forcefully expelling the Muslims. They are not defending their original land. They are the invaders.

    And “foreign moral judgment” is a legitimate argument. That’s not an excuse. Although sometimes the Chinese government abuses it (since some of their practices are not acceptable in China’s own moral sphere), the whole principle of moral relativity still holds. You can not make moral judgments to some practice in some other environment when the initial assumptions are different. There are no absolute morals and your own morals are based on some arbitrary foundations. You can not decide with logic that your arbitrary foundations is more moral or better than some other culture’s arbitrary moral foundation. Their foundation is in the Koran. Your foundations is in who knows, a mix of Confucian and Liberal doctrines (Perhaps the Confucian part is almost non-existence, since you are so westernized).

  • Peteryang


    I don’t think I need to list all the passages in Quran that preach hatred toward EVERY OTHER religion.

    seriously, why is islam at war with every other religion while these can live peacefully with each other??? thats says alot about its nature.

  • Nathan

    Get a life “dude”,nobody really cares about your useless lies.Right now the jews prevail because they have military uperhand and skills.As a important part of arab strategy ,crying when beaten is a must.You want me to read my history? the Human history books states that King David built Jerusalem and Jews had a continues life within Israel thousands of years .Hamas books have however a different outlook on to history.Are they human?Are they human while taking cover behind children,are they human when they blow them self in busses and shoping centers? Nor westerns or israelis have in their agenda to kill innocents by commiting terrorist acts,hijiking planes or launching rockets deliberatly in to schools,hospitals and towns.Those who have everything to do with that are ONLY arabs.

  • Nathan

    ” But how can you be tolerant, when the world is not tolerant towards you and assumes that your whole religion advocates endless violence and terrorism.”
    It is not Jihad,(the holly war that any muslim has to do against non-muslims)preached by Kuran?That bock may as well preaches about tolerance among muslims but is a source of sorrow and trouble for human race.

  • Peteryang

    For all those Islam-loving Chinese, Muslims in western China make all sorts of trouble regularly, they have a reputation of blowing buses and have killed our very fellow countrymen. they even threatened our olympics earlier last year!

    I just can’t understand why some Chinese would support muslims, the only thing we want from mideast is oil and thats strictly a political deal that doesn’t involve any social connection. so shame on them, they often go anti-america or anti-japan but fail to realize the true threat at our very doorstep.

  • blkaznluver

    i think:

    !) The Jews keep Jerusalem, the Muslims Mecca, Christians Rome
    Mainly because if memory serves me right Jerusalem is Judaisms holiest site. Whereas its like number 3 on Islam’s and Christianity’s list

    2) I read the Old Testament, New Testament and Koran.
    The impressions I got were:
    Koran – violent, with a violent leader.
    Old Testament – violent. with instances of rape, genocide, slavery.
    New Testament – a non-violent leader, but traces of sexism, bigotry.

  • wuxia

    The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is perhaps the most complicated of our times. I’m hardly a political expert and do not claim to know the truth, but I’ve been in both Israel and the West Bank and have experienced the situation first hand, travelling with isrealis as wel as palestinians and being held at gunpoint.
    For the Israelis this is the Holy Land that was appointed to them in the Bible (reading the old testament will give you a much deeper understanding of this “appointment”). For the Palestinians it is the land they always lived in rightfully and where they were driven out of by he Zionists (please note the difference with Jews in general). It is unsolvable.
    A lot of Palestinians are raised with stories of atrocities and only one reason to live for: get the land of your forefathers back. Most Jewish in Israel are raised to believe in the old testament. Nuff said.

    I think that Israel’s tactical move to give the Gaza strip back to the Palestinians is in a way working out like they wanted. They knew that Palestian’s reason to live is to get their land back. As soon as they have it (or part of it) there is a big gap in their existence. Instead of focusing on ruling it correctly and trying to build the economy they use it as a base to attack Israel. This gives Israel a reason to attack it as a country (and have an official war) but more importantly it showed the world that Palestinians are not capable of ruling even a small area and are therefore not worthy of ruling present day Israel. (Of course this is from an Israeli standpoint).

    @ Peteryang
    I strongly urge you to read the old testament. In there you will find as much violence as in the Quran and also in the Bible God tells the Jews to slay everybody that does not believe in God the Jewish way (since everybody believes in the same God), assisted by God’s flaming sword.
    At the time of writing of these documents this was necessary to survive and gain influence.

    Traveling to the Middle East on a regular basis I also have religious discussions on a regular basis (being the friendly but slightly provoking guy that I am). I find that in general Islam is a quite peaceful religion not that much different from Christianity. Indeed (like stated in this forum before) problems lie with extremists. Also please note that Islam is different in every country, much like there are so many different streams in Christianity.

    Difference lies in the following:
    – Islam is still much more intermixed with politics. This makes for very visible results.
    – Although it differs per region and believer Islam is relatively strict about not changing the text of the Quran and the literal interpretation of it. This results in a lot of values and morals being outdated (in this aspect I agree with Peteryang). Islam does often not take into account influences of planes, internet, modern medicine, etc. because they were simply not there at the time of writing.
    This does make Islam not a barbaric religion (on the contrary I find it usually most courteous and hospitable), but it makes it a bit of an outdated one.

    Due to the mix with politics and the outdated interpretation of Islam, western and Israeli presence in the Middle East is not only infringing on national pride but also on religious beliefs. Martyrs simply believe that they are serving God (Allah) in the best way they can.

    In many places in the Arab world a clash between a long overdue update in interpretation and more literal interpretations now develops (with as a front runner, Dubai of course…and probably Beirut before that).

    Like Takuan Soho said: “Reading a cookbook does not still your hunger”
    It is very hard to understand this situation without thoroughly experiencing it.

  • wuxia

    Kai, where are you in all this? I always appreciate your comments. Back home for CNY?

  • Peteryang


    thanks for the clerification, I think you basically pointed out the problems with Islam: outdated, meddle with politics and extremists.

    I absolutely despise governments ruling using religion, it is a genocide to social diversity which is the very foundation of technological and economic development. America did the greatest thing by separating church from school or else it would just be one poor continent.

    and I agree with your thoughts on Gaza, Palestinians wanted it so badly and finally got it but just to end up being unable to govern, I mean its both ridiculous and hilarious. not only Hamas cannot offer them peace and better living, they use it as a military base and train suicide bombers from its very citizens, I mean this isn’t a GOVERNMENT this is just CRIME.

    thanks again wuxia, I love to hear more about your experience in Gaza.

  • Samael

    you guys can argue for and against islam all you like. but from personal experiences, i don’t look too highly to these people and i, among many, would certainly not miss them if and when they are gone.

    yes you may call my views prejudiced, but i also genuinely i hope to be proven wrong, but so far everything ive seen simply strengthens my beliefs. and no im not talking about the media, im talking about the things ive seen with my own eyes, talks with people ive met and ordeals ive personally experienced.

    instead of crying fowl every chance they get, muslims should get off their arse and actually improve themselves first.

  • Mike

    They are young, hot, and love to kill Palestinians!!!!