Passersby Ignore Chinese Old Man Beaten to Death in New York

Old Chinese Man Ruan Wenhui beaten to death by Jamie Pugh in East Village Manhattan New York City.

From NetEase:

Elderly Chinese Man Randomly Beaten to Death on New York Street, Multiple Passersby Turn a Blind Eye

According to May 14 reports by media including The Daily Mail and The New York Times, as 68-year-old elderly ethnic Chinese man Ruan Wenhui was walking home alone on the night of May 9th local time, a thug suddenly began beating him without cause, and in the end swaggered away from the scene. What was infuriating was that there were multiple passersby at the time but not a single one reached out to help or call the police, resulting in Ruan Wenhui dying from his injuries on the 10th. After this shocking incident of violence was made public, it incited a storm among the people of New York and especially its ethnic Chinese community.

Attacked on his way home

According to reports, 68-year-old Chinese man Ruan Wenhui lived in New York City’s Manhattan East Village and was an immigrant from China’s Guangdong province, who worked 15 years at a New York garment factory and had just retired four years ago. It is reported that Ruan Wenhui doesn’t know how to speak English and has three daughters. At around 8:43pm on May 9th local time, Ruan Wenhui had as usual taken his grandson back to his daughter’s home, then began walking home alone. What was unexpected was that just as Ruan Wenhui was near his home on Sixth Street near Avenue D in the East Village, he was suddenly and without reason attacked by an African-American thug.

Surveillance footage show that this thug first approached Ruan Wenhui from behind, then began shouting at him. Despite Ruan Wenhui trying to get away from the thug, the latter punched Ruan Huiwen in the stomach, then grabbed the elderly man, and threw him against the wall and pushing him onto the ground. Shockingly, the thug then inhumanly punched and kicked Ruan Wenhui, punching his head, then stomping three times with his foot, without a shred of mercy. In the end, Ruan Wenhui, without an ability to fight back, fell into a pool of his own blood, while the thug did not rob anything from Ruan Wenhui’s body and simply strutted and swaggered away from the scene.

Indifferent passersby turned a blind eye

What was disappointing is that when Ruan Wenhui was being attacked, it wasn’t just them two at the scene — There were multiple pedestrians whopassed by at the time of the incident, yet none of them stepped forward to stop this violent crime, nor did anyone lend a hand to help the elderly man or call the police.

Surveillance footage shows that several people one after another hurriedly walked past Ruan Wenhui’s body but none of them gave assistance. It wasn’t until 6 minutes later that one person finally bent over to check on him. While being interviewed by The New York Times, Ruan Wenhui’s second daughter, 39-year-old Ruan Zhenni (Jenny Ruan) angrily expressed in Chinese: “At the time, so many people passed by, but none of them helped despite seeing someone in need, nor did anyone call the police. Why didn’t they help when it was convenient for them to do so?”

When nearby patrolling police arrived on the scene, they quickly called an ambulance to take Ruan Wenhui, whose face was covered in blood and his breathing feeble, to the hospital for emergency medical attention. However, regrettably, because of excessive injury to Ruan Wenhui’s head, he ultimately died on the 10th despite medical efforts.

During an interview on the 12th, the youngest daughter of the elderly Ruan Wenhui’s three daughters expressed that the family has been in shock and grief since the tragedy occurred, saying: “I can’t believe this is real. Much less that this kind of thing would happen to my father. My dad was a good person. He was always helping others, a smile always on his face. Everyone thought he was the world’s kindest person.”


Comments from NetEase:

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网易山东省青岛市手机网友 ip:182.40.*.*:

Ximen Qing pushed Pan Jinlian against the wall. Wu Dalang saw, and sternly declared: Pan Jinlian is mine, sacred and inviolable. Ximen Qing ripped off Pan Jinlian’s clothes. Wu Dalang sat by the bedside, and strongly criticized: I demand that Ximen Qing face the facts and immediately stop all infringing behavior. Ximen Qing used various [sexual] positions. Wu Dalang once again expressed resolution: To defend Pan Jinliang, I will do whatever it takes… Then Ximen Qing ejaculated…

The reporter asks Wu Dalang: Your wife is being forcibly dominated by Ximen Qing, what do you have to say? Dalang says with a serene look: “Ever since the incident with my wife occurred, I have been closely monitoring the developments. As everyone knows, Jinlian has been my wife since ancient times and I have indisputable sovereignty when it comes to Jinlian. I hope that Mr. Ximen Qing will see clearly the circumstances and, in accordance with generations of friendly bilateral relations, will release my wife as soon as possible and without condition. I advocate setting aside the dispute and us jointly [sharing Pan Jinlian].”

Pan Jinlian was once again taken. Instead of going to rescue her, Wu Dalang instead smashes things at home. A neighbor could not understand: “Wu Dalang, Pan Jinlian has been taken. You should go fight Ximen Qing. What’s the use of smashing things at home?” Wu Dalang: “The things I am smashing at things made by Ximen Qing! Wu Song glared and reached out for the knife on the wall! Wu Dalang grabbed his younger brother’s sleeve: “Brother, actually I have already won!” Wu Song looked at his brother in astonishment. Wu Dalang continued: “in October, Ximen only came to our home 19 times, which is a 19% decrease from last year, and although it is a 22% increase from last month, but the rate of growth is clearly slowing. Yesterday, I was with your sister-in-law [his wife, Pan Jinlian] for only 71 minutes upstairs, which is a 24% decrease from last year, which clearly means she’s afraid of me now.”

[Note: The above is commenting on the Diaoyu Islands dispute and criticizing typical Chinese government responses to using characters from Water Margin and Jin Ping Mei.]

白宫红旗飘飘 [网易广西柳州市三江县网友]:

Sitting here waiting for American running-dogs [pro-US Chinese] to change the subject [or distract from the subject].

网易北京市手机网友 ip:117.136.*.*: (responding to above)

Same here, I bet they’ll say it’s an isolated case.

网易广东省深圳市手机网友 ip:112.97.*.*: (also responding to 白宫红旗飘飘 )

Sitting here waiting for wu mao to have an orgasm and collectively flame/bash.

网易西班牙手机网友(188.77.*.*): (also responding to 白宫红旗飘飘)

Hurry and come out American running dogs! 🐶
While I’m at it, let me say something to those below me preparing to yell at me: If I am a wumao, may my whole family die. If I’m not, may your whole family die. 😊
[This consequence] is very real!

网易辽宁省大连市手机网友 ip:113.234.*.*: (responding to above)

American running dogs wouldn’t read/pay attention to news like this. In the eyes of American running dogs, America is paradise. There is no violence, and freedom everywhere. ^_^ So free you can kill people as you please.

网易广西南宁市手机网友 ip:218.204.*.*: (responding to above)

People can kill people as they please in China too. Just look at the rich and those who are government officials. They can kill a few people, pay some compensation and be done with it. Don’t say it doesn’t happen.

大雨至水天干地湿 [网易江西省南昌市手机网友]: (also responding to 白宫红旗飘飘)

Fuck your mother! America isn’t perfect, but it’s still ten thousand times better than North Korea, and China is only 50 or 100 steps ahead of North Korea. Damn wumao, stupid and ignorant but still thinking so highly of yourselves, don’t come out and embarrass yourselves!

加州大炮哥 [网易美国手机网友]:

There are a lot of human scum in America. When I first came, I was once taking a stroll by myself around Fisherman’s Wharf when suddenly a white homeless person charged up to me and made a very unfriendly gesture and menacing expression. I didn’t understand what he wanted. A white uncle [older man] who worked at an inn nearby ran over and yelled at the homeless man, saying something like: fuck off, next time I will kill you, son of a bitch, fuck you. After the homeless man was sent running, the white uncle told me that I have to be bolder when encountering this kind of scum, that if I appear scared, they will be bolder.

There is scum everywhere, but public safety in America honestly is worse than in mainland China. In mainland China, you can go for a stroll at night in big cities without problems but here, especially in places like New York City or Chicago, it’s best not to go for a walk alone at night.

涅槃鸟 [网易山东省烟台市网友]:

If every corner of the United States was parked full of high-end sports cars N times higher than the cars of locals all purchased and owned by China’s official second generation [children of Chinese government officials], I imagine anti-Chinese sentiment would explode and unable to be checked! Actually, this kind of thing is already happening!

网易陕西省安康市手机网友 ip:221.11.*.*: (responding to above)

So wherever official second generation go, disaster follows?

不默先森 [网易湖南省手机网友]:

Three students chasing and attacking a drunk person on the side of the street cause him to jump into a lake and drown.
Beijing Times 05-15 03:08

网易加拿大网友 ip:142.244.*.*:

The moment I saw that it was an ethnic African, it was no longer strange. There are very few black people who aren’t scum… the same everywhere.

网易北京市朝阳区手机网友 ip:221.218.*.*:

Working in America for 15 years and still not knowing English, going abroad but not willing to integrate into local society, often starting Chinatowns. This kind of people will be treated as outsiders no matter where it is! So the reason for being excluded [discriminated against] includes oneself [one’s own behavior, decisions]!

FL1X3000C [网易天津市网友]:

In America, ethnic Chinese are the lowest when it comes to social hierarchy, where even black devils are one level higher than ethnic Chinese, and the reason is: Ethnic Chinese themselves don’t try to improve themselves, not only when it comes to actively participating in government, but even more when when it comes to actively participating in the military, always trying to keep the peace [avoid further trouble/conflict] when they encounter violence or incidents of injustice, only to be bullied and humiliated. It’s like this in schools and into society, lowering themselves whenever they encounter Westerners [or automatically seeing oneself as inferior to Westerners].

江北一狼 [网易安徽省滁州市网友]:

African black devils are our best friends! Even in Imperialist America, they maintain the closest physical contact with ethnic Chinese!

网易内蒙古网友 ip:1.183.*.*:

However much you make the United States look bad, America is still the world’s boss [most powerful country]; You can criticize the United States government to the point where there is nothing good, and the American government is still elected by the people; No matter how great you make yourself sound, you are still a less developed country; However wise and brilliant you make your leaders sound, they are still not elected by the ordinary common people; No matter how much you praise your human rights, your people still don’t have freedom of speech. (I’m talking about North Korea)


Sigh! ~This is a country’s tragedy! ~Never do we see a laowai being beaten to death by Chinese people, right?! ~But why are Chinese people always being beaten to death by people abroad?! ~From this we can see a country’s weakness, its citizens being bullied and discriminated against wherever they go!~

网易陕西省西安市网友 ip:123.138.*.*: (responding to above)

Ethnic Chinese are Chinese [nationals/citizens]? Ethnic Chinese are American, okay? They pay taxes to America, have American nationality, and ought to be protected under American law. It has fuck all to do with China. There’s even a group of comments above climaxing when actually this has fuck all to do with China.

网易美国手机网友 ip:4.28.*.*:

Yep, black people seem to be very extreme. The good ones are really good. The bad ones are really bad.

网易上海市手机网友 ip:140.206.*.*:

The majority of black people are all shit! Why do I say this? Because they feel they were persecuted too much during America’s black slavery era, so they feel everyone under the sky owes them, and they’re very aggressive/cocky in their speech. You can tell immediately they have no proper upbringing [education, manners].

半鬼人丶 [网易山东省济宁市手机网友]:

Wu mao are going to orgasm [“have a field day with this”]!

梅西赛季场均得分超易建联 [网易广东省广州市手机网友]:

As expected, a black devil.

网易广西南宁市手机网友 ip:180.139.*.*:

Haven’t we been hearing often lately that other than mainland people, people from everywhere else all have good characters?

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  • Zen my Ass

    I’m sorry for the old man, people suck everywhere… but it’s really depressing reading the comments above and notice how some just need news like this to reassure their “non singularity”.

    • donscarletti

      When you have to compare your own society’s level of humanity to that of New York in order to feel not so bad, you know that everything is pretty much out of hand.

  • Sleepy

    The police in NYC will find the perp. Not the last you’ll hear of this case.

  • Americans walk around in fear of everyone…fear of their government. fear of strangers, fear of terrorists, fear of being called a racist, fear of the IRS, fear of getting involved…America is not the same as it once was. Hope and Change didn’t work out as planned

    • YourSupremeCommander

      I fear every time i come here there’s a fong comment staring right in my face, the internet is no longer the same.

    • Alex Dương

      “Fear of getting involved” is a human thing.

      Ever heard of Kitty Genovese?

      With the possible exception of “fear of terrorists,” you’re talking about “good ol’ days” that never existed.

    • donscarletti

      America lost 3,000 (1 in 100,000) people in 2001 then ran around like scared little pussys for an entire decade.

      Compare that to the London Blitz (40,000 civilians dead, 1 in 1,000 British) or even The Troubles (1,800 British and Irish Civilians dead, 1 in 30,000) and you can see that even in comparison to a culturally similar country Americans lack stoicness and ability to cope rationally with loss. Compare that to what happens in Isreal and it’s even more stark. Though I do still somewhat admire Americans for their ability to endure the recurring losses from their somewhat unique gun policy.

      I’ve got to say that while Osama bin Laden really disgraced and discredited Islam with his murdering of civilians, he did succeed in exposing a weaknesses in American society which will continue to have a profound effect for decades to come.

      • random commentor 1

        Wow, you are kinda of an asshole, did you know people who were killed that day doing nothing but going to work. It is not about numbers but simple about dignity and security. Number is easy to manipulate but is someone bombed China in that way an 30 people were killed or hurt you would go apeshit.

        • donscarletti

          I don’t think the vast majority of people who have died in this history of human brutality deserved it. Not the people either in the buildings nor in the planes in 9/11, nor the 150,000 Iraqi civilians that have died since then in the wars of retaliation.

          For an individual, one person is a lot to lose. But for a nation, 3,000 isn’t much, it’s certainly less than the 4,487 young American men who died in Iraq in order to avenge it (and to be honest, soldiers tend to be better spirited than the sort of folks who worked in the WTC anyway).

          So yeah, if America had kept its cool after the really quite moderate civilian death toll of 911, the world would be a better place.

          • Alex Dương

            So yeah, if America had kept its cool after the really quite moderate
            civilian death toll of 911, the world would be a better place.

            “Kept its cool” meaning do nothing or not invading Iraq?

          • donscarletti

            Nobody’s expecting anyone to sit around and do nothing when attacked, least of all such a powerful country. Dealing with the Taliban was 100% justified.

            It’s just instead of even finishing up that war, hunting the Taliban or even finding Osama, America opened up a second front in a completely unrelated country, that was previously led by some semi-secular socialist dictator guy who was largely keeping the terrorists under control in his country.

            Sure, Sadam was a piece of shit and probably deserved to die, but the war was unjustified, badly executed and drained both American resources and the good will of allies that would have been useful in Afghanistan.

            The whole thing just stunk with a giant issue with rage and inability to deal with loss. I think 11 years on it’s even more clear. America was the innocent victim, but then went and made everyone pretty sickened and messed up any chance of compassion and good will.

          • Alex Dương

            Yes, I agree the invasion and war in Iraq was unjustified, unnecessary, and a huge waste of resources. The goal should have just been to get bin Laden.

          • DavidisDawei

            It’s all a magic act.

            Osama was just another “Boogie man” created to take eyes off of what was really going on. The day after 9-11, the powers that be could start pumping trillions of dollars (we don’t have) into programs/pockets that would have never been allowed if not for…..

            Dick Cheney, VP of the USA, was Cheney was chairman and CEO of Halliburton Company from 1995-2000. Haliburton just happened to receive No-Bid contracts in these conflicts in the Middle East. He’s one of many. We have been sliced and diced.

          • Zen my Ass

            I agree all over the line, but you’re opening a can of worms here: to inability to cope with pain and loss requires blind faith and simple answers… People are afraid of the truth, andfthat’s the reason the world is ruled by assholes.

      • Germandude

        You cannot compare the London Blitz with 9/11. England was in war at that time and the population knew too well who is responsible for this and who is the enemy. At 9/11, most of the people didn’t know who and what had hit them.

        • That’s right. Compare apples with apples.

      • “America lost 3,000 (1 in 100,000) people in 2001 then ran around like scared little pussys for an entire decade.”

        Calm down. Americans signed up in droves to fight a war (whatever you think of that is separate and I’m not interested). Everyone else went back to their lives.

        “Though I do still somewhat admire Americans for their ability to endure the recurring losses from their somewhat unique gun policy.”

        Guns save hundreds of thousands of lives and prevent hundreds of thousands of violent crimes every year in America, but you don’t care. Guns are scary and bad.

        “So yeah, if America had kept its cool after the really quite moderate civilian death toll of 911, the world would be a better place.”

        I hope you understand 911 was about larger forces in the world and not just numbers.

        • Germandude

          Guns save hundreds of thousands of lives and prevent hundreds of thousands of violent crimes every year in America, but you don’t care. Guns are scary and bad.

          I see. Now how to argue on this? If what you say was right, that guns reduce crime rates, how would you argue that Europe, with far stricter gun laws and far fewer guns in circulation, is much much safer than the US?

          And if you say that guns actually save lives by the hundreds of thousands, considering that Americans came from all over the world to the new continent, what exactly happened when the settlers disembarked the ships? Did they leave their brains on board and decided: “Let’s go fully mental on this place”?

          You are right, guns are scary and bad. But more frightening than guns is ignorance, a lack of intelligence and huge issues with education that makes people buying into the shit that guns prevent crimes.

          • “I see. Now how to argue on this? If what you say was right, that guns reduce crime rates, how would you argue that Europe, with far stricter gun laws and far fewer guns in circulation, is much much safer than the US?”

            Quite simply, Europe doesn’t have the gang/thug culture of America. I’m well aware that it exists, just not on the same level. But it’s primarily a cultural difference. America is losing it’s ideals of responsible manhood. Boys used to bring rifles to school for PE class and store them in the lockers. If they misused their gun dad would whoop their ass. This culture is gone. In fact it’s mocked as “1950s America” as if there’s something inherently wrong with that. My girlfriend from Norway used to argue with me for hours about guns in America. After reading up on it in the Norwegian media, she had to concede that Norway’s gun laws are actually much looser than many American states. And Norway has a higher rate of gun ownership per capita than the US. Don’t hear much about that “problem” though. What’s so frustrating about gun control advocacy is that’s so hysterical and misses the point so badly. It’s not guns. Guns are just tools. It’s the culture.

            “And if you say that guns actually save lives by the hundreds of thousands, considering that Americans came from all over the world to the new continent, what exactly happened when the settlers disembarked the ships? Did they leave their brains on board and decided: “Let’s go fully mental on this place”?”

            You’ll have to elaborate because I don’t follow your point.

            “You are right, guns are scary and bad. But more frightening than guns is ignorance, a lack of intelligence and huge issues with education that makes people buying into the shit that guns prevent crimes.”

            Given how fast you replied I doubt you had a chance to see the links I included. If you are actually interested in some answers to your point, have a read.

          • Germandude

            Europe doesn’t have the gang/thug culture of America.

            That’s right. Europe has however, social welfare and social security and people will think twice risking this for becoming a criminal.

            My girlfriend from Norway used to argue with me for hours about guns in America. After reading up on it in the Norwegian media, she had to concede that Norway’s gun laws are actually much looser than many American states. And Norway has a higher rate of gun ownership per capita than the US

            Well, fair enough. Have you ever been to Norway to visit your girlfriend’s family? Actually, ask your girlfriend some more info about Norway, such as:

            1. How many square miles of land does Norway contain?

            2. How many inhabitants does Norway have?

            3. What’s the population density of Norway compared to that of the US?

            4. How big is the average wealth of a Norwegian and what is the gap between the richest 10% and the poorest 10%?

            Then you might want to talk about education, social systems and cultural aspects of Norway and I am pretty sure, you will understand.

            “And if you say that guns actually save lives by the hundreds of thousands, considering that Americans came from all over the world to the new continent, what exactly happened when the settlers disembarked the ships? Did they leave their brains on board and decided: “Let’s go fully mental on this place”?”

            You’ll have to elaborate because I don’t follow your point.

            My point is: Americans obviously have European/Asian/African/Mexican ancestors somewhere in their family roots.
            If you say that “guns for everyone” is “saving lives by the hundreds of thousands”, how come that in the older world, your ancestors didn’t need guns to prevent everyone to kill each other like mentals?

            You are right, I didn’t read your links before, did so now. What I would argue is: Don’t fall for propaganda that is tellign you, Chris, that guns are making your country a safer place. If a government relies on private persons to protect their own property, I doubt that it has the strength to actually figure what the real crime numbers are. Not to mention the lobbying of the guys collecting the cash on selling you those guns.

            Come back to me when US crime rates are on a scale with the “rest” of the developed world. Until then, don’t try to even sound smart on suggesting that guns are a solution to crime problems. I assume we both are too old for that.

            PS: please excuse my harsh words, not meant personally

          • Yes, I’ve been to Norway to visit. The answers to all the questions you asked only further my point. The problem is culture. The American social fabric is being torn apart and ever smaller and smaller groups are atomizing into their own worlds. What has been one of the biggest contributors to that? It rhymes with Belfare. (Why doesn’t this produce the same result in Europe you ask? Europeans are generally more socially cohesive and docile I’d say. There’s more to it and I could be wrong.)

            “how come that in the older world, your ancestors didn’t need guns to prevent everyone to kill each other like mentals?”

            They used knives and clubs in the many many European wars throughout the centuries? I don’t know. It could also be that their criminal justice systems were much harsher so the deterrent to violent crime was stronger.

            “Don’t fall for propaganda that is tellign you, Chris, that guns are making your country a safer place.”

            Many sources of many ideological stripes have accepted that in the last few decades violent crime involving firearms has gone down, while gun ownership has gone up. I think it’s safe to say this is a fact. Accept it or don’t. I’m not arguing perfection. I don’t believe in it. I’m arguing improvement.

            In some ways, given US demography, America doesn’t have a country that you can compare it against. So the “get back to me when you join the rest of the developed world” rings hollow.

          • xiaode

            Here is sth. for you to google – keywords: “child, mistaken, shoot, toy gun” -> you will find hundreds or even thousands of reports from the US how parents / cops / strangers shot (in self defense!) a child because they were playing with toy-guns! (all topped – in my eyes – by a incident with a 3 year old girl shot because she was playing with pink toy gun!)
            You hardly will find cases like that in the German news (keywords: “Kind, erschossen, Spielzeugpistole, aus versehen”) – if so, it´s usually a report about something that happened in the US.
            Why? Because in Germany no-one would even get the fucked up idea that a small child with a gun in his/her hands is actually a serious thread and this gun could actually be real, because guns are not common in Germany.

            Go tell these parents how safe their family is because they have guns…

            But… I think under special conditions I would agree that having a gun.. or better: a weapon… could make someone feel more safe! But then everyone have to take this seriously! Don´t get a small pocket-pistol… shit like that… if… you have to go for a real defense weapon.. take a mini-gun… everything below 3000 rounds / min really sucks! Or a rocket launcher… better with some guided missiles… if some guys are shooting at you from inside their car, you have to be sure that you can blow up the whole vehicle at once!

            Maybe everyone should get a tank directly, that would be better. The US would be such a save place if everyone could get himself a M1A1… (although everyone knows the German Leopard 2 would be a better choice… but.. you can´t have everything…)

          • You mention Germany and your name is Xiaode, the de I’ll assume refers to Deguo. Forgive me if I’m wrong but I’ll assume you are German.

            Let me put it to you like this. I’ll bet you roll your eyes and facepalm yourself when anyone starts speaking broadly about Germany in terms of Nazism and making very inaccurate conclusions about German society based on a caricature understanding of the Nazis. To you, all this signals is how small their thinking is.

            Americans have a similar reaction when you start lecturing us about gun related accidents.

          • xiaode

            Right, I am German.

            Wrong! If someone complain that in Germany we still have problems with fascism, with too many people still believing in these Nazi-ideology (bullshit) I would strongly agree! I am not defending my country or my countrymen if someone talks about facts.

            Facts are: there are about 11000 homicides (that´s about 3,5x 911 to put it in that way; and homicides are not incl. the above mentioned accidentally killed ones) with guns involved in the US and about 50-70 in my country (annually)!

          • “Wrong! If someone complain that in Germany we still have problems with fascism, with too many people still believing in these Nazi-ideology (bullshit) I would strongly agree! I am not defending my country or my countrymen if someone talks about facts.”

            That’s not quite what I was saying, but it’s not important.

            “Facts are: there are about 11000 homicides (that´s about 3,5x 911 to put it in that way; and homicides are not incl. the above mentioned accidentally killed ones) with guns involved in the US and about 50-70 in my country (annually)!”

            Yes, those are the facts. Now let’s contextualize them. I guess you got the 11,000 figure from the Center for Disease Control report of 2011 which gives the figure 11,101. Page 19 is the relevant one:

            The National Gang Center gives a figure of 1,824 gang related homicides for 2011 but says the number is hard to judge because of different measurements of what ‘gang related’ means.

            I saw a figure of over 8,000 but let’s just say 2,000. That gives us 9,276 non gang related gun murders. Not to trivialize those murders but it’s 0.00289% of the US population. The vast majority of these homicides take place in a handful of urban areas (mostly with the toughest gun laws in the country). Not exactly the biggest threat you could face in the US.

            As I mentioned to others, Europe does not have the gang problem of the US, many of whose ranks come from South America, Africa and Asia.

            I don’t see the use in comparing countries like America and Germany here because their demography is uncomparable.

        • Zappa Frank

          Too bad Ruan Wenhui wasn’t packing. A nice old man would still be alive and we’d have one less human stain on the Earth.

          if he was packing one wouldn’t be reasonable to suppose the aggressor as well would had one?

          • “if he was packing one wouldn’t be reasonable to suppose the aggressor as well would had one?”

            Not necessarily. But given the reality of some New York neighborhoods it’s probably safer to assume so.

          • Zappa Frank

            but my point, maybe obvious and maybe you already argued about, but for me is still hard to get an rational answer on this point…. is if weapons are easy to get than if the defender has a gun isn’t reasonable to assume that the offender has a gun too or maybe even a rifle? In an assault the outcome would likely be the same, and if with bare hand is likely to survive (not for this poor old man) in a gun conflict is almost sure that someone would die.. not talking about the many accident related with the possession of weapons (some statistics say they kill more family members than else)..

          • Yes, it’s reasonable to assume that. I hesitate to say how any assault situation would turn out because each one is unique. It’s no guarantee that someone will die. Deterrence is quite powerful, and when a criminal knows you are armed it’s quite a powerful deterrent. You could, for example, go to one of the many self defense classes offered in cities across the US by police officers or former military personnel. People with lots of training. You can learn how to properly handle a firearm during an attack and learn how to diffuse a situation by merely making it known you are armed. Most gun owners know what they are doing. They train and practice. Yes, there are tragic accidents, but far fewer people kill themselves with guns accidentally than people slip in the shower and die or get hit by a car. Life is risky and it sucks sometimes.

          • Zappa Frank

            yes I understand that, but i’m not so sure about the deterrence effect if both parties are armed..
            if we do not just look at this situation, we have two person that for any reason (even stupid) are in conflict. Now to have or to do not have weapons doesn’t make a big difference in the rate of surviving?
            I agree that weapons are tools, but are tools that kill, than I have really doubts that more weapons would turn down the omicide-rate. Besides someone that would avoid a danger just because have a weapon may be more willing to expose.. is like motorcycles, do not kill, but for a reason or another when you are on them, just because you can you always end up doing something stupid that you wouldn’t do otherwise.. t

          • Ok, everyone has to assess for themselves the risks they take in society. I guess we’ve shared our assessments here and there’s not much else we can say. However, it’s a well established fact that the number of homicides committed with guns in America has been declining for decades even though gun sales are going up. See links above. Cheers.

        • donscarletti

          “Calm down. Americans signed up in droves to fight a war (whatever you
          think of that is separate and I’m not interested). Everyone else went
          back to their lives.”

          No, everyone else went back to lives where getting on a plane required getting groped by theTSA.
          They went back to lives where they were watched 24/7 by various secret agencies (NSA for example).
          They went back to lives where they think that an old man carring a weapon to go down the street sounds like it makes perfect sense.

          As I said, scared little pussies.

    • lacompacida

      Americans should better not go anywhere near Chinatown.

      • Zappa Frank

        else what happen?

    • Irvin

      They didn’t fear the cowboy from toy story though, they voted for him TWICE even though he’s an idiot.

    • DavidisDawei

      Fear is a huge (de-) motivator Fred!
      I suspect most people are motivated by Greed, Fear, Lust and/or Hubris –

  • Marcus Black

    Again one negro ruins it for the negroid race. Obviously the Chinese will instantly blame all black people for this. Because we are all just violent savages. Actually I don’t blame you China. I blame this negro monkey and the likes of him. I actually do agree that most black people are savages that behave like monkeys. Actually calling them monkeys is an insult to monkeys. Seems there is no light, no hope for the negroid race. I’ve never really had issue with Chinese people I come across though. Even in China people were nice to me. Maybe it’s the way I act or the fact that I look like a nerd (Sort of am). I personally apologise on behalf of this coon. You probably won’t accept but oh well. At least I tried.

    • YourSupremeCommander

      No, they are nice to you because you look like Patrick Ewing, them Chinese people love them NBA stars.

      • Guest


    • Surfeit

      Your racial slurs are vulgar.

    • Sean Van Cura

      Race is a social construct you moron.

      • Race might be a social construct, but calling him a moron, especially given the context, was unnecessary and rude.

      • Guy Fawkes

        He was apologetic to what he has not done and yet you hurl insult to him. Who looks like a moron here? Just saying.

        • Sean Van Cura

          Uh, you need to r-eread and interpret what he wrote again.

    • whuddyasack

      I might be just one person but this Chinese accepts your apology. I know for a fact those Chinese you’ve come across who liked you won’t change just because of this. In fact, I still see the same Chinese students hanging out with their African friends in the international students’ area even after this news. They’re not like me at all haha. What this guy did was despicable but you are not him. Your family is not him. Africans who don’t behave like savages are not him. While it’s true that I’ve often made disparaging remarks on Blacks and feel that as a race they have lower IQ scores and are more violently aggressive than Asians, you shouldn’t take it seriously nor those of the extreme netizens’. I don’t think Blacks are inferior or should be treated worse than others. At the end of the day, if it’s not you just take pride in everyone who does not see you that way. You’ve fought an uphill battle and won.

      Never lose hope. That’s the stuff dreams are made of. Whenever a negative news about China or Chinese pops up, I’d keep hoping for the best for them. Even against all hope. If you want something to change, you’ll always need to believe in your society. That things will get better.

      I know how you’ve been made fun of and all, but I think you’ve shown so much more balls than so many. At least you can admit to a problem and not be defensive about it. It must’ve been really tough to say all those things. If I of all people can accept your apology, rest assured MANY, MANY more will.

    • wnsk

      Your apology means nothing. Being as how you weren’t responsible in any way, shape, or form for this attack. You don’t/can’t represent that black thug inasmuch as he doesn’t/can’t represent you (or other black people.)

      If some Asian thug mugs a black guy, don’t expect me (an Asian) to apologise. Just saying.

  • Irvin

    And this son, is why you should never fuck a black man’s wife.

  • Rick in China

    Tragic. Random acts of violence are one of the most disgusting things people can do – what the fuck is wrong with these guys. Everyone hopes the police catch ’em – but this shit happens too often regardless.

    It’s not surprising several people passed by without helping him – late at night in rough/poor neighbourhoods anywhere people mind their business more-so than in higher end neighbourhoods, but it’s likely out of fear of being jacked themselves rather than fear of being sued by the person needing assistance. I’d be surprised if the guy was attacked out of any racial motivation – probably some drunk fucks just acting out violence for no reason other than being full of hate and fear themselves.

    • Surfeit

      Fuckin A. Full on agree with this post.

    • DavidisDawei

      Yes – the person who was arrested looks young. He acted like an out of control maniac. He was probably having a bad day, was angry and took it out on the Chinese guy (wrong place, wrong time for the Chinese dude).

  • Surfeit

    Poor fella. The commencing drama is a taint on his death though; Those comments really cut down my empathy.

  • The underdevelopment of Dalu’s media has done so much damage to people like the commenters. That’s really what they had to say about the murder? Venting their ridiculous understanding of the US is what they do with this?

    • Kai

      Er, not sure it has anything to do with underdevelopment of media as it is just an example of general ignorance and stupidity. You can see similar comments by American netizens on controversial incidents in China on major American portal sites too.

  • hess

    “Sigh! ~This is a country’s tragedy! ~Never do we see a laowai being beaten to death by Chinese people, right?! ~But why are Chinese people always being beaten to death by people abroad?! ~From this we can see a country’s weakness, its citizens being bullied and discriminated against wherever they go!~” I literally laughed out loud at this one. I had no idea that being beaten to death while abroad was something that happened to most average Zhou’s

    • KamikaziPilot

      While ethnic Chinese are not necessarily beaten to death abroad regularly, I think the poster was trying to make a point that the perception of Chinese being bullied abroad does reflect on how people view China and their strength as a people. I think his post has some truth to it although not a direct correlation. I know at least in the US, surveys have shown that Asian students are bullied at a much higher rate than other races. I’d assume it’s similar in other Western countries but not sure.

      • donscarletti

        I think Chinese get robbed disproportionately often because they like to carry cash and valuables.

        Whites, especially white students these days aren’t worth mugging, $20 in the wallet (they use plastic for buying anything more than a coke), probably a 2 year old entry level Android smartphone unless a tech geek, a couple of books in backpack or completely empty.

        Asian students often have 2-3 weeks worth of cash in wallet, notebook computer and/or tablet in backpack, probably a high range smartphone.

        Who would you mug? Honestly.

        • whuddyasack

          Yes, I agree with all that. It’s much more rewarding to mug an Asian than another race. However, there are other factors involved. One is the obvious physical and behavioral advantage every other group typically has over Asians. While East Asians these days are of normal height, being studious means that they can often be “smaller” everyone else. They’re also encouraged by parents to study hard, and ignore the bullies.

          The other important factor we shouldn’t leave out is communication skills and being in foreign land. This is the most important because most muggers know many Asians have no idea who to call or how to report offenses, with their families and friends overseas.

        • KamikaziPilot

          Basically I agree with whuddy below and I’d also like to add that a dislike of Asians in general may also play a role, albeit a smaller role than other factors. So yes, you’re right in that the biggest role is probably the likelihood of carrying a large amount of cash but I believe another big factor is the perception that Asians are an easier target than others. If I was a mugger and wanted to be as successful as possible I’d probably rob an immigrant Asian. Let’s not also forget that the victim in the story was not robbed, he was just assaulted for apparently no reason. I can only speculate the reasons as mental illness, racism, or some sick thrill like the “knockout game”.

      • whuddyasack

        Yeah, if I recalled statistics stated that 54% of Asian Americans were bullied in school vs around 30% for non-Asians. Online, over 60% of Asians are harassed. It’s definitely similar in Canada where the “You were most likely bullied in school because you’re a wimpy Asian” brand of insult was quite fashionable until recently. The word Ching Chong actually has Canadian roots. From what I know, it’s somewhat similar in Australia too.

        • KamikaziPilot

          I think we read the same study. Also, just from observation, while I grew up with predominately other Asians and Polynesians as schoolmates, with whites actually more likely to be bullied because of their race, I have noticed Asians who live where they’re a minority are definitely more passive and submissive than other races, and therefore more easily bullied.

          • whuddyasack

            I have to agree with you, Asians are more biddable an eager to please than other races. We’re most likely to laugh along with those that abuse us, and my friends who were bullied just could not be made to confront the bullies or report them in fear of retaliation.

            You grew up in Hawaii, didn’t you? If so, I’ve often heard similar things being said. White kids were the most bullied there, and perhaps are the most bullied in places where there are more Black kids. Where I grew up, I never encountered bullies (thankfully), but I know many friends who did. Some of my closest friends were native Canadians and they and their older siblings would often get crap from gangs of white kids who’d pick on them. To be fair, they had their own gangs and I think they usually won, even when outnumbered. I felt more like a cheerleader or bag holder lol. Ahhh those were the days.

            As for the traditional East Asians, mainly Japanese and Chinese, I think they are soft (Korean immigrants and CBKs are actually tough where I studied). A Hmong friend who’s now working told me that he hated the passiveness of his East Asian colleagues and always encouraged them to stand up for themselves. Caring guy haha. Just goes to show that while we are very similar, we can also be very different, hey?

          • KamikaziPilot

            Yes I grew up in Hawaii and a lot of the stories you hear are true, although not much of a problem for the private school rich kids. I myself was bullied in my teenage years but not because of my race. Mainly because I was very recluse due to severe acne. I did attend a predominately white college in a mostly white town where I did encounter many Asians that were nothing like I was used to growing up and how you describe. Kind of like an Asian face but a white personality. When I think back on it, I’m glad I grew up where I did and not somewhere where I’d be made to feel foreign.

            In my schools nobody messed with the polynesians, mainly because most were big kids prone to violence if provoked. Some even protected others from bullies.

          • Zappa Frank

            Surprisingly than according to what you said white guys may get bullied in USA for being white…by Polynesians and Asians? .. now, we can simply deduct that people who look different and are a minority are usually bullied. This happen even inside communities, like the nerd-like guys are more likely to be bullied…

            Still i’m far from understanding what’s the point here.. bully is bad?

          • KamikaziPilot

            Well in my school the whites were bullied mostly by Polynesians and other darker skinned people (for lack of a better word), not asians. There are also many cases of whites being bullied by blacks and hispanics in other schools, especially where whites are the minority in the school, just like asians bullied where they are the minority. True, people are bullied for being different but it’s not that simple. Part of the bullying towards whites was because they were different, part was because there was anti-white racism in my school. Sometimes being different is cool as opposed to hated. For example, if bullying was purely for being different, the far fewer blacks in my school would have been bullied more than whites, but they were not. In fact, they were bullied less than whites and seemed to be more accepted even though they were only a few of them.

            Whuddy and I are both Asians who grew up in Western countries and I was just sharing my experience, which was different than Whuddy’s experience. My experience is kind of unusual (more racism against whites in school, not much against asians) for an Asian growing up in a Western country. Hope you understand what I’m saying.

          • whuddyasack

            Sad. Kids can be cruel. Yeah, the Asians I knew would definitely be considered white personality, actually to be honest I think most Asians from Asia think I fit that bill too. I’m an extrovert while most of them are introverts. But you’re right, I’d hate to be made to feel foreign. That would suck and I make it one of my main goals to never alienate immigrants or people with poor English but try to be understanding of their culture.

            Speaking of the Polynesians, that’s actually very noble and admirable of them. I heard something similar in New Zealand. Big Maori and Islander kids protect the Asian kids in schools from bullies. A bit ironic, but it seems a lot of native communities are very protective of the Asians around them. Makes for an interesting discussion if we think about it.

          • Paulos


        • chucky3176

          Well having grown partly up in Canada, I would say this is correct. I was also bullied mercilessly by 3 or 4 same white boys all year in 8th grade, then 9th grade came along, same boys bullied me every time we crossed paths. They weren’t my classmates, but same schoolmates. The last straw was the last time they made a mistake bullying me, and I took out my jack knife and stabbed one of the fucking pigs in the arm. The sheer look of terror in his eye was pure joy, as I waved the knife at their faces and started screaming “come on you fuckers!!! I going to kill all you fuckers right now!”, like a maniac. They backing off and retreating and I ran towards one of them and fucking stabbed that pig in the arm again, and they all hightailed out of there. They called the cops on me, and I ended up arrested for assault and battery. Before that, I was a straight A-B student with no criminal record or trouble with authorities. But at that time, I was almost going insane with humiliation that they heaped on me for being an Asian. It wasn’t just bullying, it was racial bullying. And I saw many other Asian students getting bullied and teased, it was rampant in our school. The teachers not only did little to stop it, they joined in the teasing. For instance, my nickname in my class was “Rice”, “Kamikaze”, “Slant”, “Bruce Lee”, “Kung Fu”, “Jap”, and my gym teacher would laugh at those names that my classmates were calling me, and would join in. It was fucking disgusting ignorance, don’t believe all the hype that white people are so racially tolerant.

          • whuddyasack

            It’s a small world after all. We learn something new everyday and I don’ know, but it’s nice to see a fellow Asian Canadian on board ;-)

            Having said that, I can’t believe what you went through. Sorry to hear all that, must’ve been very traumatic. Slurs just show low class and poor parenting. That was just insane and to be honest, I’m glad you stabbed those cowardly beasts and made them run. They deserved every minute of it. And that’s the thing about teachers. Often,not only do they rarely do anything about bullying, they are often complicit to it. They’re really walking pieces of putrid freckled garbage.

            don’t believe all the hype that white people are so racially tolerant.

            Whites like to claim Asians are the most racist. Asians are in fact the least racist. Whites are very clannish people, if one of them is caught for a crime, e.g. rape, 1000s of them will swarm to defend said rapist due to racial chauvinism. Tribalism 101, ‘ooga booga we against you’.

            Like most Asians, I used to be very tolerant and accepting, constantly apologizing for my culture’s “intolerance”. Then I and many others began wondering what the hell for? We’re just going to be branded as racists by those with a degenerate mob mentality, our liberal mindsets taken advantage of. Whenever they boast of their tolerance, I just have to laugh. Having said that, I admire the many Asians who toughen their skin and still hold pro-equality views. Not easy I tell you.

          • Zappa Frank

            you don’t have to believe it, is simply true. Or you think would be better for a white or black to grow up in korea? fact is whites people may have many cunts, but still as society are by far more tolerant, even care about all minorities to have an appearance in tv, spots, reserved working positions, social care, reserved places for instructions and so on.. while Asian countries? Come on they don’t even let foreigners to live a stable life there unless they are super rich, and foreigners remain foreigners, concepts like integration are unknown in Asians countries and are largely unknown even among Asians, who usually are extremely closed and clannish, probably the most closed and clannish population in the world.

          • Barack Obama

            i agree with you except for the part about them being clannish. maybe koreans are more clannish because of their smaller population and how throughout history they had to stick together for survival against their two big neighbors. however, i think chinese people are the least clannish, even less clannish than white people, and most are very eager to accept of other races into their circle of friends, blacks or whites.

          • Zappa Frank

            if communities are closed than are consequentially clannish. while the percentage of whites folks i know who doesn’t want to have any black or yellow friend is not that high (almost 0%) I’ve found out many times Chinese try their best to avoid any contact outside their community, preferring to live like in an underworld just among themselves with no real friend outside. But I guess this depends also by the country we are talking about..

          • Barack Obama

            depends on a lot of things. i guess people are more alike than they are different is the main point…

          • linette lee

            I wouldn’t say White people have more tolerance for foreigners. It depends which part of the country. Like I went to Kentucky a small town maybe like 2000 town folks and I swear I was the only Asian person there everywhere I go. Like they were all looking at me very curious as if for the first time they see a Chinese person live. lol.

          • Zappa Frank

            this happens everyday in china to white people. But as said in whites countries minorities are supported in various ways, there are law to protect them… all those things are simply unthinkable in an Asian country. You may have been considered an exotic foreigner in a small Kentucky town, but in Asia whites would be considered foreigner everywhere, with no hope nor chance for an integration.

          • Kai

            Asia has to go through the same history that shaped much of the West. I think integration will become more possible as more white people seek to actually immigrate into Asian countries as Asians have sought to immigrate into Western countries.

          • Zappa Frank

            i’m not sure. In china for instance even to get the working visa is getting harder and harder and a immigration or permanent settling is unlikely in future, unless a complete change in politics that is, franklin speaking, impossible…. although foreigners aren’t so many you can hear everywhere people taking about foreigners and how many we are (ignoring ‘toto coelo’ that just Chinese in Europe for instance are by far more than all the foreigners in china), how we steal job from local people (false, because no one would ever hire a foreigner if could hire a Chinese)…. recently like you may read here on chinasmack there is also who claim Chinese people are on the edge of extinction and therefore shouldn’t mix with other “races”.
            But even more what makes me doubt is that even 混血 like Stefan for instance, are still considered 100% foreigners, as me. They are not considered, Hapa, Eurasian, eurochinese or americhinese or whatever…they are just laowai.

          • Kai

            Right, I’m saying the politics can change if there’s a major change in trends regarding immigration. Greater demand can potentially prompt an increase in supply.

            Attitudes towards “what is ‘Chinese'” can change as the makeup of a society changes. There are still plenty of people who think European countries and the US are “white” despite that they’ve become quite multicultural and multiracial. We should expect worse from far more homogenous countries like China. The question is whether or not attitudes will change if China witnesses and goes through the same changes in makeup that the US or European countries have. Will existing laws barring permanent immigration, residence, naturalization, etc. change because more people want to get in? Will “what is ‘Chinese'” change as Chinese society becomes less homogenous?

            It may not happen in our lifetimes, but it didn’t happen overnight in Western countries either.

          • ScottLoar

            It was a small town in the country, the people likely had never seen an East Asian before, and you described them looking at you “very curious”, not antagonistic, not with hatred, not with fear, but “curious”. Linette, in a small Southern town like Edenton, North Carolina I, a white man from the North, am considered exotic and attract polite attention.

            (I was perhaps 15 when I first saw [well, really noticed] an East Asian girl my own age. I was more than curious. I was powerfully attracted. Shy, not knowing what to do or how to approach her and so I didn’t, but powerfully attracted because she was so beautiful, so desirable. The first time I was intimate with an East Asian girl she and I spent a long while just marvelling at the sight of each other naked after each act; we were “intoxicated” by desire for each other.)

            Without a doubt Korean women have had children of black fathers. I ask, where are those children? I have heard dark things from friends who’ve lived and worked in Korea for a long while (yes,those friends speak Korean).

          • Zappa Frank

            now someone will say you have the yellow fever..

          • ScottLoar

            I’d suggest they look to this happy video to pass the time,


            rather than wait for my reply.

          • mr.wiener

            Actually, thanks for sharing that Scott, I’m a little surprised as you are often a bit…remote, but I can relate completely.

          • Kai

            LoL, that whole second paragraph was TMI. I can never look at you the same way again, reminded forever now of you “marveling at the sight of each other naked after each act, intoxicated by desire”! Romance novelist as a hobby? ;)

          • ScottLoar

            Just the truth and only the truth. Words can’t do that feeling justice and, yes, I’ve been very lucky since.

          • linette lee

            Wow..I never experienced any bullying in high school in USA. But maybe girls have lesser rate of physical assault. They do like to say Chinese girl this and Chinese girl that but then again they go Russian girl this and Spanish girl that to other ethnic group. People need to be more sensitive with their speech when they are living in a multicultural country.

          • Kai

            How did the case resolve? Was there any mitigation due to the racial bullying you surely accused them of?

  • Nilerafter24

    It just had to be a black thug….. Being black just became a bit harder. There’s nothing more sad, more embarrassing than seeing this kind of cowardly attack and how it reflects on our race as a whole.
    Many a time, in the face of the many many many crime, poverty and IQ statistics, I tend to become defensive. But then things like these just prove the racists right.
    I’m beginning to believe it now. I no longer buy into the whole poverty/social factors nonsense. Black people are inferior. This kind of generalization hurts our egos but I think we need to understand it first if black people are going to ever improve on average.
    This kind of cowardly assault and every other kind like this takes us 100 steps back for each good step forward we take.
    It pains me so much to read day in day out news articles and atrocities committed by black people. The tension I feel opening each news article on a terrible crime because I’m scared to confirm the race of the perps.
    And what’s worse is that it’s only getting worse. The world over. smh.
    You try to do good your whole life. Be a model and upstanding person and a few animals like this perp go and ruin it for the rest of us. These kind of people should be forcibly refused from breeding.
    I don’t hate the Chinese comments for the generalizations. I hate to admit it but it seems these kind of generalizations and profiling may save your life.

    • I think I can see what it must take for you to say that and have these thoughts. You and Marcus Black below. Your honest judgement is the best you can do, and that’s worth a lot. Holding on to it is one of the hardest things in life, but you can never forfeit it. It will set you apart and above.

    • christina


      Thank you.
      You are not inferior.
      The racists are not right- racism is not right.
      There is an inordinately large number of crimes committed by black people, but I still think that is a function of “poverty/social factors-” ie receiving inferior educations and growing up in less than ideal home environments- NOT because they themselves are inferior.

      I think we start out equal and those who are able rise to the top- and many black people got the worst of it, falling to the bottom as @Germandude:disqus mentions. Please don’t think you’re inferior- you’re not and you are one of the people making it better for blacks all around.

      • Irvin

        It’s got nothing to do with the color of our skin, it’s more of a cultural thing. It’s like how alot of chinese mothers taught their daughters it’s better to marry a rich man as a 3rd wife than a poor man as his world.

      • DavidisDawei

        I have many nieces & nephews and like all children, they came out as little animals who have needs, wants and very few inhibitions. They would have grown up into big animals if not trained properly over the last few years.
        The destruction of the family unit is linked to many of these problems. Having a Father in the house makes a huge difference in this child’s life, whether you’re white, black, asian, hispanic, et al

      • Phil Ossiferz Stone

        Expanded Homicide Data Table 3
        Murder Offenders
        by Age, Sex, and Race, 2011
        White 4,729
        Black 5,486
        Other 256
        Unknown 4077 (the majority of these being unsolved murders in the inner city, where nobody gonna talk to the po-po)

        Table 43a
        Arrest by Race, 2011
        White 35,443
        Black 45,827
        American Indian or Alaskan Native 619
        Asian or Pacific Islander 547

        Note throughout that for demographic purposes, Hispanics are lumped in with Americans of European descent. When the FBI says ‘White’, they mean Hispanic and Caucasian put together. And yet every cartel member and meth head in the country are still outgunned by black inner-city hoodlums… by a dysfunctional subculture hiding within 13% of our population. Note also if you look at our homicide rate broken down by weapon type, 323 people died to rifle fire in 2011. We lose more people to freaking bee stings.

        Guns aren’t dangerous. Black men aren’t dangerous. Hood rats are dangerous. Fact. You want to save lives? Mobilize the National Guard and station it in South Central LA and Detroit and Chicago and Oakland. Fact. We are facing a cultural phenomenon, not an economic one.

    • donscarletti

      All anyone of any race, colour or creed can really do is distinguish themselves from the scum and encorage others do the same.

      If at the end of the day, someone you meet can say “I really don’t like those people, but I know one who’s really great!”, then that’s already a huge step forward.

    • Irvin

      I feel your pain, but the fact remains that when you’re standing next to a person of a different race you’re representing your whole race, it’s not fair and it’s not right but that’s just how it is, that’s why we should all be on our best behavior when we’re with laowai(s).

      Though racialism is a type of discrimination through profiling but profiling or judging a book by it’s cover isn’t inherently bad, all species were evolved to notice patterns to survive.

      I grow up in the caribbean with majority of the population being indians and blacks. In my experience not all blacks in the caribbean are violent, but when they DO get violent they tend to take their violence very seriously much more than the indians.

    • whuddyasack

      Many a time, in the face of the many many many crime, poverty and IQ
      statistics, I tend to become defensive.

      I’m one of those people that always talks about IQ and crime stats. Though not poverty as I think it truly is disgusting and low to use that to disparage a whole group of people starving to death. I’ll admit that when I first read the news I wasn’t happy. When I saw this article posted on CSmack, I decided to click expecting the worst. But then I saw a comment from a Black person and in the internet where it’s cool to be a jerk, your comments were totally unexpected.

      I felt sad reading this. Yet enlightened. It made me realize that people are individuals after all, and that we can’t judge a book by its cover.

      You are not inferior. You did NOT commit this act. Don’t blame yourself and the millions of Blacks who have nothing to do with this, please. Black people are not inferior, just different and special like everyone else. Anyone who uses the words superior and inferior and obsesses over them are in fact drowning in insecurity and are the “inferior” ones. It’s our pejorative to work together and overcome these issues. Rest assured, your good works DON’T go unnoticed. You’re a good person, a few Black thugs will never change that.

      And so what if Blacks score lower on IQ tests? So what if people put Blacks down and they lack skills and abilities that others have? You have one thing that’s more important than all the money and test scores in the world. You have empathy. You have sympathy. And those are two things so lacking in the world today. Those are the things that make us human, so never feel less because of news like this.

      • Mighty曹


      • christina


        just one thing- I think you mean “prerogative” not pejorative- it looks like a quick typo but just wanted to let you know in case

        • whuddyasack

          Thanks for letting me know, sister ;-)

          I think I’d better fix that. Yes I was in a rush and my mind just went blank. One of those times when you insert a completely different word.

    • mr.wiener

      This guy didn’t beat him to death because he was black and the other guy asian.
      He did it because he was an arsehole.

      • Phil Ossiferz Stone

        Yes he did. Google ‘flash mobs.’ Google ‘knockout game.’ Take off the blinders. We are facing an epidemic of black lynch mobs.

        • Does that mean this was the first Asian guy he’d ever met? Or does he have a track record of beating to death hundreds if not thousands of other Asian guys he was likely to encounter in NYC? Considering it was “because he was black”, does this mean that all black guys have a track record of beating Asian guys to death?

          • Phil Ossiferz Stone
          • What are you trying to prove? That some black people are capable of committing violence? Well here’s a golden star on a job well done, but that’s not what we’re discussing. These people did not commit violence BECAUSE they’re black––if that were the case, ALL black people would be committing violence. You can post all the online news articles you’d like, but unless you have one for each of the world’s roughly one billion black people, you’re not proving anything of relevance to our discussion.

          • Phil Ossiferz Stone

            You… didn’t actually look at any of the source material, did you? Jesus Christ you libtards are impossible.

          • I’ve already read dozens of articles about the “knockout game” viral Internet fad. If there is anything you think I’m unaware of from those articles (two of which are from November of last year and the other from 8 months before that), then by all means feel free to paraphrase, but I’m not going to waste time reading something that I possibly already read half a year ago. Those articles prove absolutely nothing contrary to my point. The fact that you just whined about me not having read your precious Internet articles instead of responding to my actual comment just proves you can provide no rebuttal against what I said.

          • Barack Obama

            what about the argument that they are more likely to commit violence when they’re black? You can’t argue against that can you?

          • People are more likely to drown within days of eating ice cream. Clearly ice cream causes drowning.

          • Barack Obama

            that’s a pretty idiotic comparison.

          • Nope, it illustrates the concept perfectly. The confounding variable between drowning and ice cream is hot weather, and the confounding variable between violence and blacks is a mixture of socioeconomics and––yes––culture. FYI, the countries in the world with the top five highest rates of intentional homicide are all predominantly non-black.

          • Barack Obama

            Unfortunately, genes also play a big part in it. It’s a mixture of socioeconomic background, culture, and genes. Stupid parents have stupid kids, violent parents have violent kids, and, as in your case, ugly parents…

          • I’d appreciate if you could cite a valid scientific study supporting the theory of violence being genetically hereditary within a racial context. Thanks.

            P.S.––Commenting on someone’s looks when you use an anonymous avatar brings to mind this:


            The fact that I’m not even a chick and you’re still commenting on my looks sends my gaydar into alarm mode.

          • Barack Obama

            “FYI, the countries in the world with the top five highest rates of intentional homicide are all predominantly non-black.”

            Nice try.

            UNODC murder rates most recent year
            Southern Africa
            30.5 (rate per 100,000)

            Central America

            Eastern Africa

            Middle Africa

            South America


            Western Africa

            UNODC murder rates most recent year


            17.0 (rate)
            169,105 (count)






            And i’m not going to take my time to cite anything for your thick skull, you can easily look them up yourself. I advise you start with a book by J. Phillipe Rushton. Also you can read a book called the Bell Curve but I think it’ll too much too raw for your prissy ass.

            edit: the data is all messed up. just look it up here:

          • “And i’m not going to take my time to cite anything for your thick skull, you can easily look them up yourself.”

            Translation: “I’ve got nothing.”

            Between your trollish username and cowardly insistence on keeping your comment history private, I should have known better than to dignify you with intelligent discussion.

          • Barack Obama

            Getting a little emotional are we? Your use of ad hominems and your failure to address the statistics i just posted means I win the argument. And like I said, go read the book by Rushton. And could it just be that i don’t care about you enough to take my time to cite research data for you in an argument on chinasmack? WHy don’t YOU cite scientific research paper proving otherwise? No? Translation: “you’ve got nothing.”

            PS. i would just like to add that every research on behavioral patterns and/or intelligence have proved that the single greatest determinant factor is hereditary. If you would just google it and look it up yourself…

          • How do you explain the fact that U.S. crime rates have varied over time, with a sharp rise after World War II, before peaking between the 1970s and early 1990s, and then eventually declining back to approximately 1960s levels? I suppose this can all be explained by the rapid shifting of the proportion of the US population comprised of blacks. Except…it can’t.

          • Barack Obama

            There is a huge logical flaw in your argument right there.
            What is the data for crime rates BY RACE during that period? Instead of just the crime rates as a whole, which tells us nothing at all.
            I believe you realize this but you are just pulling at strings now.

          • Are you saying that blacks changed in the extent to which they were black during that period? Because that would be the only possible explanation to account for the chronological variation within a genetically static population, according to your “heredity>all” logic.

            Something tells me I’m overestimating your ability to follow an intelligent discussion.

          • Barack Obama

            No you nincompoop. You are obviously weak in the logical department and your strategy of arguing by trying to summarize my statements into illogical conclusions that you make up is rather annoying. Like I said before, simply presenting data that shows that crime rates increased is completely inconsequential. It would only be useful if you can look at the crime rates BY RACE during that period.

            Something tells me I’m overestimating your ability to follow an intelligent discussion so I am going to stop arguing with you because you like make shit up and put words into people’s mouth.

          • If you think the single greatest determinant factor in crime is heredity, then the only possible explanation for large shifts in crime rate is large shifts in heredity.

          • Barack Obama

            Another logical mistake. First of all, I never said, “single greatest determinant factor in crime is heredity.”

            With that being said, even if I had said what you again fabricated or twisted for the sake of gaining a pathetic advantage in this debate, it doesn’t make your statement “the only possible explanation for large shifts in crime rate is large shifts in heredity” true,
            even if “the single greatest determinant factor in crime is heredity” because, why are you deleting the other factors?

            Do you understand? yes? no? i don’t really care, i’m gonna stop wasting my time with you on this subject because you will find some other idiotic flawed illogical argument I am sure of it.

          • “i would just like to add that every research on behavioral patterns and/or intelligence have proved that the single greatest determinant factor is hereditary.”

            Perhaps you don’t think crime is a matter of behavior. It’s telling that you’re so offended every time I point out the holes in your logic. At a certain point, you’re going to have to realize that simply deflecting with insults does not constitute a viable argument. If I’ve poked holes in your logic, either rebut that or retreat in silence. Simply calling something an “idiotic flawed illogical argument” does not substitute for actually explaining how it is so.

          • Barack Obama

            I have address all your so-called holes in my logic that you’ve allegedly poked. You have addressed none of mine. Like i said earlier “single greatest determinant factor is hereditary” doesn’t automatically make it the only one, which is what your statement entails.
            I’m not offended by you, you are tedious to argue with, even though your face and your demeanor is pretty offensive.

          • If you wish to negate the relevance of the chronological variability in crime rate as it pertains to genetic heredity on the basis that other less substantial factors could have, in aggregate, been enough to cause it, then fine. Since such data doesn’t exist, neither of us can really make any argument of that. But even negating the relevance of that counter-argument, you’ve still not posted so much as a single peer-reviewed scientific text actually supporting your claim. Is predisposition to violence hereditary? Perhaps. But violence is not the exclusive legacy of black people, and your entire argument about the contemporary disparity of rates of violence amongst different “races” completely ignores the historical context. The past century has been an evolutionarily insignificant blip in time––a mere millisecond on the anthropological clock. We have not been keeping track of crime statistics for hundreds let alone thousands of years, but what we do know is that all civilizations throughout the planet have had legacies of profound violence. This is not debatable, and it completely contradicts the notion that violence is something genetically concentrated amongst black people. All the contemporary black crime does not even begin to compare to the levels of violence occurring in Europe throughout its history up till and including WWII.

          • Barack Obama

            J.Philippe Rushton.

          • David Suzuki
            Zack Cernovsky
            Tim Wise
            C. Loring Brace
            Robert Sussman
            Hermann Helmuth
            William H. Tucker
            Lisa Suzuki
            Joshua Aronson
            Steven Cronshaw

          • Barack Obama

            Albert Einstein
            Sir Isaac Newton
            Leonardo DiCaprio

          • By mocking the concept of listing the names of people whose insights you wish to use to substantiate your own argument, you just invalidated your own comment naming “J.Philippe Rushton.”, which means my prior expansive comment before that remains uncontested. Thanks!

          • Barack Obama

            Another logical failure. You are on a roll today! Thanks!

          • “Simply calling something a “logical failure” does not substitute for actually explaining how it is so.”

            Seriously, this is getting old. I’ve rebutted literally every single point you’ve made, and your counter-argument practically every time has been to denounce it as “illogical” without actually explaining how it is so. I don’t think you understand how debate works. Simply saying “you’re wrong” means diddly squat. My previous comment was completely true, and it will remain so unless you can adequately explain how it is not.

            Your lazy naming of “J.Philippe Rushton” was invalidated by my lazy naming of multiple academics who have rebutted his views. You do not get to make fun of me having named people when you’re the one who initially used this technique as the backbone of your argument in the first place. Get it?

          • Barack Obama

            Would you like the last word?

          • Yes. I apologize for being stupid enough to get dragged into a mudslinging contest with a troll named “Barack Obama” who keeps his comment history private. I should have known better.

            The following statement is by now completely cliché but I will post it for the sake of reminding myself for next time:

            “Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

          • Barack Obama

            Thanks for admitting that you are stupid. All your previous comments are from a stupid person and are thus invalidated. Please write me another long paragraph showing how stupid and illogical you are. Have a good day.

          • I thought you offered me the last word. How ungentlemanly of you. Even a worthless racist troll should still honor his word.

          • Barack Obama

            OK ugly matt

          • Dr Sun

            Wow, you beat the shit out of Barack, now he will have to create yet another profile.

          • Dr Sun

            Neither Albert Einstein or Isaac Newton ever said what you are saying,you really should read before you misquote. I cant say for Dicaprio, but then again I don’t really take Hollywood actors as that serious .

          • Barack Obama

            aw how cute, if it isn’t Dr.Sun, matt’s equally weird butt buddy boyfriend with a strange dog eating fetish to the rescue. it’s a joke stupid, nobody cares enough to look up matt’s long list of names which he randomly found on the internet today and copy and pasted.

          • In 1989, geneticist and media personality David Suzuki criticized Rushton’s racial theories in a live televised debate at the University of Western Ontario. He said, “There will always be Rushtons in science, and we must always be prepared to root them out!” At the same occasion, when Rushton was asked if he believed in racial superiority, he said, “Oh, no!” He said, “from an evolutionary point of view, superiority can only mean adaptive value – if it even means this. And we’ve got to realize that each of these populations is perfectly, beautifully adapted to their own ancestral environments.”

            According to Charles Lane, in 1988, Rushton conducted a survey at the Eaton Centre mall in Toronto, where he paid 50 whites, 50 blacks, and 50 Asians to answer questions about their sexual habits. Because he did not clear his survey and proposed to pay for answers with the university committee at UWO, the administration reprimanded Rushton, calling his transgression “a serious breach of scholarly procedure,” said University President, George Pederson.

            Rushton’s work was criticized in the scholarly literature; he generally responded, sometimes in the same journal. In 1995 in the Journal of Black Studies, Zack Cernovsky wrote, “some of Rushton’s references to scientific literature with respects to racial differences in sexual characteristics turned out to be references to a nonscientific semi-pornographic book and to an article in the Penthouse magazine’s Forum.”

            Anti-racism activist and political scientist Tim Wise criticized Rushton’s application of r/K selection theory to crime rates and IQ, charging that Rushton ignored things such as systematic/institutional discrimination, racial profiling, economic disparities and unequal access to judicial defense in his attempt to apply r/K Theory and IQ theories to explain racial disparities in American crime rates. He also criticized Rushton and others like him of ignoring things like “white-collar crime” rates,

            Corporate criminals, after all, are usually highly educated, and probably would score highly on just about any standardized test you chose to give them. And what of it? Virtually all the stock manipulators, unethical derivatives traders and shady money managers on Wall Street, whose actions have brought the economy to its knees of late — and who it might be worth noting are pretty much all white men — would likely do well on the Stanford-Binet or Wonderlich Industrial Aptitude Test. They probably were above-average students. But what are we to make of these facts? Clearly they say little about the value of such persons to the nation or the world. The Unabomber was a certified genius and Ted Bundy was of well-above-average intelligence… But I’m having a hard time discerning what we should conclude about these truths, in terms of how much emphasis we place on intelligence, as opposed to other human traits.

            The biological anthropologist C. Loring Brace criticized Rushton in his 1996 review of the book, Race, Evolution and Behavior (1996):

            Virtually every kind of anthropologist may be put in the position of being asked to comment on what is contained in this book, so, whatever our individual specialty, we should all be prepared to discuss what it represents. Race, Evolution, and Behavior is an amalgamation of bad biology and inexcusable anthropology. It is not science but advocacy, and advocacy for the promotion of “racialism.” Tzvetan Todorov explains “racialism,” in contrast to “racism,” as belief in the existence of typological essences called “races” whose characteristics can be rated in hierarchical fashion (On Human Diversity: Nationalism, Racism, and Exoticism in French Thought, Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1993, p. 31). “Racism,” then, is the use of racialist assumptions to promote social or political ends, a course that Todorov regards as leading to “particularly catastrophic results.” Perpetuating catastrophe is not the stated aim of Rushton’s book, but current promoters of racist agendas will almost certainly regard it as a welcome weapon to apply for their noxious purposes.

            Robert Sussman, an evolutionary anthropologist and the editor in-chief of American Anthropologist, explained why the journal did not accept ads for Rushton’s 1998 book:

            This is an insidious attempt to legitimize Rushton’s racist propaganda and is tantamount to publishing ads for white supremacy and the neo-Nazi party. If you have any question about the validity of the “science” of Rushton’s trash you should read any one of his articles and the many rebuttals by ashamed scientists.

            In 2000, after Rushton mailed a booklet on his work to psychology, sociology, and anthropology professors across North America, Hermann Helmuth, a professor of anthropology at Trent University, said: “It is in a way personal and political propaganda. There is no basis to his scientific research.” Rushton responded, “It’s not racist; it’s a matter of science and recognizing variation in all groups of people.”

            Since 2002, Rushton was the president of the Pioneer Fund. Tax records from 2000 show in that year that his Charles Darwin Research Institute was awarded $473,835, or 73% of the fund’s total grants that year. The Southern Poverty Law Center, an American civil rights organization, characterizes the Pioneer Fund as a hate group. Rushton has spoken on eugenics several times at conferences of the American Renaissance magazine, a monthly racialist magazine, in which he has also published a number of general articles.

            Rushton published articles on the website VDARE, which advocates reduced immigration into the United States. Stefan Kühl wrote in his book, The Nazi Connection: Eugenics, American Racism, and German National Socialism (2002), that Rushton was part of the revival in the 1980s of public interest in scientific racism.

            William H. Tucker, a professor of psychology who writes histories of scientific racism, noted in 2002:

            Rushton has not only contributed to American Renaissance publications and graced their conferences with his presence but also offered praise and support for the “scholarly” work on racial differences of Henry Garrett, who spent the last two decades of his life opposing the extension of the Constitution to blacks on the basis that the “normal” black resembled a European after frontal lobotomy. Informed of Garrett’s assertion that blacks were not entitled to equality because their “ancestors were … savages in an African jungle,” Rushton dismissed the observation as quoted “selectively from Garrett’s writing”, finding nothing opprobrious in such sentiments because the leader of the scientific opposition to civil rights had made other statements about black inferiority that were, according to Rushton, “quite objective in tone and backed by standard social science evidence.” Quite apart from the questionable logic in defending a blatant call to deprive citizens of their rights by citing Garrett’s less offensive writing—as if it were evidence of Ted Bundy’s innocence that there were some women he had met and not killed—there was no sense on Rushton’s part that all of Garrett’s assertions, whether or not “objective,” were utterly irrelevant to constitutional guarantees, which are not predicated on scientific demonstrations of intellectual equality.

            In 2005, Lisa Suzuki and Joshua Aronson of New York University wrote an article noting that Rushton ignored evidence that failed to support his position that IQ test score gaps represent a genetic racial hierarchy. He did not change his position on this matter for 30 years. Rushton replied in the same issue of the journal.

            In a paper for the International Journal of Selection and Assessment in 2006, Steven Cronshaw and colleagues wrote that psychologists need to critically examine the science used by Rushton in his “race-realist” research. Their re-analysis of the validity criteria for test bias, using data reported in the Rushton et al. paper, led them to conclude that the testing methods were biased against Black Africans. They disagree with other aspects of Rushton’s methodology, such as his use of non-equivalent groups in test samples. Rushton responded in the next issue of the journal. He said why he believed his results were valid, and why he thought the criticisms incorrect.

          • Claude

            You need to become a moderator on this site. You’re bright and you have time for debate. All those who agree, vote up.

          • Barack Obama

            Pathetic bullshit. None of those things you quoted have any real substance. Basically, there are people who disagree with him, and those people are hyper-sensitive hyper-liberal fucktards like yourself, who have hard time accepting the truth for whatever lame reason.

            Rushton have obviously already addressed all those things, which are nothing more than ad hominem attacks on him, which do not include any statistical and/or testing research themselves to scientifically disprove any of his theories, are nothing more than false accusations of testing bias, and of him having a Neonazi racist politcal agenda, and all that other Mickey Mouse baloney.

            >>>Rushton has not only contributed to American Renaissance publications and graced their conferences with his presence but also offered praise and support for the “scholarly” work on racial differences of Henry Garrett, who spent the last two decades of his life opposing the extension of the Constitution to blacks on the basis that the “normal” black resembled a European after frontal lobotomy. Informed of Garrett’s assertion that blacks were not entitled to equality because their “ancestors were … savages in an African jungle,” Rushton dismissed the observation as quoted “selectively from Garrett’s writing”, finding nothing opprobrious in such sentiments because the leader of the scientific opposition to civil rights had made other statements about black inferiority that were, according to Rushton, “quite objective in tone and backed by standard social science evidence.” Quite apart from the questionable logic in defending a blatant call to deprive citizens of their rights by citing Garrett’s less offensive writing—as if it were evidence of Ted Bundy’s innocence that there were some women he had met and not killed—there was no sense on Rushton’s part that all of Garrett’s assertions, whether or not “objective,” were utterly irrelevant to constitutional guarantees, which are not predicated on scientific demonstrations of intellectual equality.”

            what the fuck is this jibba jabba i just read? sounds like something al sharpon would say if he was more articulate and better at spinning bullshit.

          • …meanwhile, all you’ve offered is the name “J.Philippe Rushton”.

            That is literally your entire argument: “J.Philippe Rushton”.

            Can’t even paraphrase him. Nope, just paste his name: “J.Philippe Rushton”.

            Very compelling.

          • mr.wiener

            @disqus_sZe140t687:disqus and @disqus_uKx9SyAwyn:disqus.
            I think this conversation has about run its course. How about being mature adults and agreeing to disagree?

            A friendly suggestion from your overworked moderator.

          • Dr Sun

            Is that the best you can do ???

            Even POS could flame and insult better than you

          • Getting a little emotional are we? Your use of ad hominems and your failure to address the country-level statistics I posted means I win the argument.

          • Barack Obama

            nice trolling ugly Matt.

          • Barack Obama

            Nice trolling ugly Matt. I’m not a racist, I’m a realist.

          • “I’m not a racist, I’m a realist.”

            …said every delusional racist ever.

          • Barack Obama

            So just because I am acknowledging there are genetic differences between groups of population that create different behavioral patterns I am a racist? It’s just science. How can you label me a racist? You don’t even know me, fool.

          • Zappa Frank

            which science? any article other than the book of a journalist? may be even true, but is far from being proved.

          • Barack Obama

            Mr.Frank, there are TONS of scientific research done on this subject. You can start with lectures by J. Phillippe Rushton. And no he is not just some journalist. I do not have an agenda on this subject. I am simply trying to stop the spread of misinformation by idiots like Matt that will argue and argue for no reason.

          • Zappa Frank

            it not that I want to deny the possibility since we all do not know the genes influence on cultures, but at present the view of J.Philippe Rushton is not exactly the same of most anthropologists.

          • Barack Obama

            Your statement about genes influence on culture is a huge leap in causality. It’s kind of like saying we do not know the influence of electromagnetism on the outcome of the Super Bowl. However, I’ll still have to argue that genes have a huge influence on culture. If you look at twins separated at birth and how their behavior and life choices are so unbelievably similar, almost identical, not to mention things like intelligence, that is undeniable evidence of how genes affect behavior.

          • You’re not “acknowledging genetic differences”. You’re making scientifically unsubstantiated claims about blacks being genetically more predisposed to violence. You haven’t posted so much as a single scientific journal. The fact that you use the trollish alias “Barack Obama” and said “niggers gotta nig” under a separate fake pseudonym makes it REALLY clear that you are, in fact, a racist. You claim that “I don’t even know you” but what you don’t realize is that you’ve already done the job of making yourself known. You’ve done everything in your power to express the obvious fact that you are a 100% prototypical racist.

          • Barack Obama

            well, the regional statistic would be more accurate because country-level statistic is of a smaller sample, some countries have only a few million in population, and is thus vulnerable to pockets of extreme concentration.

          • I’m devastated.

          • Zappa Frank

            but he is a journalist and not a scientist. I can appreciate his opinion, but I would not take it as something definitely true.

          • So you’ve made your conclusion before reading the book.

          • Zappa Frank

            so I should read every book about anything before decide if take them seriously or not just because they are written?
            Do I have to read all books about magic stuff to decide if they are valid or not?
            I did just say that he is not an authority on this filed, if what he says is that revolutionary I wonder why he doesn’t publish on science magazines..

          • This is getting tedious and boring so here’s my last word on this. Yes, you should read something before making a conclusion about it. Which is what I said. No, you don’t have to read something fully to determine if you want to take it seriously.

          • Zappa Frank

            I’ve studied anthropology so I guess I’ve read something.
            i’m sorry you get bored, but science doesn’t work with journalist books about their revolutionary conclusions.. science works step by step with years of study

          • firebert5

            Moreover, (and I say this as a science major) not all conclusions drawn by “scientists” are necessarily “scientific,” reasonable though most may be.

          • firebert5

            I don’t have to read an autobiography of Madonna to know it will be full of arrogant, “Hey, look at me, I’m still sexy even though I’m old enough to be your Grandma’s Mom” sort of stuff anymore than I would have to read “The Joys of Getting Run Over by a Semi-Tractor Trailer” before I could conclude that getting run over by a tractor trailer can’t possibly elicit any joy out of me whatsoever. Whew, that was a contrived sentence! I’m gonna go take a nap now.

          • Getting a little emotional are we? Your use of ad hominems and your failure to address the points I made means I win the argument.

          • Dr Sun

            Latin America takes that honour.

            1. Honduras
            3. Belize
            4.El Salvador
            5. Guatemala

            The top predominantly Black country comes in at Number
            6. Jamaica

          • mr.wiener

            No people are more likely to commit crimes of violence when they are poor and living in poor communities within rich societies. Whether you are black , white or yellow.

          • Barack Obama

            Mr.Wiener you are an intelligent man so I will present you with cold hard scientific evidence and trust that you will come to a logical conclusion. This is not about trying to prove any one race is “superior” to another, but by presenting all scientific evidences that we have to help us help solve whatever problems in society when it comes to issues of race logically and realistically. There is no point in lying to ourselves when the British-born Canadian psychology professortruth is uncomfortable, I think you would agree on this point.

            Your statement is obviously true but it’s more complicated than that. It is only when you account for ALL VARIABLES, including social-economic background, that you can get a real and accurate picture of the situation.

            You can start by listening to this lecture by J.Philippe Rushton who is a british born psychology professor. I found it very interesting:

          • KamikaziPilot

            So you seem to think that genetics are responsible for things like behavior right (ex. violence prone)? Well answer me this then: what about the violence perpetrated by other races throughout history? Europeans during the colonial age, Ghengis Khan and his conquests, the Roman Empire was very violent, South American warring natives like Aztecs and Inca, the list goes on. During the trans-Atlantic slave trade wasn’t it whites perpetrating extreme violence and cruelty on blacks? Bottom line is we’re all barbarians under this thin veneer of civility. What does matter and influence behavior is contemporary culture. You can say contemporary African American culture does encourage violence, just like the Vikings were known for their violence, but I don’t feel it’s genetics, although it’s next to impossible to prove either of us is right or wrong, but I think evidence throughout history points more to culture and social factors than genetics.

          • Chris Granzow XI

            You forget that a lot of historical events tend to be exaggerated. Some events are put under a microscope and made out to be worse than they really were (sometimes for political reasons). Then, on the other hand, some horrific events can be minimized, ignored and ultimately forgotten. The genetic argument is more-so proven when looking through history than dis proven.

          • Zappa Frank

            We can argue about historical event, if pacific Chinese really buried alive hundred thousand of people in the battle of changpin and Julu, or we can argue about the violence of of killing 6 millions of Jewish… But I think the point here is not violence but order, since in most cases order is associate to whites or yellows… But again what about Mongols, what about Huns, what about other barbaric tribes outside the Roman Empire? They were yellow and white, no the same time there were African kingdoms more evolved

          • KamikaziPilot

            Of course historical events are often distorted due to various reasons but my point still stands. Are you saying race, throughout history, plays the most important role in determining behavior? That propensity to violence, intellectual ability, personality, are all determined by race the most? So in a hypothetical scenario say 100 black, 100 white, and 100 asian children grew up in exactly the same circumstances (I know impossible but theoretically), are you saying that on average their behavior will differ based on their race (ex.blacks more aggressive, whites more orderly, asians more quiet)? Another example look at many blacks who grew up around predominately whites and associated with them the most, and vice versa. A black person who grew up around mostly whites is going to be a lot more like a white person (except skin color) than a black person who grew up around other blacks. Culture and social surroundings affect behavior much more than race. If any of it is genetic (eg. race) I suspect it’s very minimal compared to environment and culture. I guess it’s the whole nature vs. nurture argument again.

          • Chris Granzow XI

            People have different internal biology, differences too vast to enumerate one-by-one. If a black person grew up around whites and acted “white,” that would still have zero effect on his internal chemistry or genes. Studies on these things come out literally like every other week, the media just doesn’t report it and continues to push this fallacy that we’re all the same. All races/ethnic groups are no different than animal species who have lived under a certain external environment under certain circumstances for thousands of years and have different physical adaptations because of it. We are mammals after all.

          • KamikaziPilot

            I’m just saying that environment plays a much larger role in behavior and even thought process (ex. logical thinking) than race alone does. Environment won’t change the DNA or biology of a specific person in their lifetime, although it probably does change over generations just like other animals adapt to their surroundings. I’m not trying to be PC, after all humans have physical differences between the races like body build, body hair and texture and skin color, but when I look at human behavior throughout history (not just recent history), it seems environment plays a much larger role than race does. There’s a book called “Guns Germs and Steel” which attempts to explain the different success rates between various groups. I’m not saying race has zero impact on behavior but I think if it does, it’s too small to focus on by those trying to change human behavior (ex. reduce crime). Of course a lot is subject to interpretation and perspective but that’s just the way I see it. BTW do you have any links to any of these supposed studies that show behavioral differences based solely on race?

          • Fracist

            This guy is a straight piece of shit and he’s racist towards everyone who isn’t white. A few months ago I had an argument with him. In one of the comments he said anytime he sees an Asian guy ripped he must be on steroids. He was talking shit about us. This guy is a pretentious and simple minded fuck who believes what the media tells him.

            And environment does play a role. Anyone raised in a violent environment with violent parents is likely to engage in violent activity. Your childhood shapes you.

          • SuperHappyCow

            It’s not even violent environments, it’s massive, nation and world-wide lead poisoning. It has fuck-all to do with violent cultures.


          • BiffyClanger

            You have obviously never heard of epi genetics. Perhaps the most important bit of development in genetics.

          • Barack Obama

            >So you seem to think that genetics are responsible for things like
            behavior right (ex. violence prone)? Well answer me this then: what
            about the violence perpetrated by other races throughout history?

            A combination of genetics and extraneous circumstances. But we are looking at stats of petty crimes and murders, like going around robbing and stealing and causing general uncivilized mayhem, not how many people each race killed overall in wars and such, which is a different matter.

          • KamikaziPilot

            Just look at the poor blacks of late 19th century America after slavery ended. Did they act the same way the poor blacks do today? No, because the circumstances and social structure and culture was different back then. In fact it was whites that were still terrorizing blacks and trying to keep them down.

          • SuperHappyCow

            I like that peer-revied research you never bothered to post that demonstrated that blacks are at all genetically inclined towards violence.

            Since you couldn’t be bothered to provide any evidence for your bullshit child-like opinions here’s a piece of peer reviewed research that demonstrates that tetraethyl lead causes spikes in violence when placed into fuel, and drastic decreases when regulated out of fuel.


            Look at that. Civilizations getting poisoned to death and wiped out by private industry. Would you look at that. So global warming and fracking aren’t outliers after all.

          • Dr Sun

            KamikaziPilot I had a epiphany, after reading through this this thread, one that I was surprised hadn’t dawned on me earlier. It comes in two parts, but they’re closely intertwined.
            The first part- Sites like CSmack will attract racists and supremacists from all sides and they just love stories like this or the kid hitting his grandmother to promote their supremacist ideology. Now of course they going to deny that racist or supremacist (they always do). But they always end up using the same old “dead horse” argument to back themselves up, that of genetics.
            Despite no matter much evidence is presented against them, they cannot get past the “Eugenics” of Nazi Germany, it just gives them a big woody.
            The second part- which has become clearer and more obvious with their increasing post count in this thread is the simplicity and absurdity of their argument. Here it it cut down to its bare bones.
            Blacks are violent, the most violent race because they are genetically wired that way. In other words violence is in their nature. Much of their original justification was drawn from the early 20th century behavioural geneticists and behavioural psychologists. After WWII and the horrors of the Holocaust “Eugenics” fell in disarray and declined. However after the discovery of the so called “Warrior gene” and its higher prevalence in Blacks and Asians, the Racists had and new “Golden Egg” and they have scrambled to create research to link this genetic variance to violence.
            No matter how poor or experimental the research, despite it not being replicated or widely accepted, they will throw it in regardless as “FACT”.
            Now here’s the interesting part, when white violence is brought up, that it immediately dismissed as being irrelevant as white violence is not mainly caused by genetics, but to either maintain order or as a result of “socio-economic factors. When white violence against other races is mentioned, its rebutted as “over-exaggerated, manipulated, or historically incorrect”, WHILE at the same time using sensationalized media stories and historical event as evidence of black-violence (which of course are not exaggerated or manipulated).
            When the murder rates worldwide are mentioned, that to is dismissed as irrelevant (for the reasons above) ie blacks in Africa murder because they are genetically determined to do so, latinos in south America for socio-economic reasons.
            In essence their argument is you cannot compare white/latino violence to Black or Asian violence as they are determined “caused by” different variables/ factors. Therefore “Apples and Oranges”.
            Reductionist arguments, those which try to explain very complex human behaviours to a “gene” are simple to understand, simple to argue and therefore very easy for certain types of people to latch onto to promote their “US v’s Them” Racist/ Supremacist position.

          • KamikaziPilot

            Well you having an epiphany is kind of scary in itself, haha. I do agree with a lot of what you said but I don’t believe you can totally discount what posters like Granzow, Barack Obama, and other posters like them have to say. After all, the difference races do have obvious physical differences so it is logical that mental and behavioral differences could also be possible. However, I do believe culture and environment plays a far greater role than genetics (aka race) does. And I believe it’s better to focus on those factors when trying to change behavior (ex. reduce crime or poverty). That said, I also believe people will see what they want to see no matter what studies you present them with. It’s also next to impossible to either prove or disprove race being the most important factor in things like behavior.

          • SuperHappyCow


            It’s an interesting video, but this part pretty much sums it up. Crime has absolutely nothing to do with the prevalence of drugs, or prostitution, or a certain kind of music. We live in an era where identical arguments that were used to try and lock blacks and poor people up for rock n’ roll and marijuana in the mid 20th century are actually strictly enforced today, with blacks getting locked up 25ish times the rate of whites for using marijuana, although all races use it at about the same rate.

            Crime has absolutely nothing to do with blacks in the U.S. but it has absolutely everything to do with rampant lead poisoning caused by tetraethyl that oil corporations were using in fuel.


            But we can’t have arguments about that, much in the same way we can’t have a legitimate political debate in the U.S. about global warming even though 99.8 percent of climate scientists agree that climate change is taking place due to man-made emissions. Private industry keeps poisoning everyone over and over again. When civilization starts to collapse under its own weight we’re probably going to blame cows for extreme climate variation, even though they’re not causing the problem, but meat industrialization and fuel is.

          • mr.wiener

            Thanks, It was actually hard to know what you were saying in you other posts as you and Matt seemed to preoccupied whispering sweet nothings to each other. Also the other comment you posted:
            “Niggers gotta nig” …seemed like an exercise in provocation, Don’t let it happen again, I do check IP numbers you know.
            That said I agree with much that this fella has to say and am currently reading a book you might be interested in:
            “Why nations fail” (The origins of power, prosperity and poverty) by Daron Acemoglu and James A. Robinson.
            Well worth a read.

          • Barack Obama

            HA you got me there! i did say that didn’t i? Well, I guess I let this article get the best of me. And thanks I will check that out.

          • SuperHappyCow

            Wiener, one of the main reasons civilizations fail is because of over-industrialization and destruction of natural resources. I can’t believe you’re buying into these fascists illiterate rantings.

          • mr.wiener

            Have you read this fascist illiterate rant at all?
            It made some good points and didn’t play favorites according to race.

          • Barack Obama

            No he didn’t. Even if he did he would just ignore everything anyways. Guess he must have been eating too much lead lol

          • Chris Granzow XI

            Then explain to me why trailer parks aren’t bastions of extreme violence. Majority white West Virginia is literally one of the poorest states in our country, yet violent crime is relatively low. How come low-income Chinatown wasn’t as violent Bedstuy? How come dirt poor children of recent Mexican immigrants aren’t running around beating up random people, filming it with their cell phones and uploading it to the internet? European immigrants from the late-1800s to 1940s lived in horrific conditions, in extreme poverty, yet still didn’t do these things. You’re also missing the fact that people aren’t getting robbed in these attacks; there is no monetary gain by the attackers most of the time. It’s violence for the sake of violence. Poverty isn’t the explanation. Genetics is.

          • mr.wiener

            Call it what you will, drugs, hopelessness and and resentment have festered in these ghettos and made a culture that worships violence ,excess instant gratification. Other races have gone through this but it seems to be a majority of black folks who are still stuck in this rut.
            I could speculate and pull theories out of my arse that other migrant groups have been economic migrants and have hit the ground running to give the next generation the good life, whereas black folk weren’t migrants, they were a trasported commodity that has had the rug dragged out from under it every time they looked like they could make it too…but that would be making excuses. The time for excuses has long past. Black people have to do something about this themselves,for themselves.

          • SuperHappyCow

            Violence has nothing to do with the rise and fall of the black population, or the rise and fall of “gangster” music.

            The only thing it’s ever been related to in the U.S. and other industrialized nations is the prevalence of lead usage in fuel.


            Lead is a severe neurotoxin that causes nausea, aggressiveness, short attention span and paralysis. That your oil corporations were using it in fuel during the past century seems to raise no flags in modern white society. That’s much in the same way that fracking, an oil extraction method that poisons water and causes earthquakes, and climate change, an issue that’s rapidly pushing us towards extinction, are considered non-issues, because the wealthiest corporations that ever existed profit from poisoning you. I mean, we all know climate change is happening right now, yet in the U.S. we still have arguments as to whether or not it exists because of extreme corruption.

            The “rut” has nothing to do with the black community, and everything to do with the mass exportation of jobs to other countries and the criminalization of extremely benign things like marijuana use, while alcohol, an extremely poisonous drug is given to society with some minor padding to make sure we don’t annihilate each other. It poisons people and causes horrific accidents where white kids who rob walmarts of alcohol, get drunk, drive underage and kill 4 people get off with slaps on the wrist, yet black kids can do life for getting caught with marijuana 3 times.

            “Black people have to do something about this themselves,for themselves.”

            Crime has very little to do with blacks. It’s white culture that’s extremely criminal. Otherwise, you wouldn’t have corporations that are allowed to openly purchase your politicians, or a spying apparatus that’s over 70 percent privatized, and a military that keeps attacking the wrong countries (Iraq) while we fund the countries that sponsor and train terrorists (Saudi Arabia)

            I thought you were smarter than this, Weiner.

            I am disappoint.

          • mr.wiener

            Changes need to happen and for them to stick it has to be by black people [no matter how fragmented their society] for black people. At a society level people in these communities are justifiably suspicious of outsiders coming in and telling them what to do, but in many cases there exists an admirable tradition of self help.
            Sorry to disappoint you, nice to see you back. How’ve you been?

          • Dr Sun

            how is it genetic ?

          • Chris Granzow XI

            Because, if poverty was the real cause then across the board we would see all people from different racial backgrounds doing the same level of violence when they were in extreme poverty….but they don’t. We instead see noticeable differences when race/ethnicity is taken into account. Genetics are you’re ancestry and therefore your race/ethnicity. Get it?

          • Dr Sun

            total rubbish.

          • Chris Granzow XI

            Lol, you’re so full of it. I hate it when people like you don’t do even the slightest research into genetic differences and then unflinchingly claim that there is no evidence at all. In fact, there is: google “MAOA-2R.” And that’s only one gene. In a hundreds years time we will have discovered thousands more genetic differences. People like you who deny it are simply anti-scientific.

          • Zappa Frank

            Hem…if my memory is correct he is a real doctor

          • Chris Granzow XI

            ….the scientists and researchers conducting these studies have medical degrees too, and more experience and skill than he does. Just because he’s a ‘doctor’ doesn’t automatically signal any experience or knowledge of genetics. These aren’t theories that one can choose to agree with or disagree with. He can also debate if 1+1 really equals 2, but that won’t change the facts. I think it’s moreover that modern society conditions us to think that acknowledging differences and taking them into account is ‘racist.’ Professors, scientists and doctors have lost their jobs for doing such research. His stance is more rooted in pre-conditioning and moral issues than it is in reality and fact.

          • Rick in China

            Although I don’t think people like Chris realize this, and are likely going off of anecdotal or simply (insert-your)-complex here irrational fears, there is evidence of a genetic relationship to propensity for violence & crime. It’s called monoamine oxidase-A and does have a distribution variance amongst races – White/Hispanic being like, half that of Chinese/African in several studies, here’s an example

            Not to say that it’s sufficient to say something like “black people are more violent” – but that on this genetic element alone, they seem to be at a greater likelihood of having a propensity to that sort of aggressive behaviour. There are lots of other factors that contribute to violence of course.

          • Dr Sun

            so how do you genetically explain Latin America having the top 5 murder rates in the world ?

          • Rick in China

            I wasn’t attempting to explain Latin America’s murder rate, or any country’s murder rate…or stating that genetics is *responsible* for murder rate. I don’t think I mentioned murder, or murder rate, at fact.

            Murder rate also doesn’t equate to propensity for violence. Murder rate is also something that is questionably reported and determined by metrics which are not standard amongst all countries for many reasons, nor is reported violence. Genetics, as I said, is also not the “well obviously…because…” factor in violence (or murder, since that seems to be your go-to).

            I’m simply stating a fact, and you can do with it what you will, but saying genetics doesn’t have a relationship with violence is scientifically incorrect.

          • Dr Sun

            maybe I’m stupid but I always sort of assumed murder was a violent crime.
            Btw you cannot say you are stating a “fact” when your entire argument is based on nothing but racist, prejudice and rhetoric.
            There is absolutely no credible scientific genetic, physiological, sociological, psychological or anthropological research or evidence to support your argument at all.

          • Rick in China


            There is nothing “racist” about what I said. I also argued *against* the correlation that because someone is a given race, they *are* more violent. I only stated that, genetically speaking, there is a gene which has direct relation to aggressive behavior in humans. That is a fact. The gene is, as I mentioned, monoamine oxidase-A. The gene also has different prevalence in different races. I never drew any conclusions past that point, although you certainly have. Read more of what I actually wrote before you spout your bullshit, “There is absolutely no credible scientific genetic, physiological, sociological, psychological or anthropological research or evidence to support your argument at all.” I wasn’t making an ARGUMENT, Sun, I was stating a fact about genetics and gene research which you certainly can look up, should you wish to open your eyes.

            RE: “maybe I’m stupid but I always sort of assumed murder was a violent crime” Sure. Murder is typically violent. However, statistics on murder do not equate to statistics on violence, as the metrics – like I said – are very different – the reporting – again, very different – everything is different. So if our discussion is about VIOLENCE, and you only rant about MURDER, your argument has no legs. Get it? I’d like to see where I am: “based on nothing but racist, prejudice and rhetoric” also. Please, be specific – because all I’ve said so far is fact without conclusion and argued against the correlative conclusions others have drawn on this thread.

          • Dr Sun

            Actually you’re incorrect as all humans (barring those with Brunners syndrome) carry variations of this gene .

            The frequency distribution of variants of the MAO-A gene differs between ethnic groups; 58% of Black men, 54% of Chinese men, 56% of Maori men, and 36% of Caucasian men carry the 3R allele. 5.5% of Black men, 0.9% of Caucasian men, and 0.00067% of Asian men carry the 2R allele.

            As McDermott.R 2009 states “Monoamine oxidase A gene (MAOA) has earned the nickname “warrior gene” because it has been linked to aggression in observational and survey-based studies. However, no controlled experimental studies have tested whether the warrior gene actually drives behavioral manifestations of these tendencies”

            Surveys conducted with small numbers of convicted felons and models from mice does not constitute “FACT”. The premise that MAOA drives behaviour remains highly controversial to say the least, with replication of the results supporting the theory having not been achieved.Haberstick et al 2005.

            So before you spout your anecdotal bullshit as being FACT you may want to read more than a wikipedia page on the subject.

          • Rick in China

            “you may want to read more than a wikipedia page on the subject”

            Like you did?

            HA HA HA HA. Uh huh.

          • Dr Sun

            yes, UNLIKE YOU, HAHAHA, Uh LOL, LMAO, ROTFL

          • Barack Obama

            “so how do you genetically explain Latin America having the top 5 murder rates in the world ?”

            I will answer your question in a way i hope even you can understand, although i doubt it. The thing is, these countries having the 5 highest murder rates tells us nothing, because it groups all the races together living in said country, and because there are no OTHER variables to compare it to. In other words, the majority of the people in these countries are Latino/hispanic, and there are no other races in the country living under the same circumstances that you can compare the data to. Thus, if you have the data of the murder rates of latinos in say, El Salvador, AND ALSO the data for murder rates of blacks and whites and asians, all living in El Salvador, and then adjust the data for socio-economic background and other variables and circumstances, ONLY THEN will you have something useful and interesting.
            Until then if some little city in Japan happens to have a murder rate 20 times that of say, Angola, it makes no sense to use that statistic to prove that “Asians murder shockingly more than Africans.”

            Now, there are statistical research done, obviously, that takes into account all these variables and done in the most scientific ways possible and they are all in accordance with the position we are taking here.

          • Dr Sun

            “there are no other races living in the same circumstances in these countries”

            How do you know this ?

            “Now, there are statistical research done, obviously, that takes into account all these variables and done in the most scientific ways possible”

            Do you have links ?

          • linette lee

            Because the black people who are poor in USa they are more organized with their criminal activities. The ones that are violence usually they belong to a gang. They are gang member. They have street rules. They use and sell drugs. Prostitution. They divide their black neighborhood and different gang in charge of different session. Don’t you watch news? EVen the white police are afraid to patrol there.

          • Dr Sun

            I take it you have research to back this BS up ?

          • SuperHappyCow

            Blacks live in a police state. Think East Germany, post WWII.

          • Barack Obama

            Yes of course, we all know blacks are the master race. they are stronger, smarter, faster, invented civilization, calculus, and math, the pyramids, and have the biggest penises. Everything that’s wrong with them today is the grand design of the white man holding them back with the help of the illuminati, stonecutters, CIA, FBI, LAPD, the repitilians, the NWO, zionist bankers, 5000 years of slavery, chem-trails and lead paint. If everyone else would just stop fucking with blacks all the time 24/7 holding us down we would be able to reach our true potential. 90% of all college professors would be black as well as all the lawyers, doctors, dentists, professors, engineers, and theoretical physicists. Everyone knows that blacks are the best at everything, they are the hardest working of all races, the most civilized, polite, they would never rob a white guy, and even if they did he had it coming to him because he probably called him the N word, also basically black people living in the United States is the equivalent of Jews in Auschwitz with police snipers posted outside every black person’s house ready to take them out for not using their blinkers when they turn.

          • 내가 제일 잘나가

            European immigrants from the late-1800s to 1940s lived in horrific conditions, in extreme poverty, yet still didn’t do these things. ”

            Was that a joke or?…

          • Chris Granzow XI

            Just shows how ignorant you are. Personally, my german grandfather slept in a room the size of a closet, with mice, sleeping on a roll out mattress, with 10 people living in a space made for 2. His father worked 12 hour days and rarely got to see his children. What did you think it was like back then? They had it a lot rougher than most immigrants do now days.


          • Zappa Frank

            however who says those places weren’t violent? in the article it says:

            For many immigrants the new life was a tough one- some of the streets where they had made their home were notorious for violent crime.

          • Chris Granzow XI

            Yea–by 1890’s standards. Believe me, ask any older person and they’ll tell you. It was rough, but not nearly as violent by today’s standards. Somebody wouldn’t randomly beat you to death while others walked by and did nothing.

          • Rick in China

            “Somebody wouldn’t randomly beat you to death while others walked by and did nothing.”

            Unless you were black.

          • KamikaziPilot

            “Unless you were black.”

            Haha, nice comeback and probably true.

          • SuperHappyCow

            Definitely true. The FBI and CIA were essentially assassinating black civil rights leaders and union members, although there has always been extreme violence towards union members in the U.S. before recently.

          • Chris Granzow XI

            Nonsense. In fact, when Abraham Lincoln was young he was almost beaten to death by a gang of black men while on a boat. They didn’t even have a large amount of black people in the northern states, that didn’t happen until the great migration in 50’s and 60’s. This idea that white people were civilized people but suddenly transformed into rabid foaming-at-the-mouth animals at the site of a black person is a myth. Honestly. Dig through history. There’s a lot more to history than is presented to us. For example, did you know that Emmett Till’s father was sentenced to death in Italy during WWII for raping 4 Italian women and killing one of them. Life magazine at the time covered this up and reported that Till’s father died a war hero. And with Emmett Till himself, he didn’t get beaten because he just “whistled at a white woman.” He basically sexually harassed a married women with two kids and groped her, while whispering sexual remarks in her ear. In fact, his cousins had to intervene and pull him off of her. But they don’t tell you any of that in history books.

          • Rick in China

            Yes – nothing in history books is true, you, however, have all the secret insights to ‘how it was’. Can I use your time machine for a bit? I mean, through all your vast experience and understanding of that which history books cover up / ‘is a myth’, surely you have one?

          • Zappa Frank

            old people always like the old good times, when young guys where respectful and so on… but apparently the homicide rate was higher or the same as now, never had a big difference:



          • Chris Granzow XI

            Homicide isn’t the same thing as violence in general. It’s the type of homocide, and the type of violence.

          • Zappa Frank

            True but homicide is the only thing we can compare, we cannot just rely on the memories of old people. They think before was better because they were young… Even my grandmother sister liked a lot the years when she was young and reminds those years as greats…but to be realistic there was also the war in the middle, than her memories aren’t that reliable.

          • Chris Granzow XI

            Dude, it’s not old people feeling nostalgique or something, it’s fact. There weren’t kids running around beating random people up, and it wasn’t happening in nearly every major city across america on a weekly basis. Even those things are just the tip of the iceberg. I used to see crazy things on an everyday basis that was never in the news or being reported to the general public. Believe me. Stuff like that never happened. You had the occasional maniac serial killer jack the ripper-types, but that’s it.

          • SuperHappyCow

            Violent crime has been plummeting since before Reagan’s ultra-fascist war on drugs, and war on really poor independent nations. It’s been dropping in relation to how we decided to regulate lead out of fuel.


            The correlation isn’t just in the U.S. it’s in every industrialized nation and it relates to when lead was systematically removed from the violent.

            What basically happened is that the richest corporations poisoned everyone with a substance we’ve known to cause insanity, violence, and paralysis for 2000 years, yet society collectively blamed it all those evil poor people who had all their jobs outsourced by manufacturers.

            If you disagree with anything I’m saying find me a peer-reviewed study that demonstrates a correlation between violent crime and trashy corporate rap or hip-hop. Good luck.

          • Chris Granzow XI

            I wasn’t correlating it to trashy rap or hip-hop music. I was correlating it with race. Google “MAOA-2r.”

          • KamikaziPilot

            I won’t argue about how much race (ex. genetics) as opposed to culture and environment influence behavior and thinking as I really think it’s open to so much interpretation and people will see what they want to see but thanks for the link to the pictures, they were cool. It was indeed a rough life. Seems like sanitation was terrible back then in addition to the violence.

          • SuperHappyCow

            The increase in violent crime in the past century, and the subsequent plummet is pretty much entirely do to lead pollution in fuel. Don’t believe me, think of the last time you read the description of the fuel you were buying for your car.

            “Regular Unleaded.”


            Rap music doesn’t cause violence. What does is massive, world-wide lead poisoning.

          • Dr Sun
          • Dr Sun
          • Chris Granzow XI

            Oh wow, you’re way too defensive. Move to any major american city with a sizable black population and you’ll see what he’s talking about. Nobody is saying every single black person on this planet is like that, they’re just saying that a high percentage are. A high percentage……’high’ compared to what, you might ask me? Well, a high percentage compared to asians, compared to whites and compared to hispanics. Just look at the headlines, check the statistics, get out of your house, and read the writing on the wall. It doesn’t make you racist to acknowledge reality every now and again.

          • He’s specifically claiming that the man featured in this article beat the other man to death because he’s black. That’s not just a matter of correlation; that’s a matter of causation. A couple articles emphasizing the correlation between African-Americans and violent crime do absolutely nothing to support his argument. You’re arguing an entirely different point from what he was.

          • Chris Granzow XI

            No, he’s saying that the majority of perpetrators in these incidents are black. The victims are mostly white and sometimes asian (like the guy who was attacked by the bikers in manhattan). If you keep up with these events, you’ll see that what he’s saying is true.

          • Fracist

            That piece of shit Chris and I had an argument on another site, he was talking mad shit about Asians. This fucker has issues with everyone non-white. He proved my point a few months ago when I said he was obsessed with race. I see this asshole again and what is he talking about? Race.

        • mr.wiener

          “We are facing an epidemic of black lynch mobs”
          You got stats to back that up cracker,or did you just pull that out of your arse?

        • mr.wiener

          ALL black people do this right? They can’t help it, it is genetic?

        • bprichard

          Hahahahahaha, the knockout game! How’s Fox News treating you?

        • Paul Schoe

          Too bad that we can’t see the number of down-votes anymore and happy with the replies to Stone’s racist remarks.

          Using his type of ‘evidence’ you can ‘proof’ the same statement about almost every group of people: white, black, American, Asian, female, male, kids, middle aged.

        • Fracist

          What does the people who did the knockout game(about 10 people) have to do with that guy? And sorry to disappoint you, but the whites in the UK made that game and I think it was more extreme. You’re a typical media sheep.

    • MonkeyMouth

      shit, man…. dont think of it like that. try this on:…..try to step back and realize that racism is 100% socially engineered and perpetuated by every culture. if you dont see my point, take yet another step back. the truth is there…. racism doesnt not exist unless someone in charge is playing the race card, etc etc. the powers at be love us to hate each other. they have many tools at their disposal to propagate hate, even when they say they are trying to help race relations. for example, think of what george carlin and frank zappa said…”words are just words, nothing else’ (paraphrasing, of course). you calling me a cracker-ass-cracker and me calling you nigger have NO teeth, and should NOT have teeth. all we are doing when we use ‘hate speech’ is being the puppets to the true masters. we are ALL fucking slaves, and the only enemies are our governments and these hypocrites that make racism while trying to quash it. true DAT

    • Barack Obama

      Thank you for accepting the truth and see things for what they really are, instead of choosing to live a lie. You are a valuable asset to your race.

      • And you are a worthless embarrassment to yours.

        • Barack Obama

          and you are a stupid ugly piece of shit.

          • Thanks. I lift.

          • Getting a little emotional are we? Your use of ad hominems means I win the argument.

          • Barack Obama

            There was no argument here idiot.

          • The argument was that you are a worthless embarrassment to your race. It still stands.

    • SapientAtomicStructure

      Such is life for a black man at the right tail of the IQ bell curve.

      Just remember that you control your own life and although their actions stain you by association no one will hate you as an individual so long as you are peaceful and productive.

      Hopefully some form of eugenics will eventually solve these threats and problems. The Chinese are already working on genetically engineering babies for higher IQs. When controlling for IQ most or all of the black deficits disappear by the way. (black man with IQ of 120 is pretty much equal in behavior to a white man of IQ 120)

      • 내가 제일 잘나가

        “black man at the right tail of the IQ bell curve”

        LOOL you make it sound like you’re a special snowflake haha

    • Fracist

      Bro, I feel you. But at the end of the day, you are an individual. Don’t let people put you in a box. I know that there are many great blacks out there…shit I personally know some, my best friend of 16 years he’s like my brother. And you seem cool too.

    • SuperHappyCow

      You’re an idiot. I’m sorry. That you think this kind of thing is common means you, yourself have an inferiority issue. Don’t drag me into it, and what this dumb motherfucker did.

      Crime and IQ statistic have absolutely nothing to do with black culture, and everything to do with rampant lead poisoning in industrialized nations.

      Go feel sorry for yourself somewhere else, and don’t share you pathetic ideas.

      • Nilerafter24

        It’s healthy that you call me out on what you perceive as bullshit. I’ll grant you a response because I totally get your comment.
        You seem to think that I came to my conclusion lightly. You think I haven’t been you at one point in time?
        What I wrote may reek of inferiority but it couldn’t be further from. Rather it’s an understanding of a dire situation.
        I could go on for the next twenty paragraphs explaining why I now hold such an extreme view of my own race but that would be futile because you already seem to have made up your mind, haven’t you?
        I would really have liked to engage you despite you insulting me but that lead poisoning theory is just so out there I don’t even know where to begin.
        I’m actually kind of glad you did call me out. I do tend to become a bit pessimistic in my worldview of things but I also hope you can read more on genetics and race with an open mind and come back with a more rounded argument.

  • Germandude

    Obvious problem here: New York’s tough gun laws. Everybody knows this wouldn’t have happened if everybody would be allowed to carry a gun.
    /irony off

    Kids like that perpetrator have to be taken off the street. And a significant amount of governmental money should be invested in education to show these kind of people a brighter path of life early enough so that they don’t fall through to the bottom of society.
    /retarded republicans will blame me for being a socialist

    Regardless of that: RIP to the old man. What a screwed up way to leave life…

    • YourSupremeCommander

      The chances of a frail and old Chinese immigrant carrying a gun walking down the street is……… next to ZERO.

    • Alex Dương

      I support right-to-carry laws in the U.S. No, New York’s gun laws are not to blame for this tragedy. But New York’s strict gun laws didn’t save this man either.

      • Germandude

        You are right that the strict gun laws didn’t save this man either. Hopefully you’ll recognize that the system of implementing fear into society, the lack of education, support for the weak and the general positive portrayal of crimes/being a gangster/violence and all that play a more signifcant role in this than one guy being black and the other one a non-english speaking Chinese immigrant.

        • Alex Dương

          Um, I never said or even suggested that the races of the victim / alleged perpetrator were significant in this tragedy. I simply did not agree with you that New York’s gun laws were relevant here.

          I also disagree with your prescription. Spending taxpayer dollars is not the answer to this. D.C. schools, for example, rank at the top for spending per pupil, yet their performance on standardized tests is abysmal.

          • Germandude

            I didn’t suggest you did throw in races. But we both know too well which side is meant.

            Spending taxpayer dollars to answer this is wrong in your eyes. Fair enough. I think spending tax payers money on US soldiers abroad is not a solution for safety of the US, but it’s a major cause of terrorism.

            All that money could better be spent in education and giving those at the bottom of society the aid they need to live a decent life and to show them the path of earning a decent living.
            However, this pretty much contradicts how the US system is working and those benefitting from it are calling the shots.

          • Alex Dương

            Oh, I strongly disagree with U.S. interventionism. I was against the invasion and war in Iraq, and I opposed intervening in Libya, Syria, and Ukraine.

          • Germandude

            Good, didn’t want to suggest otherwise. I just think it plays a significant role in brainwashing the masses in the US to keep the current system running. Cheers.

      • FYIADragoon

        A gun isn’t going to do shit when you’re ambushed. Home defense is the only situation where you’ll see a gun save you. That’s it. In an ambush you’re more likely to have the gun taken from you, escalating the situation. If you want to be prepared against an ambush like this one, learn a grappling art such as Judo or Sambo.

        • Alex Dương

          If I were ambushed, I would try to run first. Grappling is useful, but it isn’t a substitute for having a firearm.

          • FYIADragoon

            If you were ambushed you wouldn’t be able to run.

          • Alex Dương

            No, that’s if I were cornered.

          • Rick in China
          • Alex Dương

            Probably, but I think it’d be because I’d never leave my apartment xD

          • KamikaziPilot

            That just looks really creepy, but you’re right, people will probably leave you alone if they see you like that.

    • random commentor 1

      Gun laws only work if your are rich enough to afford the gun, the license, and if you are not being profiled and considered dangerous before you have it. Also, most people are not going to rational in an emergency adding a weapon to the mix is often going to make the situation worse.

      • Germandude

        Hm, I don’t really agree. Gun laws mean nothing, because let’s be honest, a pistol on the black market in the US, as well as in Europe, is cheap enough for the poor guys to afford. No profiling needed.

        However, the reason why you hear so much about gun violence about black guys is the set up of society which is based on racism and pushing young boys to stereotypes like: “Nigga, learn how to drop a basketball through the ring or you gotta do whatever it takes to make some spare money”. The same people that are voting against socialised welfare, schooling etc because of an attitude of “Why should I pay for lazy asses like those in the Bronx”, are the ones that later on think being armed protects them. The same guys will go to church on sundays playing the “good Christian who loves his brothers”, talking about “those fucking gangsters” at the shooting range.

        Now I am not saying that Europe doesn’t have problems with criminals, immigrants from the middle east, or that I think taxation is too high. But when given the choice on which continent to pay my taxes, raise my kids in peace and live a pretty safe and stable life without worrying about my neigbhors; well, I would pick Europe any day of the week without hesitation above any other place on earth.

        • RagnarDanneskjold

          The homicide rates between Europe and white areas in the United States are the same. Actually, the U.S. is slightly better for your physical safety because gun ownership deters criminals from doing things like home invasions. They’d rather be safer and break into empty houses. Crime rates are also lower in ethnically Asian areas, just as they are lower in Asia. If you were really concerned about safety you’d move to East Asia or an area with high East Asian immigration. Murder rates are higher in black areas, just as they are higher in Africa.

          • Germandude

            The homicide rates between Europe and white areas in the United States are the same

            Oh are they? You are cherry-picking right there. You are comparing homicide rates of WHITE areas in the US with the homicide rates of WHOLE Europe.

            See where the problem lays?

            In fact, let’s get away from races and make it income levels. In the US, being white or asian immigrant usually means you are on the brighter side of life. Compare their income levels with the Mexican immigrants or black ghetto kids and you might notice a corelation between wealth and crime.

            The same thing I could do for Europe now. While the general homicide rate is about 1/5th of that of the US (UNODC study)


            you can also state that poor immigrants in Europe are more likely to commit crimes (it doesn’t take an Einstein to figure why).

            And arguing that you are safer at your home because you are armed is challenging intelligence. Because the perpetrator most likely will be armed too.

            Meanwhile in Europe: Break into my house, steal everything for me, I don’t give a shit. You know why? I am insured such as any other person. Even the perpetrator knows that breaking into a house is a crime and he will be punished if caught. However, even he realizes that shooting me while he’s stealing my stuff is not worth it because then he would be in deep shit too.
            Again: Educate the mob.

          • RagnarDanneskjold

            I’m not cherry picking. If you compare by race it is similar. Among the poorest areas in America in the 1960s was Chinatown in San Francisco. It also had the lowest crime rate in America. White crime rates in the American South are higher than white crime rates from the Yankees in New England, and this difference existed before the immigrants even landed in America; it was a cultural difference in England as well. Crime is more culturally influenced, not so much by income, though there is some effect.

            You miss my point on the home invasion. The criminal in America is far more likely to wait until you are gone to break into your home because he knows you could be armed. In the UK, as an example, the rate of home invasion (a break-in while you are at home) is much higher because the criminals do not fear an armed occupant. Property crime is much higher in the United States because criminals shift into crimes that avoid confronting potentially armed victims. It’s all in data published by various governments.

          • Zappa Frank

            if you open the link german posted you’ll notice no relevant difference between Europe and east Asia about homicide rate.. besides as said many homicides in Europe happen inside immigrants communities, among them also the Chinese one..

          • Germandude

            You miss my point on the home invasion. The criminal in America is far more likely to wait until you are gone to break into your home because he knows you could be armed.

            Ah, yes. What’s your point?

            Since you were suggesting that official data would back up your thesis that

            Actually, the U.S. is slightly better for your physical safety because gun ownership deters criminals from doing things like home invasions.

            Amount of US households: 117,538,000

            Amount of GER households: 40,076,000

            Amount of household burglaries US: 3,700,000 (average 2003-2007)

            Amount of household burglaries GER: 144,117 (based on 2012, sorry, source in German)

            Chance of your household being broken into

            In the US: 3.1%

            In GER: 0.36%

            GER should definitly allow everybody to become a gun maniac. For our own safety. LOL


            List of households in different countries


            U.S. Department of Justice
            Victimization During Household Burglary


            GER burglary statistics 2012 (in German language)

          • Zappa Frank

            yeah, maybe including east Europe…west Europe is defenitly by far more safe that any place in usa..

          • ex-expat

            That’s really not true. There are states in the US that have a lower intentional homicide rate than some European countries. In addition, there are many countries in Europe that have higher rates of rape, assault, robbery, etc. than the US as a whole.

          • Zappa Frank

            please don’t tell me again about Sweden’s rapes.
            if the European country you are talking about are eastern European maybe.. western Europe I doubt.

          • ex-expat

            Haha, according to the study, Sweden yes is higher for rape, but aside from that:


            In addition, for example, certain states have a very low murder rate per 100,000 people. The comparisons and the data are not perfect, of course, but the point is that it is not entirely how you make it out to be:



          • Zappa Frank

            I have a lot of doubts about those statistics, Belgium and Denmark as first for robbery and bulgary? I frankly think are probably the safest country in the world. I cannot deny statistics with personal experiences, but really it is not simply strange, it is abnormal… I think any European would confirm it. If statistic would be reliable I think other European country would come first, but really Belgium and Denmark as first in the world for robbery and burglary (10 times more than in USA) makes no sense.

          • ex-expat

            I also thought it was interesting. But truly, it was a European organization that conducted the study, and they are affiliated with the UN. I have also seen studies by different organizations with very similar results.

          • Mihel

            I’d wager Naples or Rome have more robbery and burglary than the whole BeNeLux and Denmark combined.

          • Zappa Frank

            exactly, if it was Italy first in Europe I may be disappointed, but would make sense…

          • donscarletti

            Generally speaking, crimes are classified differently based on juristiction and frequency varies based on willingness to report. Robbery / Burglary, Assault / Battery, Sexual Assault / Rape, it’s all quite a matter of classification.

            There is one and only one statistic that can be reliably compared between juristictions and that is “Intentional Homocide”, because its hard to argue whether someone is dead or not.

          • Paulos

            In cases like this I actually think you should refute crime statistics with common sense and personal experience. Every country has different reporting standards, so comparing the raw data doesn’t really tell you anything. Like you said, there’s no way that Denmark is the burglary capital of Europe. In all likelihood, the higher number of reported burglaries reflect a more professional police force that doesn’t juke stats or brush cases under the rug.

            As far as public safety in Europe and the US, I’d say that New England, the Rocky Mountain Region and Pacific Northwest all compare well to Western Europe. The Rust Belt, Appalachia and Southwest Border Region are probably closer to Eastern Europe with the rest of the country falling somewhere in-between.

          • donscarletti

            Ah yes, being raped in Sweeden, like: “found out later he was actually banging some other chick on the side after he said he would use a condom but didn’t”.

            That said, Assange is a pussy for not facing trial. Even if worst comes to worst, I can’t imagine being locked in a Sweedish prison is much worse than being locked in an embassy.

          • Zappa Frank

            Assange is afraid to be deported in USA…

        • Irvin

          50cent got a gun when he was 13 or something. He said “I didn’t know why I needed a gun, but I got one anyway”.

        • random commentor 1

          Agreed because most of the time you see where you taxes are going and how the benefit you.

    • KamikaziPilot

      I can imagine all the American internet tough guys are saying about this. Probably things like: “If he tried that on me I’d put a bullet between his eyes”, or “If he had been carrying we’d be reading about a dead thug instead of a murder case”.

      Agree with the education part, opportunities for a better life need to be provided more so than incarceration for crimes already committed. Also disadvantaged people have to change their mindset and try to help themselves instead of give up on life and act like this.

  • Paulos

    The suspect was caught last week:

    My 2¢:

    A heinous crime to be sure, but I think this blogger/journalist is taking too much creative license with the story. The assault took place in under five seconds with only one pedestrian nearby as it was taking place, yet the tone of the article suggests it was a public spectacle with dozens of onlookers watching apathetically as an elderly man was slowly beaten to death. It’s disappointing. I’m sure America has more than enough problems to report on that don’t require dramatization.

    • satuon

      Yes, that’s what I thought, too. Also, it was 6 minutes until someone helped? That’s not too much, especially at night. Depending on the street, in 6 minutes how many people would have passed?

      To tell you the truth, I probably wouldn’t get involved, too, at least while the thug was still there. Besides, I wouldn’t even be sure if by trying to ‘help’ the man I wouldn’t injure him more. I’d just call an ambulance.

    • Zappa Frank

      in my opinion this one unlikely can be a hate crime..(kind of crime that I personally do not understand… if there is no racial motivation a murder is less important?)…but who knows.

      • MeiDaxia

        They could only prove it a hate crime if there was a witness or if the guy himself admitted to making a derogatory statement directed at Ruan’s race before bashing him to death. That, or they would have to prove he showed previous action against Asian/Chinese people that would imply this was racially motivated. As I see it, going for a hate crime based on evidence provided would be foolish, and you might get hearsay at best.

        • Jahar

          even making a derogatory statement would hardly prove it’s a hate crime.

      • Paulos

        I know what you mean. Based solely on the video it didn’t seem like a hate crime to me either, but like you said, who knows what the jury will decide after it’s all said and done.

      • KStyleBlue

        Yea, the reason for this could be anything.
        It could be a gang initiation. There is a gang in the town next to me that requires all recruits to murder a random person on the streets to join the gang.
        Or it could even be the knockout game. Where you punch a random person on the street and try to knock him out.
        Or maybe this guy is psychotic and suddenly wanted to kill a person.

        With the evidence at hand, who knows?

    • ex-expat

      And how do they know nobody called the police? How else would the police have arrived in six minutes?

  • vonskippy

    Worked in a Country for 15 years and couldn’t speak the native language? W…..T……F is wrong with him. Took me one summer to learn English, he had 15 years? Obviously he had no interest in becoming American, he just wanted the money that America would pay. Two words “HELP ME” and the outcome of this event might have been very different.

    • Alex Dương

      1. The fuck is your problem? The guy died for no reason; show some basic respect instead of making this a pseudo-tirade against welfare immigration.

      2. Ever heard of the bystander effect?

      • YourSupremeCommander

        He invented it, that’s what they do at their household.

    • donscarletti

      Go to an expat bar in Shanghai sometime.

      But seriously, it might be because the guy was already 53 when he came to America. I bet you were somewhat younger than that when you learned English in a single summer. Learning a second language (L2) gets progressively harder as it goes on.

    • KamikaziPilot

      You have a point about not learning English after 15 years in the country but tell me, when you learned English were you a middle aged Asian immigrant with zero exposure to English? Much harder to learn at that age and especially if your first language is an Asian language as compared to a European language. While I don’t approve of the lifestyle of many Asian immigrants (insulating themselves, not learning the language, passive), sympathy should be shown to the victim as he did nothing to deserve this attack.

      • Zappa Frank

        According to the article posted above, on the nydaily, even his daughters cannot speak English since they needed a translator from Cantonese to release some declarations.

        • KamikaziPilot

          I think both the daughters and the father should make an honest attempt to learn English. The daughters maybe more so since they’re younger, and therefore will live longer than the father in their new country. Basically I think everyone who immigrates to a new country should learn it’s language. Realistically, it’ll help them in their daily lives, and also it’s a sign of respect too, as expecting everyone to speak to you in your foreign (to them) language is kind of arrogant. English speakers can get away with not learning a second language more than others but really everyone who immigrates should learn their new country’s language.

    • YourSupremeCommander

      Hey asshole, first, learn some basic reading and math skills. The guy lived in the USA for 19 years.

      Secondly, try learning a second language that’s drastically different from your own when you are close to 50 years old. Try it and see how that will work out for you. And you know what, on top of it, the guy probably spent 12+ hours a day in the sweatshop. Do you think he has the luxury of time and money sitting at a Starbucks listening to Rosetta Stone all day long for 19 years?

      G T F O H.

      • DavidisDawei

        You raise a very good point…
        that reminds us how lucky we are.

        I suspect most people today don’t remember or even knew their great-grandparents, maybe even their grandparents, so they have “forgotten” the sacrifices that were made by their families.

        The USA may be famous for welcoming immigrants, but it is a tough world, so it is not surprising that Chinatown and Little Italy sprouted up in cities.

        Immigrants to the USA would work long hours in very difficult conditions. These folks worked themselves to the bone, in essence sacrificing themselves, so that their family/children would have better lives who would assimilate.

        • YourSupremeCommander

          That’s how I was raised, my parents did exactly that to give me the very little that they were able to give me. So to see that smart-ass remark by some punk who had zero clue totally pisses me off.

          • Irvin

            Working in a restaurant from 6am to 12pm, taken advantage by the boss because he knows they can’t do shit because they don’t speak english make worst it was their childhood friend from china.

            My parents been through the same shit and it really doesn’t give them much time to learn english if they didn’t came out of the restaurant situation in the end.

            People just don’t know how hard a life immigrants lead and think they can leisurely stroll the park while listening to linguaphone.

    • A Gawd Dang Mongolian

      It’s New York. Screams for help are drowned out with the rest of the background noise.

      • mr.wiener

        In New York screams for help are drowned out by the other screams for help.

        • A Gawd Dang Mongolian

          That’s Central Park at night.

    • wnsk

      What nonsense. I’m sure if he screamed, “HELP ME” in Mandarin, people would have understood his intent perfectly well. Point is, he was too badly injured to even make a sound. And the passersby who saw didn’t seem particularly helpful.

    • Pharenheit

      Get a clue dipshit before you shoot your mouth like an assmonkey.
      He was 53 when he got to the US and most likely started working in that garment factory immediately in order to survive and support his family. The callousness of your comment is a disgrace.

      • vonskippy

        So you’re saying middle aged (i.e. 53) Chinese people are too stupid to learn a few hundred words of English? At what age do you recommend people stop living abroad if that’s a known problem?

        • DavidisDawei

          I understand your point, and if he really was unable to communicate, your argument might be valid, but suspect you’re going to get crucified in this forum…
          He apparently didn’t have a Need to learn English.

          His family probably had a division of labor and his wife or daughters handled anything that required English.

          Maybe learning English and seeing Montana were on his bucket list?

          • mr.wiener

            I’d do Montana first.

        • Pharenheit

          No I’m saying the guy was brutally beaten to death for no reason walking home from dropping his granddaughter home and you see it as an opportunity to come on this board and rant about his inability to speak english as if it was somehow the reason why the outcome wasn’t more favorable? Seriously?

          • vonskippy

            Were you there? Do you know exactly how the altercation came about? Often muggings turn brutal when the mugger says “Give me all your cash” and the victum doesn’t comply. Maybe the old man didn’t follow instructions because HE COULDN’T SPEAK ENGLISH AFTER LIVING IN AMERICA FOR 15+ YEARS and the mugger (maybe a desperate junkie) got upset and beat the victim. Is it right/fair/just – of course not – but I can’t imagine ANY EXCUSE for not learning the native language after so much time. It’s all speculation, and at no time have I said the old man deserved to be beaten or killed – I’ve only comments on how incredible it is that someone can live in a country for all that time and NOT learn the freaking language. I’ve lived in half a dozen countries, and can speak, read, and write most of those languages (not like a native born, but enough to interact with those societies).

          • Pharenheit

            Good for you do you want a medal or something? You lived in so many countries and seemingly seen so much yet you are still incapable of empathy or seeing the myriad of scenarios that might bring someone from his native country to a foreign one. You really must be very simple minded.

        • Pharenheit

          You obviously have some pent up axe to grind with immigrants, perhaps it stems from some kind of self hate you feel and unwillingness to be identified as an immigrant yourself or be somehow associated with them cause they embarrass you.

  • lacompacida

    I am one hundred percent sure that this kind of things doesn’t happen in China, ever.

  • Sean Van Cura


    • YourSupremeCommander

      Black Ghost

  • whuddyasack

    There are a lot of human scum in America. When I first came, I was once taking a stroll by myself around Fisherman’s Wharf when suddenly a white homeless person charged up to me and made a very unfriendly gesture and menacing expression. I didn’t understand what he wanted.

    There is scum everywhere, but public safety in America honestly is worse than in mainland China. In mainland China, you can go for a stroll at night in big cities without problems but here, especially in places like New York City or Chicago, it’s best not to go for a walk alone at night.

    I brought up this article slightly earlier in response to a certain someone and ironically enough, it has now become a featured article on Chinasmack. I think this quote alone perfectly debunks that someone’s pigheaded claim that “no one hassles Asians in America”. In reality, they (Chinese especially) are seen as the softest and easiest targets the world over because they’re smaller and don’t speak the native language. Lesson for the day, being humble and having a listening ear goes a long way. When it comes down to it, ALL East Asian countries are much safer and have a lower violent crime rate than Western ones. Personally, my view of homeless stoners is one of disgust. I see these people hanging out in Canadian/Australian chinatowns or similar places with a high population of Asians harassing them demanding change as if they deserve it. They’re often accompanied with a foul odor.

    As for the article itself, it’s tragic that such unprovoked violence has happened and what’s even more disturbing is the bystander affect we see here. It reminds me of Kim Pham’s death, another tragedy. It would be truly low of someone to even think of finding an excuse or defense for this sort of behavior.

    R.I.P. Ruan, and my condolences to his family and friends and the Chinese American community in NY.

    Alex Dương and all the other Chinese/Asian Americans that I might’ve offended with my own views, I owe you an apology. There’s always an extreme urge for me to defend the Asian diaspora community and Asians in general because it’s one that I cherish and always will. When something happens to Asian Americans, I feel it too and that’s why my reactions can seem extreme.

    A white uncle [older man] who worked at an inn nearby ran over and yelled at the homeless man, saying something like: fuck off, next time I
    will kill you, son of a bitch, fuck you. After the homeless man was sent running, the white uncle told me that I have to be bolder when encountering this kind of scum, that if I appear scared, they will be bolder.

    • ElectricTurtle

      You need to be a lot more careful about absolutes. Thailand has more violent crime than a fair number of Western countries, and when you’re lumping Western countries together that includes places like Iceland that has no murders at all in a given year and low rates of assault. It’s kind of hard to beat “zero”. Generally there is less violent crime in East Asia than the West, but it’s definitely not true of every country in either bloc.

  • WFH

    one can only hope the perp gets hit by a car and is paralyzed in a ditch for a week before anyone finds him dead and half eaten by rats.

    • ptptp

      He’s been arrested and is in jail awaiting trial. I hope he spends the rest of his life in jail.

      • WFH

        he’ll get off on some stupid technicality…better he dies of anal ruptures in jail

  • Mighty曹

    Cowardly acts like this infuriates me. Just a few days ago there was a conviction here for an assault of a robbery victim who was kicked in the face as she tried to get up from the ground. The people nearby who did not go to her aide also infuriates me no less. (If you look at the upper right portion of the video you’d see one turd who actually turned to look and just stood there).

    As for this video here, it does appear that the first passerby at 7:43 did stop, made a U-turn and paused to take a closer look, then seemed to have taken out his cell phone to make a phone call. That would be consistent with the time the police first appeared about 7 minutes later at 7:49. It was not a crime in progress so the time to dispatch the police to the scene was not a top priority.

    • whuddyasack

      Wow, that was horrible to watch. Yeah, if there’s one thing I can’t stand, it’s cowards. Those who think it is perfectly OK to pick on the elderly, women, children or smaller people in general knowing they have the advantage. Bystander affect again… I’m starting to see this a lot now, same thing happened to Kim Pham. This was a while ago, but videos like this infuriate me. By the way, the chickenhearted bully got away with a tap on the wrist. Justice system in Canada can be so fucked up sometimes, excuse my French.

      • Mighty曹

        All that video evidence was not enough to send him to jail long term???
        No need to be excused for bad French as you’re not from Quebec :D

        • whuddyasack

          Unfortunately and sadly no. Brute walks free… sigh.

          No need to be excused for bad French as you’re not from Quebec :D

          Ohmigosh. You remembered hahaha. That cracked me up in a positive way. XD

          • Mighty曹

            Isn’t there an equivalent of a Chinese for Affirmative Action in Canada to stage a protest over this injustice?
            Hahaha… yeah, I remember we got our BC connection!

          • whuddyasack

            Sorry for the confusion. The victim was Filipina and what happened to her was outrageous.

            Unfortunately we have no such association in Canada. Most of the Chinese associations are for businesses. There’s the ACA, but it doesn’t have the same leverage as the Asian Pacific American Advocates. That’s the one thing about America, the Asian American community is actually quite well connected and mobilized compared to in Canada and Australia. You guys are very much admired, like heroes and role models to the rest of us. Better set a good example, kidding haha. But yeah, I came to know a lot about Asian/Chinese American movements from certain friends. If you read my posts to others, I often mention these online friends where I get information from.

            Hahaha… yeah, I remember we got our BC connection!

            Yes, my brother. BC connection, BC for Brother Cao, brothers since forever hahaha.

  • holy a black chengguan

  • Angry_African_man

    What happened is unfortunate, I feel sorry for the family of the deceased. He was such a good parent and it’s a shame that one act of random violence be a cause of his death.
    I hope that the culprit will be brought to justice soon.

  • Ralph Wiggim

    That’s not a safe part on NYC at all. Even cops don’t walk alone there. It’s called Alphabet Land and is a ghetto.

    • Zappa Frank

      I went on vacation there on 2008, and in effect I had a bad impression about security. But it is still Manhanttan shouldn’t be safe?
      I even remember a great german pub there and Joe Strummer’s murals

  • chucky3176

    Wow America! Help the poor man you fuckers! Look at them pass by nonchalantly as if he’s some sack of garbage. Even the police are standing around there, without even attempting to help the gravely injured man. So much for the higher superior Western morality and culture. Next time some whiney expat in Asia preach to you how much they’re better and how bad your country is, just show them this video and tell them to shove it up their ass.

    • Alex Dương

      People are people. The bystander effect is pretty universal: the same thing could happen in Korea.

      • chucky3176

        Yes and you know what? If this had happened in Korea, where a foreigner is attacked like this, the expat blogs will light up with Christmas trees to say how mean and bad Korean culture and Korean society and it’s people are.

        • Alex Dương

          They probably would. Like I said, people are people. I always roll my eyes whenever I read comments from expats extolling how superior they are. Sometimes, the delusion is just sad. About a week ago, some British guy here thought I was a Chinese citizen and tried to show off his “wealth,” which meant that he took a photo of incomplete indoor plumbing in his home. I shit you not.

        • Sillian

          That’s true. The hypocrisy.

        • Zappa Frank

          isn’t the same you are doing now?

      • tomoe723

        The big difference is that American police are notorious for putting anyone in jail regardless of context. If this incident got rowdier and someone “nobly” calls police, expect a paddy wagon sooner or later and even that old chinese guy will think he’s better off being mugged than put in a county jail.

        • Alex Dương

          I think you’ve been watching too many wuxia movies. Realistically, how could this get “rowdier”? We’re talking about a frail 68-year-old guy versus a fit 20-year-old guy.

        • KamikaziPilot

          Notorious compared to who else? Vietnam, Russia, China, Canada? How would police in those countries deal with the situation you’re describing?

          • tomoe723

            In most of Asia, the issue is handled where it happened. If the parties cannot resolve it then they will all be asked to come down to the precinct for further questioning. This usually deters any more conflict and let the crowd disperse because nobody wants to go the local police box.

            In Amurika, because of the prison industry and the “justice” system that only seeks to siphon more cash for its funding, everyone involved goes to jail. It’s especially bad for black people. I’ve seen it happen a number of times already.

      • harvz

        It happens all the time in Korea (nobody breaking up fights, not someone getting beat to death) He’s just having a vent session

    • FYIADragoon

      If you’re expecting friendliness in any major city, you’ve come to the wrong place. And this is coming from someone is from a major city.

    • DavidisDawei

      Homelessness is a big problem in the USA; omnipresent in larger cities.
      Walk through NYC and homeless people are everywhere. You stop noticing them. When they are asleep on the ground, most people are just happy they aren’t coming up and aggressively asking for money.

      I have seen men sleeping on sidewalks more times than I can count and couldn’t tell from this video if this man had noticeable signs of trauma, which is the only reason I would call 911 or check to see if he was OK.

  • wazxhk

    Leave out nations and colors of skin.I just want to figure out how people consider others’ lives these days.Put it in another way,what ways do people think they should treat others in?Countless miserable incidents have shown that more and more people just easily treat precious lives as shit“““`

  • mr.wiener

    I let this comment on so that others can marvel at its stupidity.

    • catmando1980

      But everything he said is true, as uncomfortable as that makes you. Blacks are de-evolving as a race, and everywhere they go, crime, trouble, chaos,decay, and mayhem follow them.

      • mr.wiener

        So black people are really in control (even though they are stupid) and the rest of the world are unable to combat this because we are liberal and gay?, and by inference we have lost the methods of control we had which were slavery and lynching?

        • catmando1980

          Maybe you want to keep your head firmly stuck in a hole in the ground, but look around in America: our cities are smoking ruins, filled with the sounds of police sirens and punctuated by gunshots. All our taxes go to paying for the various scams and pacification schemes to keep this plague on society somewhat satisfied-bridge cards, EBT cards, Section 8 housing, SSI programs-the list goes on and on, but still, they grow ever more violent. Take a look at the website “new nation news” if you want to see the scale of the problem-this isn’t an “isolated incident” as the news loves to say.

          • My city is not a smoking ruin, filled with the sounds of police sirens and punctuated by gunshots. Take a look out the window instead of submitting yourself to fear-mongering by some website pushing an agenda. If what you see outside the window sucks, then move. The USA is a massive region and it has many places that don’t suck.

          • catmando1980

            Yes, let’s just run from them, and ignore the problem.

          • I haven’t needed to run from anything, since all the cities I’ve lived in have been splendid. Even if where you live sucks, you should have the common sense to realize that the whole country is not necessarily like your local backyard. If you really don’t want to “run” from where you are and ignore the problem, consider actually doing something about it instead of ranting on the World Wide Web to people who don’t even live there.

          • Germandude

            You certainly want to vote Republican. You know, if you send 1,000,000 GIs abroad, not only do you make the US a more liked country globally and a safer place, no, you also get a 10% discount on military costs, since it won’t cost you 1 trillion bucks anymore, but only 1.9 trillion, which is not even double than the current 500k soldiers abroad.

            Besides that, make sure that medical care and schooling is exorbitant high and hardly affordable for those poor ghetto kids, because that will guarantee them dying out early and staying calm because they won’t complain about having no life and no future. Don’t ask why you face bankruptcy when you get cancer, because man, healthcare is too expensive, you didn’t make enough money, but those US soldiers and Halliburton and the like want to have their earnings.

            And don’t forget, soon it’s 4th of July, raise that stars sprankled banner, singing “land of the free”, but don’t complain being randomly checked on your trip to the fire works because “it’s for your own safety and to protect your personal freedom”.

            And be careful how you reply me, because as you know, NSA is watching you and me as well.

            haha, fuck you, insecure child

          • catmando1980

            Ha ha! you spent all that time coming up with all these stereotypes, when I fit NONE of them.

          • mr.wiener

            Well I went and took your advice and had a look at “new nation news” I won’t bother posting the link as it is longer than John Holmes whenever he stood to attention.
            The funny thing is that it is more or less the mirror [or negative] image of a site I once saw called “White watch”. Whitey did this, Cracker did that, all white women are cavewomen bitches [I kid you not].
            So thanks for that. I’ll continue being a “libatard” and you continue……doing what ever it is that you do.
            I wonder which of us will be happier?

          • DavidisDawei

            I agree these types of websites probably don’t help with the happiness quotient, but “happy” is a relative term.

            When I am in Asia, I visit some extremely poor and broken down places. There were only 3 times my “spidey senses” kicked in. Unfortunately, I cannot say that about the United States.

          • mr.wiener

            Oh, I think they make him feel happy. He has someone to blame, and look down on. As you said , happiness is relative.

          • catmando1980

            are all those news items on that site made up? all that site consists of is reports from newspapers, TV stations, etc all over the US. Even you must admit there is a problem. Do you seriously think that other races are attacking blacks with the same frequency? There is an ongoing war against White people in the US these days, and you ought to be aware of it. Like it or not, blacks are going to include Asians as “White”, and they are targets as much as we are.

          • mr.wiener

            And did you check “White watch”


            Oh wow! I just like proved the entire Caucasian race is degenerate and …um…stupid , yeah that’s right because I found a site with a bunch of articles that said so!…Cool! , game set and match me! I won an argument on the internet!!

            An exercise in futility don’t you think?

          • catmando1980

            Not even close to the savagery on NNNews.

          • mr.wiener

            Thanks for the tip. I’ll be sure to give it a wide berth.

          • DavidisDawei

            The stat that catches my attention is “approximately 50 million people on food stamps in the USA”.
            When this many people can’t buy food, you know there is a major problem and something is broken.

        • ElectricTurtle

          Because they’re jealous of how hung black guys are.

          BTW, for the random racists in the thread, while I’m white myself, my wife is black and she’s a few months away from finishing her masters degree in engineering and technology management. Her dad has a PhD in computer science and has been an engineer for Boeing for several decades. Her sister is finishing her PhD in linguistics. They’re highly educated, successful, law-abiding, tax-paying citizens a category above most white people in many dimensions.

          • catmando1980

            And they are outliers to the norm,too.

          • ElectricTurtle

            It’s called a bell curve. Humanity has a few retards, a few geniuses, and ton of people in the middle, and any reasonably large subset of humanity mimics the overarching trend. Exceptional success and failure is always marginal no matter what race you’re talking about.

        • Germandude

          Penis-envy. Catmando doesn’t pack a lot of meat and usually is the one that picks up the soap.

          Online, he’s compensating for his complexes. Give him some space.

          • catmando1980

            Yes, that must be it. Anyone who is shocked and disgusted at the state of this nation and the plague of crime sweeping it MUST be only thinking about their dick. Uh huh.

          • ElectricTurtle

            And plague of crime my ass. Violent crime has been going down for half a century. So it must necessarily be about dicks, because on a nationwide scale crime is only an issue to the delusional. The pockets that do exist are mostly due to head-in-the-sand policies against self-defense that embolden criminals.

    • Germandude

      Wow, just saw this comment and even I am speechless to think of how to grade his post.

      Ignorance and stupidity truely must be a blizz. Olrik’s life must be very colorful and rich of enjoyment…

  • Fernando

    Here’s the low-life scumbag with his puppy face…so ridiculous! Stuff like this is happening everywhere nowadays….why are we letting these kind of stupid people breed in the first place?? Shouldn’t we all have some type of high-level education before we are allowed by law to become parents??!! not to have such piece-of-sh*t children. Some of you may hate to admit it but really, also parents are to blame for creating such monsters who go around this world holding guns, rapping, beating innocent people, killing without remorse.

    • Zappa Frank

      as Russeau ( I think was Russeau) said the crime is a social problem. We can blame this guy, but are we sure in his shoes we would be that diffrerent? that better? Don’t get me wrong…there are many people that in his condition (or similar) do better, and the responsibility is always individual, but still the social situation, family situation, and so on.. prepare the condition for the crime. Stupid people do not necessary mean violent people. Reproduction is a human right.

    • slowpo

      The lawyer is probably saying to the judge. This is a good kid, he’s an insparin rapper loves basketball

      And the thug is probably thinking 3 things
      2.muh dik
      3.chicken wings

  • FYIADragoon

    I’m still annoyed that they ended stop and frisk. I’d take false alarms over the opposite, since the only inconvenience is losing a few minutes.

    And if the man was at this age with three “supposedly concerned” daughters, why the hell were they letting him walk around East Village at night when he can’t even speak English? Christ, the old man toiled away for you, give him some round trip cab fare at least. That thug will probably get off of this without the death sentence, that he deserves, because of the PC racial equality crap that seems to be going through the Northeast at the moment.

    And: “Worked in the USA for 15 years, but never learned any English.”

    It seems like the ESLs of China aren’t the only ones with an inability to learn a language.

    • KamikaziPilot

      Regarding the stop and frisk, maybe you’d take false alarms but what about all those blacks and hispanics that have to take false alarms due to nothing other than being a certain skin color. On the surface the only inconvenience is losing a few minutes but to the person detained, it can mean loss of dignity, resentment towards law enforcement, racism reinforced, and possible escalation of the situation. It probably has stopped some crimes from occurring but at what cost to the person just minding their business? The stop and frisk leaves too much room for abuse to occur IMO.

      Since this was his regular routine, I’d assume taking a cab everywhere would get expensive. I don’t know how dangerous this neighborhood is, but if he’s been doing it as a routine, I’d assume it can’t be that dangerous. Life’s a risk, this really could have happened anywhere. Everyone has a different assessment of risk and I’d think the daughters thought the risk of their father walking home at night wasn’t enough to stop him from doing it. Still I do think many immigrants don’t take street safety seriously. They think as long as they mind their own business nothing bad will happen to them. Self-defense preparations don’t really enter their thought process.

  • YourSupremeCommander

    Weiner, you let this comment go to show us his stupidity too right? New York is the capital of which country again?

    My IQ just got bought down by merely replying to that comment, SMH.

  • FYIADragoon

    It really does reflect a big problem with them, but I’d assume that this is also why they allow foreigners with no knowledge of Chinese to flood their cities.

    • Zappa Frank

      yes exactly, most Americans never care to learn any language but blame others for not learning English, at 50yo?

      • FYIADragoon

        Its not just Americans that have the language learning problem.

        • Zappa Frank

          sure, Chinese have problems, americans have problems, anyone have.. still most people care at least to learn another language than the native one… at least to be able to say something when abroad

          • wnsk

            It’s hard to imagine that this old man wouldn’t have at least picked up a few basic words; he very likely did, just not enough to be considered a proficient speaker of the language.

            I understand some Chinese dialects (Cantonese, Teochew)–enough to get the gist of what’s being said to me–but I can’t really speak those dialects. Maybe it’s the same with the old man, i.e. he had a basic understanding of spoken English, but can’t really be said to speak it himself. Anyway, we’re all just speculating. The NetEase article above just says “it has been reported” that he doesn’t speak English–but where’s the source, how true is that?

          • Zappa Frank

            the article of the ny daily said that daughters too do not speak English since they needed and interpreter for their declaration.
            Anyway I think the relevance of the his or their language level is almost zero here. I could say that in the same way there were till not long ago, or maybe there are still, some old Italians in NY that can speak just their dialect..

            my point here was that English speakers do not have to learn any other language to ‘survive’ and in many case do not learn any other language even if they travel a lot or live abroad… therefore I find curious to criticize an old man for this.

          • wnsk

            vonskippy may have a point when he said the thug could have been infuriated by the old man’s inability to speak English.

            personally i can’t imagine living and working in a country where i can’t even speak the language. then again, i’m not intending to work in a garment factory anytime soon.

          • Zappa Frank

            well the same thing happen also to most foreigners in china… living and working in a country where you cannot even speak the language.. it becomes like to live in a underworld. After a few time most lose every original will of integration and understanding.. now that you make me think about there are many similarities between Chinese communities and expat communities..

          • wnsk

            perhaps it’s a bit different with English speakers. English is perhaps the most widely spoken second language in the world. if you know English and you go to any country in the world, you sort of expect someone somewhere who knows some English.

            or maybe i’ve watched too much American movies, haha!

          • harvz

            Not Americans as much as native English speakers in general. They are a bit spoiled about English being the lingua franca. Take a look at British Expats in Spain.

  • Cody

    Very sad story. though it won’t bring Ryan back, I hope the Renhui family gets justice. :-(

  • KamikaziPilot

    I’ve always though of China as being safer with regard to violent crime but of course more dangerous for driving. Though not sure how accurate they are, China’s homicide rates are comparable to most of the developed world, with the exception of America. I believe it’s between 1 and 2 per 100,000 homicides rate/year. The US is currently at about 5 per 100,000 although it used as high as 10 in the 1980s. But really just answer this question: do you feel safer walking at night in the average Chinese big city or the average big city of your home country? I’d also like to hear from other posters who have lived in both China and another country. Where they feel safer walking the streets?

    • whuddyasack

      I think you are spot on when it comes to violent crimes, taking homicide rates, the likelihood of getting murdered is 5 times greater in the US than in China based on statistics.

      To be honest, whenever China’s low violent crime rates are brought up, someone will always fallaciously insist that China is a dangerous place. Nowadays, I just take it all with a grain of salt. The dead giveaway is right here:

      the nationalism that many time crosses into racism and violence (the attacks on the Japanese)

      To my knowledge, attacks on Japanese are very rare despite the high inflow of Japanese into the country and the ongoing animosity. I’ve heard of more Japanese and Chinese nationals being attacked and killed in Western countries than in Japan or China.

      I’d also like to hear from other posters who have lived in both China and another country.

      This is a very interesting question. I travel quite a bit. I haven’t lived in either but have visited both. Walking late at night in the US is far more daunting than in China. Even in Canada/Australia, I’ve found places with high concentrations of Asians the least intimidating. When I see groups of youths with bottles in hand, it just raises my alarm bells. I’ve felt safest walking in Tokyo, Singapore and HK and the fact that they are crowded with so many people nearby is always reassuring.

      As for people I know who’ve actually lived in both the US and China, they all say China is safer. Many had more favorable impressions prior to living in America though.

      • KamikaziPilot

        “Even in Canada/Australia, I’ve found places with high concentrations of Asians the least intimidating.”

        Kind of funny, but I feel the same. HK and NYC actually have about the same population (7 million) but for a recent year HK had 30 something murders while NYC (actually one of the safest big American cities statistically) had 500 something. That difference is pretty startling.

  • Zappa Frank

    I don’t see a better behavior in Russia, but it is full of whites men..

  • dag

    American-blacks live in a dysfunctional sub-culture in the US.
    Their leaders are corrupt, unprincipled, crude, and degenerate.
    Blacks admire illiterate professional athletes, thuggish rap and hip-hop entertainers, and attractive but stupid black women with big asses.
    Black culture in the US has beliefs similar to those of Boko Haram – contempt and disgust for white or Western education.
    As a result, many American-blacks are crude, violent, vulgar, and anti-social.
    They have no future.

  • ESL Ninja

    Reuters: Chinese woman won’t shut up. Slap needed.

  • MonkeyMouth

    is this a ‘knock-out game’…or a gang initiation? or just some bored thug?

  • MonkeyMouth

    my wife slapped me in Carrefour once…..

    • I Spy

      I saw that. You deserved it.

  • michael561

    In the South he’d get the death penalty.

    • mr.wiener

      …just for being black.
      Not that I have any sympathy for the dickhead.
      Don’t you have a pet shelter to picket?

      • michael561

        As a moderator you should make an effort to be less ignorant.

        • mr.wiener

          Ignorance is not against the rules around here, but not backing up the things you say will get you ridiculed.
          I’m not feeling particularly charitable today and I think your ideas on killing anyone we don’t like, everyone carrying guns and pet shelters being responsible for dog attacks adequately meet the definition of ignorant.

          I moderate here, which is kind of like cleaning the toilets. I also have opinions. If you don’t like my opinions feel free to try to change them with rational arguments.

          • michael561

            What makes you think I want to kill anyone? In the South he would get the death penalty. That’s a fact. And it wouldn’t be for being black. 2. Responsible gun ownership is a good thing. It prevents violent crime and saves people’s lives. 3. I have worked in kennels and shelters for many years growing up and handled thousands of dogs. They don’t all make good pets and the shelters do push this message of ‘breeders are bad’ and getting a shelter dog is ‘saving a life’ when most casual pet owners would be a million times better off with a non-bully-breed dog from a breeder. And the vast majority of dogs in shelters are unstable pit mixes. So be as charitable as you like. Or not. As you please. But when you make ignorant replies to my comments, as you have done now twice in a row, I will call you on it.

          • mr.wiener

            In reverse order:
            #3. When you first posted :shelters were responsible for dog attacks I had no idea you had any experience in them. So, my bad I apologies. I’d still be interested to know the recidivism attack rates of rescued dogs, and whether all shelters are alike in this regard.
            #2. Gun ownership we are going to have to agree to disagree on. After the Port Arthur massacre in Australia , the govt came down hard on gun ownership… and seems to have worked. Mind you we never had a big hand-gun culture in Oz, and the issue is more of a Gordian knot in the US.
            #1.I made an ass out of u and me when you posted on the death penalty in the south. I’ve been so busy deleting “all n*gers are animals” posts and following up IP numbers to see who is trolling under different names I automatically put you in with that lot. Jumping to conclusions is a poor form of exercise and I apologies for that.
            Are we good?

          • michael561

            We’re good. Sorry if I got hot. Thanks for moderating these sites. I really like ChinaSmack, KoreaBang, and JapanCrush. It’s awesome to have this window into the other side of the world.

  • Mihel

    One crime, two victims: the old man, and the reputation of the black community.

  • Brian

    The key word here is “African American.” We hate them too.

    • Alex Dương

      Who is “we”?

  • Foreign Devil

    Isn’t it interesting how this story is big in Chinese media. . meanwhile several Chinese people were beaten to death in Vietnam in protest over the Chinese oil rig but there is a big media blackout in China over that one. Lest anyone become critical of Chinese powerplays in asia.

    • Alex Dương

      Apparently these Chinese netizens were well aware of the recent anti-Chinese riots in Vietnam.

      Dunno where you got the idea that there was a “big media blackout” from.

    • Insomnicide

      Actual that’s because the Chinese government wants to suck up the to Vietnamese one and downplay the tensions between the country. China doesn’t allow anti-Vietnam protests, but Vietnam is okay with anti-China protests. Even letting a few ethnic Chinese get killed in the process.

  • ptptp

    I can.

  • Phil Ossiferz Stone

    Hood rat plays the knockout game, other hood rats fail to give a damn. News at 11:00.

  • Guest

    niggers will nig

    • mr.wiener

      @Barack Obama.
      You have officially made my shit list. You try any more trolling like this and you will face moderation.

  • 白色纯棉小裤裤

    The difference is in China the risk of being killed by random thugs is much lower.

  • blackgold

    I don’t know if my last comment made but I’m going to try again. I don’t like the way the writer of this story(FAUNA) wrote this with subtle racism words like “African youth” and “African-American THUG”. It perpetuates the “Black savage” stereotype image that has been used on us by white writers. I read this story in Chinadaily and they don’t say “African youth” etc. they say “This MAN attacked..etc.”
    Fauna grow up and stop being a racist with this kind of sneaky writing. Your being ignorant and your not being fair. You Chinese don’t like it when foreigners try to make you look bad.

    • mr.wiener

      Fauna just translates the article from the chinese site mate. If this article gets your back up…..well….you ain’t seen nothing yet.
      “You Chinese”!?….forsooth, gaze into a mirror some time guy.

      • blackgold

        No I’m not Chinese! of course not I’m a brotha. You think a Chinese person gives sh*t about this with all of those racist comments at the very top of this page in the Chinese section???

        • mr.wiener

          My point was saying “You Chinese” or “You Whites” or “You Black people” is probably the worst way to start a sentence. You have automatically lumped one group altogether with no regard for difference of opinion or culpability.
          EG. “You black people need to stop stop mugging old asian men”.
          Not nice when the shoe is on the other foot yeah?

          • blackgold

            shut the fuck up WIENER. You don’t know me.

          • mr.wiener

            Well I do know you hate it when people don’t agree with you.……and you have such an original sense of humor, you made a funny about my name! Tres witty

          • blackgold

            No I don’t “hate it” when people disagree with me again YOU DON’T KNOW ME. The Chinese are very racist towards blacks in China they have a history of it, and nooo its not because of incidences like this. Read that book “Race and Racism in the Chinas” by Dujon Johnson.

          • mr.wiener

            So if you don’t hate it, what is with the attitude sport? This is a story about some low life fool beating some old guy to death and then you come on and talk about how wacist the article is against black people.
            I call you on some of your own racial faux passe and you tell me to fuck off….Are you trying to get kicked off here to confirm your opinion that everyone is out to get you?
            You’re right, I don’t know you, but I think you ought to grow up a bit.

          • WFH

            uh-oh…here’s when he gets mad…

    • catmando1980

      What’s the problem? He IS a black savage.

    • Zappa Frank

      did you read the Chinese version?

    • “暴徒” means “thug”. “非裔暴徒” means “African thug”. If that offends you, take it up with NetEase. Fauna didn’t write the article; she just faithfully translated it. If you previously read this story on China Daily in English and it didn’t use the word “thug”, then consider yourself wiser to the disparity between how this incident was reported for the domestic and foreign audience. But don’t blame chinaSMACK or the translator.

    • FYIADragoon

      He is black, and he is a thug. I’m not sure where the racism you’re pointing at comes from. If anything, you should be pleased that he has been separated from the rest of African Americans with the label of thug. Because this son of a bitch certainly could shame an entire race.

  • asianjunk

    I believe manners or behaviors are not distinguished by nationality or skin color. But it does not surprises me the fact that he’s black. I don’t wanna sound racist, I mean, I was born and raised in Central America and instinctively I have developed a sort of an awarness when a black/blackish mulato dude/kid/women gets closed to me, because most of them are delinquents. They begin to kill and rob without having reaching puberty. Of course not all of them are like that. Not at all. It’s sad that an eldery man got beaten by a kid. It reminds me when my grandma was beaten almost to death, there was blood all over the floor, but she survived she was one hell of a strong lady almost reaching 80 that time she got beaten. She passed out in peace 12 years ago. R.I.P.

  • mr.wiener

    Well I’m glad you got that off you chest. As pointed out in you other posting [nearly identical] This is translated from an article in netEases, but I guess you just love a good opportunity to be offended hmm?
    Jumping to conclusions is a poor form of exercise.

  • Germandude

    Taxation levels in the US are peanuts compared to France, Germany, Spain, Netherlands, Italy, Denmark, Finland, Norway, Sweden, etc., but that’s not the point of discussion.

    I agree with you that the black communities in the US have a lot of work to do to change their image, especially black males in the very poor neighborhoods. Taking responsibilities for their kids and so on.

    However, racism towards blacks in the US is pretty much present and not a “strange daily exception”, no matter Obama or not.
    Ask the former LA Clippers owner. Or the white kid’s daddy, that prefers his son to attend a school with none, or a low number of black students.
    Daily life is full of racism, stereotypes and reservations.

  • filabusta

    Breaking news! A retaliation event was recorded by a local reporter by the name of the Fugees:

    Customer: Ey yo, Ey yo Chang Wang, what’s up

    Restaurant Guy: I’ll be right out. Right. Wait. One second. Okay, then. Fine. Your order

    Customer: Lemme get, um, lemme get two of them beef fried rices over there. Lemme get a half a chicken wing. Don’t put that little retarded leg in it —

    Restaurant Guy: — Right —

    Customer: — just cut that off. Don’t put no onion in my white rice

    Customer: Yo yo yo. I need four chicken wings fried hard

    Restaurant Guy: What’s this? Hold on? What’s this? The two of you? At once? Okay, then. You want beef

    Customer: No no no, we want beef to eat. We got no beef

    Customer: I want four chicken wings fried hard, nigga, what the fuck is you talking ’bout

    Restaurant Guy: All right. I’ll kick your monkey asses my fucking self

    Customer: Whoa whoa, what are you coming over the counter for?

    Restaurant Guy: You think I open a restaurant in the middle of the hood and don’t know what’s going on? I fucking represent

    Customer: I’ll fuck you the fuck up

    Restaurant Guy: I will avenge my brothers by representing and whooping your asses, word is bond

    Customer: This ain’t Channel 5, nigga, somebody gonna die

    Restaurant Guy: Okay, then. I will show you Flying Fist of Judah.

    Customer: You ain’t gonna show me shit

    Restaurant Guy: That’s right

    Customer: I’ll show you these nuts

    Restaurant Guy: You and you

    Customer: Straight from Mortal Kombat

    Restaurant Guy: You’re just talking. Obviously the two of you are just bitch-ass niggers

    Customer: Nigga, well then do something, you talking all your bullshit

    Customer: So what’s up, so what’s up?

    Restaurant Guy: All right. This is a Chinese restaurant, but like Burger King, have it your way.

    (Punching noises)

  • Wittie Indie

    So sad. Why would someone do this to another human being?

  • Kahlil Stultz

    Only four outwardly racist comments – and three of them acknowledged that not all black people are bad. China I’m so proud of you :’) This was what MLK must have dreamt.

    • catmando1980

      Bring them over here-they will change their opinions quickly.

    • Sydney

      Martin Luther King would be ashamed or embarrassed of today’s ghetto blacks.

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