Master’s in Statistics Graduates at Columbia University 80% Chinese

Master’s in Statistics Graduates at Columbia University 80 percnet Chinese

At America’s Columbia University, this year’s graduating class for a Master’s Degree in Statistics was over 80% Chinese, and 90% Asian. The roster, which contained 231 names total, contained 16 Wangs, 16 Lis, 10 Chens, 10 Zhangs and 9 Lius. Many people suspect the university has lowered its entrance requirements so they can make money off of an increase in international students. One netizen commented on the number of Chinese in the statistics field, saying “I used to do statistics for a company, to avoid Chinese people I purposefully switched jobs.”

Source: WeChat

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  • Jahar

    Because who the fuck gets a masters in statistics? Chinese people. And degrees in running. And flight attendant.

    • Alex Dương

      What do you think a Master’s in Statistics entails?

    • bujiebuke

      surprise surprise, another puerile comment from you. Statisticians are in demand from pretty much every field from biology to finance. There really isn’t a field where a statistician wouldn’t be helpful. But I doubt you’d understand this…

      • Jahar

        There are lots of fields where lots of things are helpful. Where are the statistics for those masters degrees?

        • bujiebuke

          Hahaha! your demanding statistics while arguing the whether a masters degree in statistics is useful.

          “There are lots of fields where lots of things are helpful.”
          Are you in grade school? Because this is what someone in grade school would say when they don’t know what they’re talking about.

          • Jahar

            It was a joke.

            No, I’m not in grade school. Are you? Because personal insults towards someone you’ve never met is something someone in grade school would do.

            Originally, I was taking a shot at the Chinese education style, and I was too lazy to express it clearly. Still don’t feel like it.

          • donscarletti

            No, personal insults towards people you’ve never met is something that some anonymous stranger on an internet forum might do.

            Harden up or go back to Facebook.

          • Jahar

            I was saying that about his grade school comment, not because I feel offended by anything he said. If anything, the most offensive comment ever directed at me might be “go back to facebook.” ouch.

          • donscarletti

            Cool, the net’s been kind to you. I remember when “Da Shan” from the CCTV spring gala was chased out of here a while back. Folks weren’t telling him to go to Facebook.

            Also, sometimes you get those ESL losers from BJ or SH who figure out they know each other in real life accusing each other of being rapists or junkies or some other misconduct.

            Elementary schoolchild is a compliment on this forum.

          • Jahar

            I meant that as a joke.

          • bujiebuke

            Pfff… You consider that a personal insult?

            OK. maybe I made the mistake of assuming you read the title which is about Columbia University in the USA. Where does “Chinese education style” come in to play here??

          • Jahar

            Years and years of over-study. Choosing majors based on what they can get into instead of what they want to study, or want to do.

          • bujiebuke

            “Years and years of over-study. Choosing majors based on what they can get into instead of what they want to study, or want to do.”

            Even if this were true, it still doesn’t explain your opening statement:

            “Because who the fuck gets a masters in statistics? Chinese people. And degrees in running. And flight attendant.”

            There are plenty of Chinese students who go abroad and choose to study in liberal arts, you seem to only have a myopic view on this subject.

          • Jahar

            It is true, and it does explain it. 80% of the class is Chinese. You really think this is because they are chasing their hopes and dreams of becoming a statistician? You really don’t think it’s because they got a degree at home that’s junk, and this was the highest ranked program they could get into? I’ve taught thousands of Chinese students, and a very very very small number of them choose majors or universities based on anything other than their test scores.

          • bujiebuke

            No, you were contending that a masters in statistics is a worthless degree similar to a degree in running. Now your trying to make tangential argument that Chinese students only choose their major based on their test score…

            Not only has your reasoning been complete garbage, but your latest argument makes no sense at all. It seems perfectly reasonable for someone to pursue a subject that they excel in. People who are passionate in math, science, or literature tend to also do well on their respective tests.

            Your supposed experience in teaching Chinese students weighs very little in this argument. What subject were you teaching? I’m going to guess it wasn’t English, science, math, art rolled into a single curriculum where one can see the evidence that you’ve alleged have.

            Based on your previous incoherent posts, I’m inclined to feel sorry for anyone who had to sit through your class trying to make sense out of your ramblings.

          • Jahar

            Look at you go. Tell me more about what I’m thinking, and what I’m doing.

          • bujiebuke

            I’m telling you what you wrote, not what you were thinking. Who the fuck knows what’s going on in that brain of yours.

          • dag

            You must be the simple-minded troll Chinasmack keeps on retainer. You smell.
            Chinasmack can not improve but repeating its old obnoxious practices.

          • mr.wiener

            Please define how you think he is a troll.

          • donscarletti

            Troll, n.

            1) A large and fierce mythical humanoid that lives under bridges and in caves.
            2) Someone online who’s views differ from one’s own and does not have the decency to keep silent.

          • dag

            @”Mr. Wiener ”

            ChinaSmack has been a slow-motion train wreck for several years. With Kai Pan, Belle, Fauna, et al. out of the way, the end is complete.

            Your manning the throttle is a wasted effort. Don’t try to stimulate controversy. You don’t have the wit or intelligence.

            Bring back the Canadian-Korean. Use him. He was a real creature.

            tschüs

          • bujiebuke
          • mr.wiener

            All I can see with my limited wits is someone calling out another for trolling when they are not.
            We don’t keep trolls in residence …except eattot when she tries to behave.
            When the end comes I’ll be here to hose out the bathroom and turn off the lights, please don’t let the door hit you in the arse.

          • bujiebuke

            you’re comments are amusing, have you met super bunny?

          • Jahar

            I think she’s just from another planet. Or another incarnation of that girl that used to go on like that. what was her name? It’s on the tip of my tongue…

          • bujiebuke

            “You smell.”

            Then stop sniffing my asshole

    • 42

      In case you havent noticed yet, everywhere in every industry there is use of statistics, from stock markets to weather predictions and other science as in space explorations. So saying there is no need for master graduates for statistics is just utter and pathetic ignorance.

      • Jahar

        I didn’t say there wasn’t. And implying that I did is just utter and pathetic ignorance.

        • Alex Dương

          So what did you mean with your comment? Seems like you were implying that a Master’s in Statistics is yet another useless thing Chinese people like to get.

          • Jahar

            I forgot you were still here to jump to the motherland’s defense at every turn.

            Read what don scarletti said. I’d assume you guys would all be aware of how much time they spend here studying shit they don’t need.

          • Alex Dương

            My apologies for not being able to tell when you’re serious and when you’re being a douchebag to let off steam. I’m pretty sure you would not be able to handle the coursework that is required to complete a Master’s of Statistics at a school like Columbia, lowered entrance requirements or not.

          • Jahar

            I couldn’t handle the workload to get a master’s degree in anything, anywhere. I can’t study.

            And yeah. I’m having one of those weeks where everything that irks me here just seems to be showing up.

          • Alex Dương

            If what irks you is the Chinese educational system, I don’t see how this story provides a relevant example. Columbia is a private U.S. university. Its president, Lee Bollinger, values “holistic admissions” for selecting undergraduate students, which is 110% American. Not even Canada and the U.K. do “holistic admissions.”

            If what irks you is Chinese people studying useless shit, again, I don’t see how this story provides a relevant example. People studying for a Master’s in Statistics don’t spend $60,000+ and two years learning how to take AVERAGE and STDEV in Excel. They don’t spend that time learning how to describe a sample; they learn how to make educated guesses about the population given a sample.

          • Jahar

            I meant irl stuff, not related to education, related to chinese . children pissing in shopping malls, no one having any idea what common courtesy is, endless, late night(illegal) road construction. Crap like this. makes me want to shit on everything they do.

          • Alex Dương

            I get that you want to let off steam. I ask only that you do it in a fair way. If cS runs a story / digest on children pissing or shitting in public? Go for it. People not having common courtesy? Feel free. Illegal construction keeping you up at night? Have at it.

            Just don’t use these as excuses to shit on Chinese people who are merely going about their lives.

          • Jahar

            You saying that as a mod or a poster?

          • Alex Dương

            Is my request unreasonable?

          • Jahar

            Is mine?

          • Alex Dương

            That depends. Are you asking because you find the request unreasonable?

        • 42

          You said who the fuck gets and go do masters degrees in statistics, chinese people do, but then again who the fuck cares what you say. Ignorance is failing to see the true sense of meaning. Accusing you of saying something is not considered ignorance but is called defamation. If I take it up on a court of law you would not win, anything you say can be held against you, I rest my case.

          • Jahar

            I wasn’t aware that we were in a court of law. And I said that to mock your comment.

  • donscarletti

    I’m amazed to hear about a MSc class being 10% non Asian in any university.

    MSc is just for people with Bachelors degrees to get a degree from a better university without spending too much time or money. When you’re from a western country, it tends to be fairly easy to get into better universities the first time, thus, not likely to see many westerners in class.

    • Alex Dương

      Better universities relative to those in China or the “average” university from a given western country?

      • donscarletti

        Better than the one that you already have a degree from. Though Columbia would be both. America after all is a country that has a hand full of brilliant universities and a country full of absolute dross. Problem is apart for the UC system, America’s good universities and its universities with large enrolments are mutually exclusive, so most Americans get a pretty damn awful education considering they have so many universities in the world top 50.

        • Alex Dương

          Sorry, I should’ve clarified. What did you mean by “better universities the first time”?

          • donscarletti

            “Better than the one that you already have a degree from.”

            People get MSc to upgrade the school on their CV. Whether this is from a community collage to a state university or from a world top 50 university to Cambridge or something, the rationale remains the same.

          • Alex Dương

            It’s not clear to me that it’s fairly easy to get into a good American university. (I can’t comment on Canadian, British, Australian universities as I’ve no experience with them.) Of course, there are more than 25 good schools in the U.S., but it isn’t just Harvard and Stanford who have really low acceptance rates.

          • donscarletti

            The Commonwealth (with the exception of Oxbridge) tends to dominate the bottom half of the world top fifty, between America’s elite colleges and the others, but they do it with far higher enrollment numbers than those above them. Canada’s UT, McGill, Queens, etc Australia’s “Group of 8”, UK’s “Red Brick” and “Plate Glass” universities tend to have undergraduate enrollment figures in the several tens of thousands each, roughly triple that of Harvard or Yale. Even Oxford and Cambridge (being public universities) have far larger enrollments than the Ivy League schools they rank beside.

            America’s University of California system provides similar quality education to similar numbers of students, but besides that, America tends to focus on providing an exceptional quality of education to a very small number of students.

          • Alex Dương

            To be clear, I agree with you that many people get a MSc to “upgrade” their resumes. I guess it’s because the American experience is different from that of Canada, the U.K., Australia, etc. that I don’t see it as necessarily true that it’s easier for a Westerner to attend a better university in the first place, which would make a MSc redundant for “upgrade” purposes.

  • redlobster

    They lowered the standards to get more Asians? That doesn’t make sense.

    • Zack Snyder

      Standard of English presumably.

    • David

      I have no idea if they have actually done that but the reasoning for suspecting it and for a school to do it is thus: Most U.S. students get some kind of student aid from the school and so usually do not pay full tuition. In addition, tuition for non-residents is higher (sometimes much higher) than for residents. So if you encourage non-residents to attend college, not only do they pay full tuition, the tuition itself is higher, thus making more money for the school. With the number of new rich Chinese families looking to ‘buy’ their child into a good western school, there is dearth of rich Chinese parents forking over the big bucks. This is true in many universities in the west (i.e. British students pay lower tuition than non-British students at Cambridge).

      • Alex Dương

        I agree that money is what drives the suspicion, but AFAIK most Master’s programs don’t give out much financial aid at all to anyone.

        • David

          It depends what you consider financial aid. I was offered a fellowship which basically paid full tuition and a little extra in return for teaching a few classes every week. To me, that is a form of financial aid.

          • Alex Dương

            Fair enough. I should’ve said grants.

          • David

            Yes, fewer direct grants but because you are dealing at a higher level of education, (with the potential that entails) there are many more avenues available to you for paying for school, especially in PhD programs. Remember, schools are almost all for profit organizations.

          • Alex Dương

            PhD programs are for sure different than Master’s programs in the prevalence of funding for students.

      • Jay K.

        2nd, Columbia is a private university. Most private universities have a flat rate for students whether instate/out-state/intl.

        Those who charge at a higher rate are usually he state universities. I’m a product of the State University of New York (SUNY), i know.

        • David

          Yes. I used to help people acquire financial aid as part of the financial services my company did. Private universities give MUCH more in financial aid than state schools usually do (not necessarily as a percentage of the tuition but as a total dollar amount because the tuitions are usually much higher). Therefore even if your getting 20,000 in financial aid (all combinations) the out of pocket for Private universities are usually much higher.

  • 250

    As you probably know, Chinese people tend to pick majors that lead to
    good job opportunities whereas Westerners tend to pick subjects they are
    interested in / think is cool. So this particular statistic about
    statistics does not surprise me.

    • Alex Dương

      IMO it’s more dependent on socioeconomic status. If you came from a relatively modest background, chances are, you aren’t majoring in art history.

      • 250

        I’m not sure about that. Art history is probably more popular with the middle/high classes due to having more exposure to it. I think if you looked at something like media studies (something people enjoy but with few job opportunities) vs. accountancy it wouldn’t hold up. That’s besides the point, the Chinese studying abroad are from families with high socioeconomic status.

        • Alex Dương

          I don’t think media studies is that popular of a major to begin with, much less with students from modest backgrounds. In the case of Chinese graduate students, it’s not clear to me that they are from the same backgrounds on average as Chinese undergraduate students. No doubt that Chinese undergraduates at Columbia on average come from high SES families.

  • WghUk

    I’ve always wondered. Chinese students are the best at academics. But why still the world’s best universities aren’t from China?

  • x1sfg

    It’s because it’s Columbia, an Ivy League school that’s on its last leg but still trying to stand on its old reputation. But Chinese people, being the name whores that they are, don’t know any better and think the Ivy League is the cream of the crop in everything. In the US, the Ivy League is just a bad sports league. There are some schools such as Stanford, and other schools with specialized programs that match or beat even their best undergrad schools, being Harvard, Yale, and Princeton.

    That’s why you’ll see so many international students in many graduate Ivy League programs that are just money making scams, like Harvard’s MPP program. Luckily, you won’t see that more than 50% internationals in their best programs like at HBS. I’m all for diversity as it brings in different points of view during case studies (for MBA or public policy programs), but too many and due to the language barrier, class discussion suffers.

    • Alex Dương

      Ironically, you dismiss “the Ivy League” while praising three Ivy League schools.

      • x1sfg

        That’s not irony, and I think you should reread what I wrote. I said that Harvard, Yale, and Princeton are the Ivy Leagus’s best for undergrad. Nowhere did I praise the schools, other than maybe HBS, and if anything, I said that there are many schools that can go head to head with them.

        That said, at least the three schools, despite having old name prestige, still have world class faculty and alumni connections.

        This coming from someone who went to some state school for undergrad then had the government pay for my MBA at some Ivy League school in Mass, the brand whoring thing is just stupid. It happens here too in certain sectors, specifically consulting and in finance, but China and Korea take it to another level.

        • Alex Dương

          My mistake, I thought “their” in “their best undergrad programs” referred to U.S. schools as a whole.

          I went to “some state school for undergrad” too. I’ve no connection to any of the schools you’ve mentioned by name. I agree that there is a strong element of “brand whoring” in China when it comes to schools, but I think it’s more than just “it happens here too in certain sectors.” Columbia, for example, has a 7% undergraduate acceptance rate. I don’t think you can attribute that mostly to Chinese international students.

  • Foreign Devil

    University of Toronto accounting Major is also 80% Chinese. It’s one of the few courses where you don’t need good english to pass. . just work with numbers

  • YourSupremeCommander

    When they announced the names of the graduates: I am certain it was a 2 hour long torture of CHING CHANG CHONG WONG CHENG… My goodness.

  • Chinasmack you have become so boring.

  • Alex Dương

    I think your perspective is different from Jahar’s. Jahar’s comment sounds like he doesn’t know the difference between descriptive and inferential statistics, and he thinks Chinese people are paying tens of thousands of dollars to spend two years learning how to take AVERAGE= in Excel.

    You sound like you’re saying that Americans have no need to do a MSc in Stats from expensive private schools like Columbia. I agree. But let’s take a look at the alternatives Americans have and see whether they apply to Chinese:

    1. “Funded Master’s” – Unlike PhD programs, most Master’s programs aren’t funded. Any funding is scarce and competitively allocated. I wouldn’t tell Americans to bank on this, not because they’re American but because to the extent funding exists, it is awarded on a competitive basis. It’s not guaranteed.

    2. “Lower cost Master’s” – I’d bet this is because of in-state tuition. Doesn’t apply to international students.

    3. “Enter PhD program, drop out” – Chinese students could do this too, but whereas American students can just go to work fairly easily after leaving, it’s harder for Chinese students due to immigration rules.

    4. “Start working after BS” – Maybe if these Chinese students did their undergraduate degrees at U.S. universities, but if they did them back home, this also doesn’t really apply to them.

    So some of these reasons don’t apply to Chinese international students. Given that to be case, is it a surprise that they pay for MSc’s in these areas?

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