[Original Chinese Text]
昨天下午，清华大学校长顾秉林先生在接受学生记者采访的时候，表达了他对现在大学教育状况的担心，他表示，说得直白一点，现行的大学教育制度就是“在往学生们的脑子里灌屎 ”。
顾 秉林校长表示，在二十世纪初至40年代，可以说是中国教育界的黄金时期，在这段时间以内中国的大学为社会培养出了大批的优秀人才，他们中有伟大的思想家、 教育家，有革命 义士、抗日英雄，有科学骨干、民族精英。而这种盛况自从解放后尤其是九十年代开始衰落。现在的各高校，包括清华与北大在内，已经没有将培养人才作为大学教 育的目标。严重的 学术腐败，枯燥且与社会脱节的课程，死记硬背的教育方式，将导致学生们的思想僵化，对课程失去兴趣，对大学乃至整个中国的教育失去信心，退学正是表达他们 对大学教育失望的 最极端方式。
他进一步表示，至少有80％的学生在刚进入大学的时候是酬躇满志，报着努力学习的决心的，可是在四年大学生涯的消磨与侵蚀下，能将这一决心坚持到毕 业的学生恐怕不到20％ 。逃课，考试作弊已经被很多学生当成了家常便饭。上大学的目的由最初的学习知识变成了纯粹的混文凭。而那些在恶劣的环境下坚持认真学习的学生，他们的学习 能力和创新能力却 正在被逐渐磨灭。若这种情况持续下去，大学最终培养出来的成品，将是一具具没有灵魂的行尸走肉。
“如果一直这样下去，20年后，中国大学生的思想状态和精神水平将会是什么样子？我简直不敢想象！”
古板的教学方式和教材让社会丢失了许多的达芬奇，比尔盖茨。对于这样损失,我们是否要反省下呢？在这样的教育模式之下，学生们的精神受到极大的伤害，创造性和独立思考能力 受到无可挽回的扼杀，中国至今没有诺贝尔奖获得者，与这种教育模式有很大的关系。
以下是顾秉林先生的原话：
作为一个大学校长，我认为真正的高校应该培养学生的独立技能、独特的思考方式和敢于权威挑战的精神。
1、什么是独立的技能？
不是拘泥于课本上的，如果你对某东西有深入研究，可以考虑研究成果作为成绩。我们要鼓励和发扬这样的模式，因为市场和学生需要这样的鼓励！
2、什么是独特的思考方式？
独 特的思考方式不代表爆炸式的思考，而是多种寻根问底的思想，抓住一条线一直往前摸，有这样的科学精神，这条线一定能通往诺贝尔。独特的思考方式是在不断学 习的过程中产生 的，学生得注意研究的方式、研究的目的以及合理性。当然，诺贝尔奖不应该成为教育的最终目标，教育的最终目标是为社会培养以及输送人才，但是这毕竟是国际 上对最顶尖人才认 可的标志。
3、什么是敢于挑战权威？
这个相信学生们都了解，羽毛和石头哪个能先着地？
这个是众人皆知的，为什么那个时候全世界只有1个人提出了不相同的结论并用 事实证明了？原因就是权威的威慑。教授：这个名词是一个长辈的名词，我不介意别人叫我同学，叫我 兄弟，或者学生。因为弟子不必不如师，师不必贤于弟子，闻道有先后，术业有专攻。你研究的成果比老是的好,你就是老师,我可以为一个同学 “无聊”的问题而停下上课,动员大家参与这个问题的讨论，原因为什么?这个问题的隔壁很可能就是诺贝尔奖……
当然，以上的能力，在中国现行的教育体制下，是不可能被赋予学生的。所以顾秉林先生表示，中国的高等教育体制改革势在必行，“应该停止再扼杀人才 了！应该停止再向学生们的 脑子里灌屎了！”当然，改革会涉及很多未知的因素，以及牵扯很多人的利益，势必受到极大的阻力，可是为了学生以及中国的未来着想，这些阻力都必须被克服。
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Some of my Chinese friends have this problem well assessed.
School in general gives the paper…the paper represents submission, not ability or intelligence…and most definitely not knowledge or critical thought process.
Chinese school is all that to the 5th exponent plus singular curriculum, minus individual expression and questions (questions are frowned upon, afterall if your teacher was any good, you’d understand right? therefore you question is an insult to the teacher).
All I want to know is this:
During the cultural revolution, all the educated, literate, artistic people were killed, fled, or sent into the countryside. Then the peasants became the leadership of the education systems, though many of them had little or no education.
This is the generation that is now leading the 80’s generation. So how is it that one person in China can have a “real” education? You know at UCLA Chinese are the most hated students on campus because they are notorious for cheating and stealing text books necessary for all students.
How can we expect any Chinese to really be an intellectual? 1.3 billion people and not one Nobel Prize should not be a surprise to anyone.
Those comments sound like a criticism of the educational system here in the United States. Very well said… too bad it wasn’t the actual words of the school president… that would have been amazing.
Maybe it was the president’s actual words and they’re just trying to cover it up.
Gaoshan, everything is relative. We can all say the same things but the degree is FAR different. Gotta witness it to understand.
My ex GF was a Canadian (canadian born Chinese)…and went to UofT.
She used to tell me of the cheating circles and the systems used etc…
It’s an institution! A tradition!
Once I came to China, I taught at a Uni in central China. One of the best english students became my friend, and after I had moved he told me with great pride that he now rode a scooter and had some money because he was going into the exam hall and writing english Band4 for rich kids.
This was all considered normal.
you did put it on, that’s great. anyway, i believe it’s an interesting topic……love you ^_^
one quotation from KDS
“first I thought finally China has hope, but now I see it’s just a pathetic dream”
Not really. My overwhelming college education in USTC(University of Science and Tech. of China) gave me the ability to beat everyone in a graduate school in the states. Hard training in Math/Physics/CS is good for students pursuing a tenure track profession.
I agree that Chinese students, in general, do well academically and certainly can outperform the average American or (insert many nations here) when it comes to exams.
Their hindrance, I find, comes when turning theory to practical or being given a task that requires some creativity…some innovation or problem solving skill. Also, in team efforts, I find that there is a general lack of ability to work well together. My coworkers agree that they are taught to memorize, not understand. The problem with this type of education is that, well, it can certainly do well on exams – it doesn’t help solve [the unknown]…which is what the principal mentions (indirectly) as the representation of applied intellect.
Americans are better at Lateral Thinking than Chinese….but Chinese are definetly better at (1) Exams (2) Cheating
Surely memorizing takes a huge part of our education, however, creativity is also put on a high priority in the system while HARDWORKING is the main contributing factor to creativity. You can’t deny exams and equivalents’ importance to measure how creative a student is. Let’s look at the outcome:
As reported by Science journal, students from Tsinghua and Beida are top two universities who earn most Ph.D. degrees in US grad schools, even more than domestic universities like UC Berkeley.
http://www.courant.com/news/opinion/editorials/hc-science.artaug12,0,852368.story
Never mention that US engineering schools are dominated by Chinese professors and students (together with Indians). These who got Ph.D. degrees and tenure are not creative? I don’t think so.
What China is lack of now are leaders who can run management in international companies. However, China has only opened up for 30 years and time will change everything.
@USTCer
RE: “while HARDWORKING is the main contributing factor to creativity”
I disagree completely with this statement. In fact, while “hard working” is an admirable quality and one to which I think the majority of the world must subscribe (they make good employees), the best leaders work smarter – not harder. The most successful people in the world combine these two factors, and work both smarter, and harder…creating a success-juggernaut when compared to the average joe. Creativity, on the other hand, does not equate to success. A creative person may not need to work much at all – and work sporadically based on inspiration. I don’t believe you “work hard” to create a beautiful symphony or come up with a new concept in housing design to allow trees to form into structures preventing natural disaster damage as well as promoting clean environment (plantware.org, ‘grow’ a house out of trees), in fact, I believe it’s more play than work, and more based on self-discovered inspiration than grinding away to “push” something out.
RE: “These who got Ph.D. degrees and tenure are not creative? I don’t think so.”
I do not think that earning a PhD nor gaining tenure represent creativity OR problem solving. Especially in vocations such as engineering, as you mentioned. Not to say these people are NOT creative, just that it is not a prerequisite to earning a degree. Earning academic credentials is less about being creative or one’s ability to problem solve, and more about being willing to invest the time necessary to get there. “Those that can’t do, teach”.
All that being said, I agree with your facts that the top universities in China produce the most PhD students in US or probably many other nation’s schools. That’s fantastic, and shows the determination of the Chinese students to reach a peak academic career. I believe that all people, ethnically, are quite equal – genetically – and that ethnic Chinese will likely produce the (on average) best of any particular field given time. After all, the majority of the world’s population is ethnic Chinese…it’s simply a mathematical probability and social structure that will create such an outcome based on my belief in equality, yeah?
On hardworking:
As said by Thomas Edison, great inventor and arguably the most creative person in American history, “Genius is one percent inspiration and ninety-nine percent perspiration.” A beautiful symphony can’t be created without hard working. Take Beethoven as an example. He lost his hearing when he was 26 years old. The illusion in his head made him hard to perceive and appreciate music. However, his resolution and consistent hard working helped him overcome all these difficulties. I didn’t say hard working is the only thing needed for innovation. What I meant is, without hard working, 99% of wonderful ideas can’t be realized, because nothing is perfectly laid out on the road to success.
“just that it is not a prerequisite to earning a degree”.
Creativity may not be a prerequisite for master degree, but it’s definitely a requirement for Ph.D. degree. Graduate committee’s decision is largely based on how original a candidate’s work is and how potential the idea can bring breakthrough to future research. In case of professorship, persistent creativity is even more important. This is especially the case in top universities. Only willing to invest time to the field is not enough, a professor has to show how much his research has already contribute to the community.
“After all, the majority of the world’s population is ethnic Chinese…it’s simply a mathematical probability and social structure that will create such an outcome based on my belief in equality, yeah?”
Population doesn’t tell the whole story. Don’t forget we have 60% people as farmers in China’s backwater part. Many of their children don’t see a computer until high school. However, this doesn’t stop them from be admitted by top CS schools in US, like Stanford and CMU. Microsoft’s vice president Zhang Yaqin, also a USTC alumni, is a good example. It is Chinese students’ much harder working than American kids that makes them on the same stage where they can show creativity.
Here’s what Tesla said about Edison:
He had no hobby, cared for no sort of amusement of any kind and lived in utter disregard of the most elementary rules of hygiene … His method was inefficient in the extreme, for an immense ground had to be covered to get anything at all unless blind chance intervened and, at first, I was almost a sorry witness of his doings, knowing that just a little theory and calculation would have saved him 90 percent of the labor.
@USTCer
I think that your understanding of “hard working” and mine are different. In my understanding of the term, hard working is not related to creativity. For example, some very respectable and hard working men may have complete lack of creativity – and work in a robotic production line for 14 hours a day – repeating the same task..over..and over..and over..nobody can deny the hard work, but there certainly is no creativity. I believe that, not through genetics (as is made clear in that many who have spent a long time overseas, or grew up overseas, but are ethnically Chinese have proven) that through the style of education and social environment, creativity is far greater overseas than in the mainland PRC. If you disagree, that’s your right – however, while China flaunts invention of paper, gunpowder, and clocks over the last five thousand years, pretty much everything you use daily was invented in western europe/north america…in the last hundred. Again – it’s not a racial issue, it’s a social one. I simply do not believe growing up in this society promotes creativity. I lead and train a team of business analysts, a job which – believe it or not – requires a very strong combination of analysis and creativity. I find that my local team…even though they are the most intelligent students from the hundreds of applicants tested, out of thousands of resumes submitted, have trouble when it comes to thinking outside of the box. In addition, just out of curiosity, I picked a school you mentioned – Stanford – and checked their faculty claims….not so many Mandarin names on these lists, eh? They even have an ethnic breakdown by percentage.
http://www.stanford.edu/about/facts/faculty.html
Regardless. My whole point here is that it’s not a genetic issue, it’s a social/education issue, and while I agree that Chinese students are generally *VERY* hard working, and it shows in their exam scores, there are significant problems when it comes to coming up with unique solutions to problems, or competing in the real world. If there truly were the top creative and intelligent thinkers coming out of Tsinghua I’d totally expect to see some of those alumni on some Nobel tickets. It will happen…..it just isn’t happening with the current education system.
Wasn’t there a movie recently about some Chinese guy in the States who flipped out and killed a bunch of people? I don’t remember the specifics but I think the guy was a genius but had some personality flaws that eventually led to the tragedy. I think somewhere in there was a story of how his teacher wasn’t happy that the guy was smarter than him or something.
The movie is call “Dark matter”. and you are right about the plot. The kid was __too creative__!!! his theory that the universe is not empty – those things we can not see doesn’t mean they are not there – they are dark matters.
>work in a robotic production line for 14 hours a day – repeating the same task..over..and over..and over..nobody can deny the hard work, but there certainly is no creativity
There can be creativity, only if he thinks hard. Check this story of a man with only middle school education. (Chinese)
http://news.xinhuanet.com/politics/2006-11/01/content_5274609.htm
>checked their faculty claims….not so many Mandarin names on these lists, eh?
Emm, that’s not a list of faculty but Nobel prize winner. There were 6 ethnic Chinese who have won Nobel, as far as I know, two of them (C.N.Yang and Z.D.Li) got their college education from Southwestern United University (a refugee university in Kunming where TsingHua and Beida flee to in WWII). We did have some Nobel level works in 60s and 70s such as independent Quark theory, Yuan Longping’s hybrid rice (which help the world feed thousands of millions more people) and first insulin molecular made in laboratory (unfortunately due to lack of IP awareness, it’s not trademarked). However, due to the China-western tension in cold war, these great works couldn’t get recognized by the west. If you check Nobel Prize’s history, there was generally a 10 to 20 year or even longer delay between the person made significant contribution and s/he was awarded Nobel prize, the fact that we don’t have a prize winner in science and tech after 90s doesn’t mean we will not in next decades, given China’s uprising national power in economics and politics. In the field of Mathematics, where no Nobel prize awarded because Nobel’s lover loved a mathematician, we do have some of the first class people.
>I find that my local team…even though they are the most intelligent students from the hundreds of applicants tested, out of thousands of resumes submitted, have trouble when it comes to thinking outside of the box.
I believe it’s due to our lack of experience in international business. In China’s business schools, textbook may be too outdated and lecturers don’t have first hand knowledge. (Tsinghua’s Guanghua management school got better?) Lack of internship experience may be another factor since only few domestic companies go international. But I don’t know since it’s out of my field which is ECE. However, aggressiveness was never lacked in Chinese culture and I hope you can have more patience. Maybe after months some of them will become good enough.
@Kai
Yes, Dark Matter based on a 1991 real story
http://movies.nytimes.com/2008/04/11/movies/11matt.html
Yes, that’s it! Thanks, USTCer. I need to *cough*download*cough* that movie sometime and watch it. I have a feeling it just might piss me off though.
Anyway, I think both you and Rick are right for your respective reasons and definitions. The Thomas Edison quote was one I thought of too as I read through Rick’s comments. To me, creativity is sometimes a flash of unconventional brilliance and sometimes it is having the patience and drive to keep trying different things until something works. The latter certainly has a component of “hard work” (as you define it) in there.
I do think (and hope) that as China opens up and inevitably is cross-pollinated with international influences, Chinese people will overcome traditionally “rigid” thinking patterns, yield their fair share of brilliant people, and get recognized for them. As Rick said, there’s no reason to believe there is any genetic predisposition or limitation against the Chinese in this regard.
Its simply a continuation of the cultural revolution. They used to send smart people to the countryside to make them shut up – or simply kill them. Now they simply don’t allow anyone to become ‘too smart’. Any wonder why our products can never compete with Japanese, Korean, or even Taiwan products? Because we have no idea how to make anything original, and they do. Why? Because of the stupid education system. Why? Because the government is scared of the normal people thinking by themselves. China has no hope.
China has hope.
“He further indicated that some 80% of the student first entering college are full of will and determination to study diligently, but under the the grinding and corrosion of their four year university career, he is afraid not even 20% can maintain this determination up until graduation. Skipping class, cheating on tests are already regarded by many students as par for the course. The original goal and motivation for going to college to gain knowledge becomes purely just get a diploma. Moreover, those students who try their best and take their studies seriously, their learning abilities and creativity are actually being obliterated. their learning capability and innovation ability are actually gradually being destroyed. If this kind of situation continues, the university’s ultimate finished product will be soul-less zombies.”
Well, what do you think happened everywhere else in the world once people became whores for material succes? This could be said of any higher school or university in any of the European or North American countries. It could be said of the people in any western country. But this has nothing to do with four measly years of study. In the west a BA alone is useless, MA is a minimum, four years is nothing if it has a point. No, the corrosion of morals, discipline and mind has to do with the students expectations. In these four years they find out why exactly it is they want to study. It is not to better themselves, it is to get a piece of the pie, and this is where it all goes wrong. Why? Because they nolonger adhere to traditional values. Because nothing matters anymore. Because capitalism is empty, its rewards are empty, the chase must be mindless or it cannot exist. You wanna be like the west? Well, here is a taste of it, enjoy ;)
I studied at Tsinghua University for a year last year, not as one of the many foreign language students, but as a normal student (I studied Journalism… I know…).
I went to class pretty much every day during the first semester, but as time moved on, I became less and less interested in what was being taught to me. There were almost no interesting subjects being taught, and even if we did get an interesting assignment, professors would encourage us to go about it in the same way as the examples they would give us; essentially telling us to copy what was being said in those examples.
During my midterms, I had one open book exam: I didn’t read the book, didn’t open the book, didn’t even bring the book to the actual exam, and guess what: I got 100%! This made me realize that I would learn more about journalism on my own, so I went and visited my sister in Thailand for a couple of months.
So I missed all my exams of that term, and guess what: when I got back from Thailand a couple months later, I actually got 80, 70 and 60% for some of my courses, even though I left halfway through the first term!
I studied journalism, but never once was I encouraged to go out and write something, I was never asked to come up with my own ideas for articles, and I was certainly never encouraged to be critical about anything. Moreover, I passed most of my classes without bothering to show up for the exam…
So yeah, I agree that Chinese universities are lacking in practically every department. A lot of it comes with the retarded entrance exam system, I think: pass your entrance exam and you are almost sure of getting a degree four, five years later. The only evaluation of the student’s capabilities is all the way in the beginning. If he can get through the entrance exam, why should he not get through the rest of if, right?
Back home in Belgium, we had exams every six months, exams that really tested us and forced us to study huge amounts of data in a relatively short amount of time. We were also made clear that knowing the whole course by heart would only get you 60% of the points; we had to UNDERSTAND the contents and be able to make connections between different chapters (or courses) to be able to get anything above 60% grades.
So, yeah, I agree with what this (hacked or not) article says.
All depends on the student himself. If he needs the knowledge he gets them.
The lacking of creativity and innovation are mentioned here more than once, I think it should be viewed much deeper. This is what is “seen”. The creativity and innovation in China are no where to be found in the universities, very much true. It is however not so that these people don’t exist. The problem lies that the educational system in China is a general system, a kind of one size fits all principle is upheld. Therefore specialistic needs are to tended to.
The main issue of this is that decision making is never taught within the educational system. It’s a singular path that is laid our for you. If you are good in math, than you should be doing this and that, if you are good in this or that, do this or do that. If you do not excel, no one really cares, and that actually forces you to think and make decisions to become “succesful” in life. A lot of foreign companies do employ many of these people nowadays, because in practice and in interviews they will excel, by showing capabilities, instead of knowledge. Actually this has always been something that seperates Tsinghua students already from other famous universities’ students. Tsinghua students are more decisive and have better eye for opportunities. You can notice this when looking at students that become entrepreneurs within China or abroad. Still much can be improved!!! More “real” incubators please!!~
@fcuk da lu ren
“During the cultural revolution, all the educated, literate, artistic people were killed, fled, or sent into the countryside. ”
Being killed is not the common case, the common case is to be sent to countryside, be humiliated, be treated as criminal etc. Some committed suicide, but it is also not what majority of them choose.
If you think those who were sent to countryside are still there, and mystically disappear from the scene of China since then, you owe yourself some time to read more about the modern history of China, and be sure to choose a good book.
Almost all of them were removed bad tags on them, get back to cities since Deng Xiaoping got power.
Do not make me wrong, I am not making an apology for CCP here. My point is your “wow, since then they all disappeared, and babarians took over.” kind of claim is simply false. Cultural revolution significantly degraded Chinese “educated, literate, artistic people”, but not totally destroyed.